Re: Infrastructure/Skyscrapers of Pakistan
right, so private funded projects should continue on regardless of poverty conditions of the population, as they have been going on.
That is the only material point here.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT IT'S PRIVATE INVESTMENT. PAKIS HAVE NO SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT
Yes, this is foreign private investmment in Pakistan, which should be welcomed. In fact it is part of the close to $50 billion investment that the UAE is pumping into Pakistan. So all these arguments about poverty and pollution are pretty lame, as such conditions exist in major western cities and that does not stop them having more and more tall buildings.
Re: Infrastructure/Skyscrapers of Pakistan
That is the only material point here.
JUst out of curiousity, isn't the private investement an alternative to gov contributen development, hence providing job security & helping poors to meet end needs?
In this particular project, which will take 7 years to complete, will not few thousands of labourers have a job for 7 years?? No matter how much money will the private invester will make, but some fraction of Rs 20 Billion will make it to the poor.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
EXACTLY!
IT`S PRIVATE INVESTEMNT, WHY SHOULD PAKIS HAVE A SAY HOW TALL THE BUILDINGS SHOULD BE BUILT.
Just think of it, what you are saying, it1s not that the Government of Pakistan decided that their our National assembly and Gov offices should be in tallest buiding on earth, so lets buid one. In that case it was justified to say that "PAKIS" should have a say on this.
Suppose, you bought a part of land in a commercial estate and decided to build something on it, would you ask every "PAKI" what you should build, and how many stories tall it should be? I don't think so. It`s YOUR money and YOU decide how it is spent.
Re: Infrastructure/Skyscrapers of Pakistan
lets see what the impact could be.
the supplies would need to be bought from somewhere, so that pumps money into those suppliers, and to businesses that supply to them. e.g. you need to get wood panels, you pay a transportation company for logistics, you pay a panel manufacturer for the panels, they are sourcing wood from yet another company who is using yet another transportation company to truck the wood over to the panel manufacturer, this panel manufacturer is also getting other supplies, like stains, lacquer from somewhere. All these companies employ people. And none of these people are working directly for this development.If you want me to even take it a step further, where would an influx of workers come from for such a large project? do we have enough workers just sitting on their hands doing nothing or would thet come from other provinces or cities or villages. they would be lookign for housing, food, services…
and then businesses that will take spaces in that building will have an ongoing positive impact
I mean there are entire state and city programs set up to attract business and development to the cities, because they understand the impct that it has.
Now, what Karachi authorities could do, and I dont know if they have not done it, is to understand the resources squeeze such a development would put on public services, (water, roads, power… facilities for the influx of people that are there working on this project, or after that for people who move to teh city and surrounding areas of this development because they have jobs with businesses in this building) and insist that the investment dollars include provisions for enhancements to these public services. Unless the authorities feel that the net economic impact would be of a significant enough nature that even if they have to absorb these costs that overall they wills till come out ahead.
Re: Infrastructure/Skyscrapers of Pakistan
yes, this project will help thausands to earn a living. if pakistan is to develop then investment like this is imperative. anyone who gets into building work now in pakistan will probably be busy for their entire lives, not to mention the raw material providers, manufacturers, fabricators etc etc
Re: Pakistan to build the World’s tallest building in Karachi
^ Especially when you, the President of Pakistan, announce to the world you cant wait for your 1,942 foot pajama. The President of your country, steps up to a microphone to announce he’ll build one of the tallest buildings in the world. A building that is 20 times taller than ANY other building in Pakistan. Call me silly, but this project, at 1,947 feet is what they call - monumental. Governments love that word. Imagine all the posters than can print with a 1,947 foot building in the back. Gosh, wouldnt that just be great. Monumental…mmm…soooo special.
It’s a public relations miracle to build a billion foot high toothpick. This is no corner store they’re proposing. It’s an insanely ambitious project, and the government WANTS its name slapped on everything to do with it. Subsidies are involved. Government grants are involved. Get it through your empty thick skulls - ITS NOT PRIVATE! No investor in their right mind would venture into Pakistan, one of the WORST places places to invest, and announce as ambitious of a project like this without government involvement.
If you guys think this is a private, and private alone, you’re misinformed. I have better taunts to toss your way, but I’m not sure you’d understand them.
Re: Pakistan to build the World’s tallest building in Karachi
hmmmmm
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
^ Quote the whole sentence babu.
We're not building super markets here. We're not building gas pipe lines. We're talking about a quantum leap from a 350 foot building (MCB) to a 2000 foot building.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
I say we build this building (i dont care if its the tallest or not), jo rota hai roney do...
And yeah retro, paying 2.5% zakaat or a small portion isnt related to distributing your wealth completely, which is what I said, you wont ever do, your argument has no basis, and the fact that you brought up Eidhi and Gates together, theres no point discussing this with you any further.
Jeez, dude there is a relationship between Edhi and Gates. Gates donates 1 billion from his wealth for education in Africa, we need a fraction of that portion to set things right in Pakistan... and even a few rich businessmen can make that happen. Yes I gotta admit that people like Edhi are very few--especially in Pakistan, but at least we can send off other people as a collaborative effort and we could get almost the same result.
And by the way if you think it out, if less than 50 people earning a million rupees per year in Pakistan pay 2.5% of their wealth... how much charity money will that accumulate in one year? That's right, over 12 lakhs... now does that sound little or what? Heck - even if we just pay our taxes right, things could at least resolve a little.
About the pollution/poverty thing. Whilst pollution and poverty can offshoot into a whole gamut of topics (education, health, employment etc.), they actually are pretty much the same--poverty affects quality of life, pollution affects quality of life. So basically they have pretty much the same effects... and I think it is safe to say that they tie for the most emergency-requiring problems in Pakistan.
As far as this KPT project is concerned, I have no problem with it... but only if they could modify it a bit to make it more useful for the public; like say they used the money to build ten 60-storey residences how much more efficient would it be, and it would give our city a good skyline too... and I think that the Mazar-e-Quaid is enough for a "city trademark" right now (India's trademark is still the Taj Mahal after hundreds of years).
The sad part about this project is that it's a private investment (some of it even foreign), and the government should be the first one to be worried about the city's progress.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
hskhan done edited to quot the whole sentence, did not realize that the and was not an additional thought, but and was another component to that thought :)
anyways moving on..
as far as govt subsidies go, they have to look at the net benefit, immediate, and long term. we dont know of the amount or subsidies if any at this point, we dont know the net economic impact of this project.
without concerete numbers hum sab theoretical bongiyan marr rahay hain. or as my french boss used to say...its nothing but intellectual masterbation
Re: Infrastructure/Skyscrapers of Pakistan
the supplies would need to be bought from somewhere, so that pumps money into those suppliers, and to businesses that supply to them. e.g. you need to get wood panels, you pay a transportation company for logistics, you pay a panel manufacturer for the panels, they are sourcing wood from yet another company who is using yet another transportation company to truck the wood over to the panel manufacturer, this panel manufacturer is also getting other supplies, like stains, lacquer from somewhere. All these companies employ people. And none of these people are working directly for this development.If you want me to even take it a step further, where would an influx of workers come from for such a large project? do we have enough workers just sitting on their hands doing nothing or would thet come from other provinces or cities or villages. they would be lookign for housing, food, services...
and then businesses that will take spaces in that building will have an ongoing positive impact
I mean there are entire state and city programs set up to attract business and development to the cities, because they understand the impct that it has.
Now, what Karachi authorities could do, and I dont know if they have not done it, is to understand the resources squeeze such a development would put on public services, (water, roads, power... facilities for the influx of people that are there working on this project, or after that for people who move to teh city and surrounding areas of this development because they have jobs with businesses in this building) and insist that the investment dollars include provisions for enhancements to these public services. Unless the authorities feel that the net economic impact would be of a significant enough nature that even if they have to absorb these costs that overall they wills till come out ahead.
:-)
you talk about resources squeez and not having a work force ready to tackle projects on such large scale! as far as I know, it was the same PAkistan, and India (later on Bangladesh) who contributed in construction industry all over middle east in 70's and 80's. if we don't have work force available handy, that mean all our incresing un-Employment statistics are nothing but a lie? if you been to KArachi, dun you know that college graduates are either poushing carts or doing nothing at all, hence fueling work force to some MAJOR political parties... will not THEY have a chance toearn a decent living?
Shortage of supplies, fair enough, but you must be aware of Supply and DEMAND chain? will not push MORE investment in other fields? lyou gave an example of wood panels, will not force wood pannel manufacturers to increase THEIR production?
just remind me what does it mean to a worker when industries increase production?
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
abay.. u did not get my point at all...dobarah parrho ussay ja karr
I meant that if the resources are not readily available in teh city because they are busy in other development projects then we would attract workers from other parts of the country who in turn would need goods and services...
please go back and read what my post meant. It was saying that there would be a positive impact on suppliers and their suppliers etc
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
^ My apologies, I misunderstood it.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
khali kholi apologies aheen chalay gi, zara suji ka halwa aur 3 pooorian bhijwao, bhook say halat tabah hai
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
^ well for that you will have to wait, till the project begins and some1 opens a Halwa Puri shop at project site.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
[quote]
The sad part about this project is that it's a private investment (some of it even foreign), and the government should be the first one to be worried about the city's progress.
[/quote]
yes, and the people funding it may not even be muslims for that matter, they can use their wealth in whatever way they like to invest in the country, so no point in whining... they wont spend it on charity or bheek either.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
^^ Where did this charity and bheek come from? Our foreign investment is mostly from the Gulf countries... and duh of course they won't spend for the people of Pakistan, they just want to make money from our land. The charity (which you unaptly called "bheek") will come from the people of Pakistan... people who care for their country and themselves on a bigger scope.
What really pisses me off is that there are Pakistani tycoons with their asses in Dubai and Saudi Arabia (some of them even in North America), and even though they can spend big bucks vigorously for some 5-star hotel (which will eventually be a casino, who knows) they can't spend just a few thousand bucks for their own people. Talk about selfishness.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
one does not have to be a tycoon to help, but the help has to be managed on an immediate. short term, long term basis. cant keep giving handouts, those are important for immediate needs but a long term sustainability is what is needed. That is why I appreciate groups like Human Development Foundation that are attacking it from all angles.
Re: Pakistan to build the World's tallest building in Karachi
jezz, now they are arguing that they don't like investment from other then pakistanis! it sounds like coming from a prostitute, who will do BUSINESS within family to keep her pride.