Pakistani Nationalism: The only way forward

I visit this board whenever time permits, and continue to be disappointed by a certain segments of the membership. This segment is out to denigrate Pakistan and create unnecessary divisiveness based on religion, province, or political beliefs. It seems like we spending so much time arguing over inconsequential arguments that our enemies are growing stronger everyday.

Instead of forwarding the interests of Pakistan, we have lost our nationalism for secularism, islamism, sindhism and the like. I am not denying that Pakistan has a long way to go in terms of political and economic development, however this internal disintegration is reaching critical proportions.

I recently returned from an investment management conference, where places like China, India, even conflict ridden Lebanon sent their representatives who came prepared with excellent brochures and gave amazing presentations. During the informal sessions, I had the chance to gauge their opinions, and an Indian fellow said “how do you expect the world to look at Pakistan, when Pakistanis themselves have not marketted the country’s potential properly.” Sad but true. Sure India, China and others have many problems (And I am not hating on them) but their people (expats included) are probably their greatest boosters. In terms of nationalism, even Afghanistan has more overt nationalism than Pakistan.

So coming back to the main message here: We need a culture shift from not just talking about what is wrong with Pakistan, to doing something about it. Protectiing the nation from outside encroachments and creating a cohesive society is so crucial, that we need to begin a reconciliation within to acheive prosperity across the board.

And you came up with the above reason for being non-choisive paki society. What a load of crape.

Re: Pakistani Nationalism: The only way forward

I agree with the person starting this thread......!!! indeed we have not marketed our country well!!!!

Those are the self professed reasons for the divisiveness in Pakistan. It doesn't mean that you can't be Sindhi and Islamist, in reality, people are so tied to these smaller identities that they have forgotten the Pakistaniat.

As for you, junior. How about we learn how spell crap before we step up to the big leagues ok?

and you decided to jump lower than the "Islamiat" or "Sindhism" by talking about spelling mistakes, doesn't it tell you somethin :)

We can deal with secularism or Sindhism, but we cannot treat the problems of Islamism.

Islam as practiced today is antithesis of country specific allegiance. Islamist Pakistanis cannot take an oath of allegiance to Pakistan.

So either you let the Islamists ruin Pakistan (or other countries where they reside), or face the Islamism head on. And be ready for a long fight.

Why do we have to say Isalmism and Islamist and not just Islam or Islamic? I think the soft-knee starts right there in the hesitancy to call it a spade.

Or are you making a distinction between a Islamic Pakistan and Islamist Pakistan? Please elaborate

Huge difference chief; What i am saying is directed to ONE person not an entire group (Sindhis, Secularists). Besides I could care less about typos, but when you try to insult someone at least have the foresight to know how to spell 'crap' properly.

Anyway the point here is to talk about the general lack of nationalism of Pakistanis when they are representing Pakistan.

I think that everyone, Islamist or otherwise has to take an oath of loyalty to Pakistan. Pakistan is the abode of Islam in South Asia, the only Muslim nuclear nation - plenty for Islamists to make the allegiance to the nation.

I think that these subgroupings like political ideology, sectarianism, and the ethnicity are destroying Pakistan.

If you don't like Pakistan then claim to Pakistani go back to your Bharati or Arab homeland.

Yeap you got it.

So true.

I beg to differ. Pakistan is abode of Pakistanis regardless of their religion, ethnicity, gender, race etc.

I would not link a nuclear weapon to being "Muslim". This is rather offensive to even talk about a "Nuclear Muslim".

Weapons are acquired these days to protect every citizen of the country. And not just Muslims.

Politics etc. will always be there in a dynamic country. The problem is when any of these "ies" become violent like Jihadies.

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I beg to differ. Pakistan is abode of Pakistanis regardless of their religion, ethnicity, gender, race etc.
**

Whats a Pakistani then? Sindhis and Punjabis are nothing more than Persianized Indians, Baluchis are Iranian, and Pakhtuns are Afghanis.

Pakistan is THE abode of Islam in South Asia. It was created as Muslim homeland. This does not mean that other religions are not welcome and we should be intolerant of them.

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I would not link a nuclear weapon to being "Muslim". This is rather offensive to even talk about a "Nuclear Muslim".
**

Its a political not military fact. Pakistan is THE only Muslim majority nation to successfully test the nukes. Unless Iran does something to change that, it carries a lot of political weight in Pakistan and the wider Muslim world.

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Weapons are acquired these days to protect every citizen of the country. And not just Muslims.
**

True. However the VAST majority of Pakistanis are Muslims. Ofcourse I would go as far saying that I would rather take a Patriotic Pakistani Hindu over a watan faroosh Pakistani Muslim. This is all about standing up for Pakistan.

In fact, Pakistan should begin a marketing campaign to put our patriotic minority groups front and center. This is about making the nation stronger by weeding out the bad elements. Get rid rid of the traitors Communist China style.

**
Politics etc. will always be there in a dynamic country. The problem is when any of these "ies" become violent like Jihadies.

**Pakistani politics is stagnant and vile...there is NO dynamism to it (unless you count finding creative ways to loot the country). Don't play a double game with the jihadis.

Re: Pakistani Nationalism: The only way forward

Pak one, points well taken. the issue that we as a nation face is just how unlucky are we that we have the lip service, but we dont implement to realize our aspiration for unity... once that is realized, nothing will come in the way then, to solidify unity-bound efforts and in turn the country and its nationhood will be unbreakable by any mighty or wicked-mongering manipulations.

Oh dear one! Why are you making it so hard on you? Pakistanis are just that. People who live in Pakistan.

And what's up with that Persianized Indian stuff. Whole is made of parts and not the other way around.

Indians are collection of Sindhis, Panjabis, Pathans, and Balochis. And not the other way around.

Here I am using the term "Indian" as "inhabitant of sub-continent" and not just a citizen of a 60 years old entity being ruled by Dilli.

So please quit saying Baluchis are Iranians. Iranians will be really mad at you. Have some self-respect! Will ya?

Why do we have to be stuck with this mythical entity called "wider Muslim world"? Why do you want Pakistan to be "Andhon main kana raja"?

FYI. Muslim world only exists in tea-house like a storm in a tea-cup. If you want to see a real union, check out EU.

There are special status for being an EU citizen. You get same currency, reduction in travel restrictions, job opportunities, common "assembly" etc.

Now tell me what you as a citizen of Pakistan get as a "special" treatment in Islamic world?

Any change on travel restriction? Common currency? Heck you wear shalwar Kameez in Arab country and you will immediately be a Miskeen a term similar to "N-word" for a black.

Bottom line is that as a Pakistani in the mythical Muslim world you don't get anything from their governments or their people. And yet we have a parrot like repetetion going as "Islamic world" Islamic world, Islamic world.

Here is the summary -

The more you hammer on Muslim, Islam, Muslim world, the lesser the chances for encouraging a nationhood for Pakistanis.

Good observation. I believe education system of masses should be reviewed in order to achieve one common goal.

Education and education system cannot do a squat if degree holders do not have the right attitude towards life.

There probably are more degree holders in Karachi than the whole Ireland (minus the Belfast area). Still Karachi is a cesspool of ethnic and religious politics while Ireland is now a developed economy.

Indian degree holders are submissive, and willing to learn and work. So far they are not encumbered with anti-global sentiments. Therefore they work hard and get recognized for that.

Pakistanis and many other tribal socities around the region, have this "I am better tribal than though" stuffed in their heads.

Result is that Pakistanis do not have the right attitude towards the world. And the world do not have the right attitude towards such Pakistanis. It is always tit for tat.

Re: Pakistani Nationalism: The only way forward

I think we must think about the difference between education and degree. Our education system is producing people with nice technical skills but not the right attitude. And thats the key problem.

Yeah, you'll be a good example for that.

Schools only churn out technical/professional people, its the "family/home" and to an extent "society" which makes a difference in "attitude". Schools can only "educate" people about ethics but encouragement or discouragement of which by family/society is what makes the difference.

**Oh dear one! Why are you making it so hard on you? Pakistanis are just that. People who live in Pakistan.

And what's up with that Persianized Indian stuff. Whole is made of parts and not the other way around.

Indians are collection of Sindhis, Panjabis, Pathans, and Balochis. And not the other way around.
**

If you can't even articulate "What is a Pakistani?" then you are in no position to talk about what is wrong/right.

**
Here I am using the term "Indian" as "inhabitant of sub-continent" and not just a citizen of a 60 years old entity being ruled by Dilli.

So please quit saying Baluchis are Iranians. Iranians will be really mad at you. Have some self-respect! Will ya?
**

Maybe you should read up on the origins of the Baluchi people. They are an Eastern Iranian people who speak an Iranian language, and half of Baluchistan is in Iran. As for self self-respect, how about Pakistanis getting some self respect and not insulting their great nation?

**Why do we have to be stuck with this mythical entity called "wider Muslim world"? Why do you want Pakistan to be "Andhon main kana raja"?

FYI. Muslim world only exists in tea-house like a storm in a tea-cup. If you want to see a real union, check out EU.

There are special status for being an EU citizen. You get same currency, reduction in travel restrictions, job opportunities, common "assembly" etc.

Now tell me what you as a citizen of Pakistan get as a "special" treatment in Islamic world?

Any change on travel restriction? Common currency? Heck you wear shalwar Kameez in Arab country and you will immediately be a Miskeen a term similar to "N-word" for a black.

Bottom line is that as a Pakistani in the mythical Muslim world you don't get anything from their governments or their people. And yet we have a parrot like repetetion going as "Islamic world" Islamic world, Islamic world.

**I think you're right about more than a few things but it does not mean that we give up on a larger Islamic Union,or are unable to become the leaders of the Islamic World. But thats a digression.

**Here is the summary -

The more you hammer on Muslim, Islam, Muslim world, the lesser the chances for encouraging a nationhood for Pakistanis.**

Without Islam Pakistan is nothing. You Punjabis, Sindhis, Urdu Speakers might as well merge into India and let Baluchistan and Pakhunkhwa go their own way.

I really admire India in many aspects, they are able to work together despite the ethnic, languague, religious differences because tehy all see themselves as Indians. Pakistani nationalism continues to take a beating by anti-state elements who would rather create an Azad Baluchistan, Shiastan, or Secularistan.

My country? Is the abode of a tolerant Islam in South Asia, made up of the descendents of the Indus, Gandhara civilizations - between two historic powers - Iran and India - This is my Pakistan, a young country that is ages old in spirit.