Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

[kchughtai]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Regarding Teacher Abdul Qudoos murder, here is an excerpt from report submitted by Mr. Shahid Hameed Chaudhary, Magistrate Section-30,

“I have gone through the entire statements of the witnesses appeared before the undersigned and the respondents themselves and their witnesses and statements of the witnesses summoned by the undersigned. Admittedly, deceased Abdul Qadoos remained in police custody for more than 1 ½ months of investigation of case FIR No. 75/2012 without any entry in the record and without adopting any legal procedure because same has been admitted by Muzaffar Ali SI and even the same has not been denied by the respondents themselves and during the said period he was subjected to inhumane torture by the accused persons/police officials of case FIR No. 75/12 police station Chenab Nagar. Exertion of torture is quite evident from the final report submitted by District Standing Medical Board through Dr. Mushtaq Bashir District Medical Legal Officer (Member District Standing Medical Board).

…

It is also worth mentioning over here that Shujat Malhi Incharge investigation police station Chenab Nagar did not even once deny that deceased Abdul Qadoos did not remain in their custody. It is also worth mentioning over here that respondents have not denied keeping the deceased in illegal custody for such a long period of time and handing over the deceased to his family members in a serious condition, which resulted in the death of deceased, he was not provided any proper medical aid. It has also appeared on the record that Muhammad Khan constable, Muhammad Naeem constable and Amir Nazir constable were involved in the torture on the deceased, whereas Asif Hayat head constable and Amir Nazir constable have also been found in transporting the deceased from the police station Chenab Nagar to Chowki Jhanger Galoteran where deceased was subjected to inhumane torture.

https://www.persecutionofahmadis.org/police-torture-to-death-mr-abdul-qadoos-an-innocent-prominent-ahmadi-in-rabwah/

[psyah]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

^^^ Disagree. There was no condemnation of the killing - a murder which took place SPECIFICALLY because he was targetted as being an Ahmadi Muslim. Rather, obaid1982 simply suggested a conspiracy theory regarding a previous murder taking place, thus insinuating that the present case of Dr Mehdi is likely to be a result of the same and/or similar cause i.e. another Ahmadi Muslim did it. Why else talk about the fact that property is difficulty to obtain for non-Ahmadi Muslims?

The general tone of the post was unempathetic to what happened, but rather a 'suck it up and deal with it' attitude.

There is a lot that can be said without actually saying it.

Anyway, I for one am deeply saddened to hear of this latest case - particularly as Dr Mehdi was visiting in his capacity as a cardiologist, with the aim of helping people, and had to pay his life as a result of his sacrifices.

Peace nnabid

I can assure you that no one here is justifying the killing of an Ahmedi just because of his faith ... Look brother Bao Bihari has just corrected me - he is even aligned accepting a a possibility of an outside job, I thought no ... I can also say that for me personally if anyone was living under my protection and was killed I would blame myself personally and take it to heart for not providing adequate safety ... The sympathy is there with the family of the deceased ... But that sympathy does not necessarily extend to all Ahmedis because we don't sympathise with the whole world's Muslims when one of us is killed unjustly ... I guess we ought to have those sentiments ... But reality is we don't ... Neither should anyone be killed in cold blood nor should we pull out the victim card every time a killing happens ...

We should wait for the investigation and undertake our own before we react ...

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

@kchughtai

Ameen.

**Bao sahib, I don’t understand why quoted the incident that was not under discussion and talked about irrelevant stuff **and didn’t say a word about the fact that a useful HUMAN lost his life. Rabwa has high security because of its vulnerability and places like hospitals are soft targets. if attackers come disguised as patients seeking urgent attention who would frisk them. Anyways, a thorough and unbiased investigation is needed to find the real culprits. If it is an inside job then it is a golden opportunity for you as whole government machinery is on your side.

Actually, it is the known trait of our opponents to lie and make fraudulent claims just to malign Jammat-e-Ahmadiyya and act innocent. I will quote several examples here. The molvis are the defacto rulers of this country. Although, they don’t have significant vote bank but their influence on any ruler including military rulers is well-known. They
can go kill the governor and minister on the pretext of blasphemy and still culprits not get punished for the fear of backlash. They can put blame on anyone on religious grounds especially the groups like Ahmadis, Christians etc. and have their way. They can flare up idiots and burn houses in gojra, burn people alive. and still no significant action against them especially the instigators and you want me to believe that something gory is going on in Rabwa, killing people and all that and everything is calm and peaceful on your side. Give me a break!! enough of nonsense.

Here are some examples of deception on your part:

1. 1974 riots and subsequent declaring Ahmadis non-muslim were instigated by mullahs on the grounds of a single incident in Rabwa. Exaggerated gory pictures were painted to turn common people against us. It was allegged that ears and noses of our opponents were severed. This was proven false afterwards.

2. Maulana Aslam Qureshi. remember this guy? who was alledgedly murdered by the leadership of our Jammat. even bloodsatined clothes were produced. Later, the same guy appeared from nowhere unharmed and said he was on some jihad.

3. A few years earlier, ahle hadith jammat raised a false grandson of hazrat mirza sahib (as) who was tortured on “accepting Islam”. This whole story was completely proven a hoax

These are just a few prominet examples that falsehood is the haulmark of your clan. There is no fear of Allah at all.

Bhai sahab, the claim was made that this is killing due to the fact that deceased was ahmedi, i differ based on recent events. i quoted those events just to show that my assumption is not what i think but is supported by facts.

Police inspector of rabwa can not do any thing without jamaat, those who have been to rabwa know this. I can quote more events like you quoted, better stick to the point, you have to prove that this is not some internal rift on chanda,lajna or some jamaat secret but rather he was killed by people just becuase he was ahmedi. If you can not prove this then stop making accusations.

@kchughtai

Regarding Teacher Abdul Qudoos murder, here is an excerpt from report submitted by Mr. Shahid Hameed Chaudhary, Magistrate Section-30,

“I have gone through the entire statements of the witnesses appeared before the undersigned and the respondents themselves and their witnesses and statements of the witnesses summoned by the undersigned. Admittedly, deceased Abdul Qadoos remained in police custody for more than 1 ½ months of investigation of case FIR No. 75/2012 without any entry in the record and without adopting any legal procedure because same has been admitted by Muzaffar Ali SI and even the same has not been denied by the respondents themselves and during the said period he was subjected to inhumane torture by the accused persons/police officials of case FIR No. 75/12 police station Chenab Nagar. Exertion of torture is quite evident from the final report submitted by District Standing Medical Board through Dr. Mushtaq Bashir District Medical Legal Officer (Member District Standing Medical Board).

…

It is also worth mentioning over here that Shujat Malhi Incharge investigation police station Chenab Nagar did not even once deny that deceased Abdul Qadoos did not remain in their custody. It is also worth mentioning over here that respondents have not denied keeping the deceased in illegal custody for such a long period of time and handing over the deceased to his family members in a serious condition, which resulted in the death of deceased, he was not provided any proper medical aid. It has also appeared on the record that Muhammad Khan constable, Muhammad Naeem constable and Amir Nazir constable were involved in the torture on the deceased, whereas Asif Hayat head constable and Amir Nazir constable have also been found in transporting the deceased from the police station Chenab Nagar to Chowki Jhanger Galoteran where deceased was subjected to inhumane torture.

https://www.persecutionofahmadis.org/police-torture-to-death-mr-abdul-qadoos-an-innocent-prominent-ahmadi-in-rabwah/

Post Martem report of Master abdul qudoos( the one who was involved in killing of yousuf ahmedi and rana abrar)

@Shamraz_Khan

I rest my case.

May you rest in peace.

Bhai sahab, You claimed this

Tell us one time when a killer of of Ahmedi ever went to jail?

and i proved you were wrong.

Jis kam ka pata na ho wahan tang nahi arani chahiye, better google and copy paste some anti islam article without any proper comment, this is what you do best.

---

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[Med911]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Peace nnabid

I can assure you that no one here is justifying the killing of an Ahmedi just because of his faith ... Look brother Bao Bihari has just corrected me - he is even aligned accepting a a possibility of an outside job, I thought no ... I can also say that for me personally if anyone was living under my protection and was killed I would blame myself personally and take it to heart for not providing adequate safety ... The sympathy is there with the family of the deceased ... But that sympathy does not necessarily extend to all Ahmedis because we don't sympathise with the whole world's Muslims when one of us is killed unjustly ... I guess we ought to have those sentiments ... But reality is we don't ... Neither should anyone be killed in cold blood nor should we pull out the victim card every time a killing happens ...

We should wait for the investigation and undertake our own before we react ...

I have been trying to avoid posting on this forum for the longest time, but this incident really got to me, and your post is simply too precious to let go.

"Bao Bihari" claims there is a long history of the Ahmadi attacking one another! I dont know about that, but there is an even longer history of Sunnis attacking and murdering the Ahmadi. The internet is REPLETE with bearded half wits declaring them "worthy of DEATH." The internet is FULL of vitriol and bigotry toward them. There is more then enough examples of your "brothers" murdering others for the glory of their twisted ideology. Sure we should wait for an investigation (im sure you would feel relieved if this weren't another of your esteemed "brothers." Dont hold your breath though, its Pakistan not the UK.), but odds are, this was another idiot from one of those Madrassas trying to kill his way into jannah.

To continuously try to implicate the community itself, screams of desperation. A desperation to absolve oneself of the collective guilt of persecution. It soothes the conscience of people like Bao Bihari to believe that a Sunni could never murder an ahmadi. I have known and know many Pakistani's like this Bihari person. Its the oldest trick in the book. Try to cover up the persecution by pretending it doesnt exist and justifying and belittling ever incendence of bigotry by pretending it something other then what it is.

You would help your credibility if instead of supporting Bao Bihari and his obvious bias, you admit that in all likelihood, this was another example of an Ahmadi being killed by a Sunni extremist. Pakistan has a long history of such attacks. A part of me wishes this werent another example of Pakistani bigotry, but alas, it is almost guaranteed that it is.

By the way, whenever there is an attack on a Pakistani in the UK by a White person, does anyone in your community ever think it was due to anything other then racism? For example, the elderly Pakistani who was stabbed to death about 2 years ago, did you think he was simply attacked because he had a nice watch on? You know stench of bigotry as well as I do, and you know this murder in Rabwah is just that, stop pretending.

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

^ It is better that you dont post, as you dont seem to realize what i am trying to convey here, all i am saying is that before any investigation dont blame any one. Muslims are not interested in killing ahmedis, otherwise vast majority of sunnis/shias who have same opinion for ahmedis would have "eaten" all the ahmedi population.

i have quoted few incidents in the recent past about how ahmedis were involved in killing of ahmedi/people in rabwa, i have plenty more evidence which i may share as needed. If this case is any different/or some evidence indicate that who killed him are not ahmedis, i will be the first person to speak against people who killed him without any reason.

May ALLAH give you and your group hidayat. Masalama

[kchughtai]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Peace nnabid

I can assure you that no one here is justifying the killing of an Ahmedi just because of his faith ... Look brother Bao Bihari has just corrected me - he is even aligned accepting a a possibility of an outside job, I thought no ... I can also say that for me personally if anyone was living under my protection and was killed I would blame myself personally and take it to heart for not providing adequate safety ... The sympathy is there with the family of the deceased ... But that sympathy does not necessarily extend to all Ahmedis because we don't sympathise with the whole world's Muslims when one of us is killed unjustly ... I guess we ought to have those sentiments ... But reality is we don't ... Neither should anyone be killed in cold blood nor should we pull out the victim card every time a killing happens ...

We should wait for the investigation and undertake our own before we react ...

first of all, forget about faith for a moment, neither you nor your brother condemned this killing on humanitarian grounds. neither this one nor the one who was murdered within police custody. I, personally, condemned the unfortunate incident of Rawalpindi.
Whose protection are we under? not under Rabwa regime. Rabwa is not a state within a state like waziriztan. It is the responsibility of Punjab government to provide security who directly controls police walas. The way you extended sympathy is irksome to say the least. As far as playing victim card is concerned, please tell me what happens when a sunni is killed or a shia is killed. At least, we are not putting that kind of show or response. Please pull out your head out of the sand.

[kchughtai]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Bhai sahab, the claim was made that this is killing due to the fact that deceased was ahmedi, i differ based on recent events. i quoted those events just to show that my assumption is not what i think but is supported by facts.

Police inspector of rabwa can not do any thing without jamaat, those who have been to rabwa know this. I can quote more events like you quoted, better stick to the point, you have to prove that this is not some internal rift on chanda, lajna or some jamaat secret but rather he was killed by people just becuase he was ahmedi. If you can not prove this then stop making accusations.

Are you kidding me. the police inspector is under showbaz sharif who is in alliance with extremists. The 2nd highlighted text is probably based on mr. AK Sheikh propaganda who remained a member of this jammat till he was kicked out. His family is still part of the Jammat.

[quote]

Post Martem report of Master abdul qudoos( the one who was involved in killing of yousuf ahmedi and rana abrar)

[/quote]

Most of the text on the postmostem report you posted is not legible. I, could only see the words "Tashadud" and list of every damn thing was intact report. If everything was intact then how did he die because of tashadud?

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

first of all, forget about faith for a moment, neither you nor your brother condemned this killing on humanitarian grounds. neither this one nor the one who was murdered within police custody. I, personally, condemned the unfortunate incident of Rawalpindi. Whose protection are we under? not under Rabwa regime. Rabwa is not a state within a state like waziriztan. It is the responsibility of Punjab government to provide security who directly controls police walas. The way you extended sympathy is irksome to say the least. As far as playing victim card is concerned, please tell me what happens when a sunni is killed or a shia is killed. At least, we are not putting that kind of show or response. Please pull out your head out of the sand.

How do you want us to condemn then, i think we both have condemned the attack, we think it is a sad incident to kill a qualified doctor who came back to serve his country. what else do you want us to say.

Pindi incident was different, it was like that stupid attack on ahmedi mosque in lahore ,which all muslims condemned.

[kchughtai]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

.., we think it is a sad incident to kill a qualified doctor who came back to serve his country. ..

Thanks...appreciate it

[psyah]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

I have been trying to avoid posting on this forum for the longest time, but this incident really got to me, and your post is simply too precious to let go.

"Bao Bihari" claims there is a long history of the Ahmadi attacking one another! I dont know about that, but there is an even longer history of Sunnis attacking and murdering the Ahmadi. The internet is REPLETE with bearded half wits declaring them "worthy of DEATH." The internet is FULL of vitriol and bigotry toward them. There is more then enough examples of your "brothers" murdering others for the glory of their twisted ideology. Sure we should wait for an investigation (im sure you would feel relieved if this weren't another of your esteemed "brothers." Dont hold your breath though, its Pakistan not the UK.), but odds are, this was another idiot from one of those Madrassas trying to kill his way into jannah.

To continuously try to implicate the community itself, screams of desperation. A desperation to absolve oneself of the collective guilt of persecution. It soothes the conscience of people like Bao Bihari to believe that a Sunni could never murder an ahmadi. I have known and know many Pakistani's like this Bihari person. Its the oldest trick in the book. Try to cover up the persecution by pretending it doesnt exist and justifying and belittling ever incendence of bigotry by pretending it something other then what it is.

You would help your credibility if instead of supporting Bao Bihari and his obvious bias, you admit that in all likelihood, this was another example of an Ahmadi being killed by a Sunni extremist. Pakistan has a long history of such attacks. A part of me wishes this werent another example of Pakistani bigotry, but alas, it is almost guaranteed that it is.

By the way, whenever there is an attack on a Pakistani in the UK by a White person, does anyone in your community ever think it was due to anything other then racism? For example, the elderly Pakistani who was stabbed to death about 2 years ago, did you think he was simply attacked because he had a nice watch on? You know stench of bigotry as well as I do, and you know this murder in Rabwah is just that, stop pretending.

Peace Med911

You are doing with this case exactly what you do with evolution ... You believe it first and then search for the evidence ... If it seems to you to be a bit dry and without sympathy for me to search first, ascertain who it was before I start to react then you are welcome to hold that opinion against me ... But as I said the sympathy is there ... No one should be killed in cold blood it is an injustice to all of us ... Likewise no one community should be singled out without evidence in the specific case all angles should be given fair investigation ... And to be honest I would even investigate the option of a radical Sunni killing first and do that search with greater fervour ... Because that would seem to be the natural thing to do ... However, this case has more than the Ahmedi dimension to it, it is quite political and involves high profile people.

When Sayyiduna Umar's (RA) own son was convicted and given strikes of a whip the one holding the whip was doing so softly, Sayyiduna Umar (RA) insisted to give the punishment properly ... With his tears flowing he took the whip and struck hard ... To show and demonstrate to us the level of his strictness to the law ... Otherwise it would set a bad precedent that we could not afford in the ummah ... Which is to treat certain elite differently ... It is in our veins to execute fairness and justice ... The problem is the people who currently lead in Pakistan and many of the fanatics are distant from that mentality ... In my view to automatically blame another without evidence is just the other side of the coin to the fanatic problem.

[novice75]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Peace Med911

You are doing with this case exactly what you do with evolution ... You believe it first and then search for the evidence ... If it seems to you to be a bit dry and without sympathy for me to search first, ascertain who it was before I start to react then you are welcome to hold that opinion against me ... But as I said the sympathy is there ... No one should be killed in cold blood it is an injustice to all of us ... Likewise no one community should be singled out without evidence in the specific case all angles should be given fair investigation ... And to be honest I would even investigate the option of a radical Sunni killing first and do that search with greater fervour ... Because that would seem to be the natural thing to do ... However, this case has more than the Ahmedi dimension to it, it is quite political and involves high profile people.

When Sayyiduna Umar's (RA) own son was convicted and given strikes of a whip the one holding the whip was doing so softly, Sayyiduna Umar (RA) insisted to give the punishment properly ... With his tears flowing he took the whip and struck hard ... To show and demonstrate to us the level of his strictness to the law ... Otherwise it would set a bad precedent that we could not afford in the ummah ... Which is to treat certain elite differently ... It is in our veins to execute fairness and justice ... The problem is the people who currently lead in Pakistan and many of the fanatics are distant from that mentality ... In my view to automatically blame another without evidence is just the other side of the coin to the fanatic problem.

Having witnessed first hand persecution and hatred of Ahmedis we better look in the mirror. Why should they have to hide their faith no matter how repulsive you and I may find it. For gods sake stop quoting Hazrat Umars examples as if any of it applies. Who is Pak govt to judge who is and isnt a muslim. Sooner they start living in this century the better. These should be good first steps.

Repeal all discriminatory laws against all faiths
Ban sharia laws. Too many variations and sects exist for a govt to do justice to all.
separate governance from all religion

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Can some one tell me why he was not given a place in beheshti maqbara? His body is transported to canada as per news.

Is it that he did not contributed the chanda to be eligible for the burial or is it some thing else. Bahishti Maqbara - Wikipedia

i know one ahmedi whose bodies was flown from outside just to be buried in rabwa. If there is any thing i am missing please do share.

[kchughtai]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

^ Why are you dragging irrelevant issues. now behishti maqbara. what is your problem? on one hand, you said that prior to full investigation, "Muslims" should not be blamed but at the same time you pointed fingers on Ahmadis and called it an inside job. hypocrisy?

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

^ Why are you dragging irrelevant issues. now behishti maqbara. what is your problem? on one hand, you said that prior to full investigation, "Muslims" should not be blamed but at the same time you pointed fingers on Ahmadis and called it an inside job. hypocrisy?

No trying to balance the two sides. :)

I am not trying to drag it, just that i read this in one of the ahmediya website and was wondering why he was not honored to be buried in that maqbara given the "fazail". Any way if the chanda relation to "behishti maqbara" is a sensitive issue for you then leave it.

[goodname]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Please stop using this thread to take potshots at Ahmadis.

As for why Dr. Mehdi Ali Qamar's final resting place will be in Toronto, people normally bury their loved ones close to where they live; his immediate family members live in North America. He practiced cardiology and was a professor at a Medical university in the US but he was a Canadian citizen too, and so are his brothers, who live in Toronto with their families. His wife and sons lived with him in Pickerington, Ohio, which is a few hours drive from Toronto. Most likely his family will continue living there.

Obviously, his family would prefer his burial place to be close to their home. A hate-filled bigot took away his life in Pakistan but at least his loved ones can visit his grave in Toronto and pay their respect whenever they want. And because tolerant nations like Canada are not apartheid states and do not persecute their people that subscribe to minority religious denominations/sects, I am sure he will be allowed to rest in peace there. No one will desecrate his grave like a bigot in Pakistan did of Dr. Abdus Salam--the only Nobel laureate Pak ever produced.

[bao_bihari]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

@goodname

Please stop using this thread to take potshots at Ahmadis.

As for why Dr. Mehdi Ali Qamar’s final resting place will be in Toronto, people normally bury their loved ones close to where they live; his immediate family members live in North America. He practiced cardiology and was a professor at a Medical university in the US but he was a Canadian citizen too, and so are his brothers, who live in Toronto with their families. His wife and sons lived with him in Pickerington, Ohio, which is a few hours drive from Toronto. Most likely his family will continue living there.

Obviously, his family would prefer his burial place to be close to their home. A hate-filled bigot took away his life in Pakistan but at least his loved ones can visit his grave in Toronto and pay their respect whenever they want. And because tolerant nations like Canada are not apartheid states and do not persecute their people that subscribe to minority religious denominations/sects, I am sure he will be allowed to rest in peace there. No one will desecrate his grave like a bigot in Pakistan did of Dr. Abdus Salam–the only Nobel laureate Pak ever produced.

Will stop my self here, obviously either you dont know about beheshti maqbara / dont know the importance or deliberately trying to appear ignorant.

Every Ahmadi firmly believes that only those members destined for Paradise are buried in this heavenly cemetery.

This is like a muslim dying in madina and then his body is transorted back to his home town, i dont think any muslim with sane mind will try to leave this opportunity of being buried in madina. Same applies to you people here as per what ahmedis believe about “fazail” of this maqbara.

Any way just hope whoever killed him gets caught as soon as possible.

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[chacha_Ghalib]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

Just for the info of those who aren't convinced already that it was an inside job, there has been a propaganda campaign by molvis against Tahir Heart institute, the ahmadi run hospital where Dr. Mahdi was volunteering. They have been distributing pamphlets warning muslims that they may loose their iman if they go there.

Molvis fear that certified muslims might develop a realistic picture of ahmadis if they actually interacted with them. Which is a graver danger than loosing one's life.

The hospital has world class heart specialists and charges reduced fees to the poor.

[Ali_Syed]

Re: Persecution of Ahmadis Continues Unabated

thread closed