Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35' (merged)

Re: Pakistan ‘suicide blast kills 35’

These people defended the borders whereas the glorious army lost every war it fought. Capturing own capital is not counted as a military victory.

VIEW: Unanswered questions on Bajaur*** — Rasul Bakhsh Rais***](http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006\11\07\story_7-11-2006_pg3_3)

The missile strike was just a reminder that the coalition forces would use such force in hot pursuit of the Taliban and against groups and individuals in the tribal belt who are suspected of giving sanctuary to the Taliban*

The killing of 82 Pakistanis in a religious seminary in Bajaur agency is a tragedy considering that the government despite its claim of having taken out militants has not been able to prove it yet. Until now, therefore, it is the government’s word against that of local residents, and evidence points to the veracity of the latter’s version than the government’s.

For many others who might know the history and people of this region on our political periphery, it is sad to reflect how our state and the present government have gradually pushed the tribesmen into taking up arms.

Since we tend to overlook or forget lessons of history, let me bring to your notice the role Khan of Bajaur and his people played in countering the intrigues, military incursions and intervention of the Afghan government in September 1961. S. Fida Yunis, one of the most prominent writers and historians, who has very methodically collected and published about the border regions and Afghanistan, narrates the events of Afghanistan’s incursions into Dir and Bajaur in support of ‘Pashtunistan’.

Sardar Daoud, then-prime minister of Afghanistan had been fixated on internationalising the Pashtunistan issue by showing to the great powers and to the UN that peoples of the tribal agencies wanted, and were struggling for, an independent Pashtunistan. To make his claims credible, he raised a tribal lashkar and mobilised large number of troops to Asmar and Chigha Sarai on the other side of the Bajaur agency to stir up trouble for Pakistan. He also sent thousands of Afghan troops disguised as local civilians and gave cash and weapons to the Khan of Jandol and Nawab of Dir who supported the Afghan moves.

A major encounter took place on September 23-24 between the Afghan lashkar and the local tribesmen led by Khan of Khar. The people of Bajaur inflicted a humiliating defeat on the Afghan lashkar, forcing it to retreat. The tribesmen also captured a good number of Afghan troops and handed them over to the Pakistan government. Interestingly, Safi and Mohmand tribes on the Afghan side of the border also fought against their own troops to support the people of Bajaur and their choice for Pakistan. That was the end of Afghanistan’s military option for securing an independent ‘Pashtunistan’.

Now, it is exactly in the same region that some mysterious force has struck the local people with missiles, flattening the seminary and destroying the lives of its teachers and students. The tragedy has left most Pakistanis in shock and disbelief. They wonder why the government would resort to such a method when it has other alternative ways and means of dealing with the militants; and when it changed tactics in Waziristan by signing a treaty with the estranged tribes, and was about to repeat the same in Bajaur in few days time. This is why the official claim that our forces have undertaken this heinous operation doesn’t find any takers in the serious circles of the country. The general perception within the country is that the US forces operating in Afghanistan have fired the missile with or without the concurrence of the Pakistan government. It is a repeat of a similar attack at Damadola village last year, using the same strategy, the same weapon platform and means of delivery.

Why then is the government taking responsibility for such a cruel attack against its own people? Politically it would be less damaging to take the blame than to acknowledge that it has left the area undefended, and that it cannot do anything against NATO and American forces. It is true that Pakistan doesn’t have the capacity to take on coalition forces operating in Afghanistan. We have taken a pragmatic course since 9/11 reversed our old Afghan policy and have, some would argue, rather too faithfully supported the US and coalition forces to defeat the Taliban for securing and stabilizing Afghanistan.

If it is true that American forces have attacked the seminary, which is increasingly becoming crystal clear, then what could be their reason for launching such a brutal act and one that would be politically embarrassing for the government of Pakistan? There are two possible explanations. First, our government has failed to sell the change in its policy of reconciliation with the militants in Waziristan. Many American commentators and policymakers have shown reservations about this policy and have been sceptical about the efficacy of peace accord with the tribal leaders. Rather, they see in it another u-turn, which they believe amounts to surrendering the border regions to the Pakistani tribal Taliban. Second, there is apparently a distrust of Pakistan’s policy and its long-term intentions about Afghanistan, particularly, the Pashtun-dominated regions. The Afghan and American leaders have repeatedly expressed this distrust in telling Pakistan openly and behind the scenes to do more to stop cross-border movement of Taliban fighters. Occasional praise for Pakistan’s pivotal role in defeating the Taliban and the acknowledgement of continual support to the coalition forces or the fact that we have maintained the largest concentration of forces in history along the Afghan border have failed to convince the coalition partners about the sincerity and seriousness of our efforts.

The missile strike was just a reminder that the coalition forces would use such force in hot pursuit of the Taliban and against groups and individuals in the tribal belt who are suspected of giving sanctuary to the Taliban or sending any support to them across the border.

Denying that American or NATO forces launched the missile attack may not give any political respite to the government. Nor will the self-denigrating confession that our forces have done it. In either case, it is a failure of our policy towards Afghanistan, and more importantly towards the peoples of our western borderlands. It might be after counting too many young Americans dead and hundreds of billions of dollars wasted that American government and its neo-conservative strategists realise the futility of war as the only means of restoring peace, stability and unity of divided and fractious societies.

Pakistan took the right step in seeking reconciliation with the tribes in Waziristan with the objective of isolating the militants. It should do the same in Bajaur as quickly as it can. Americans will sooner than later also realise that massacres, indiscriminate bombings, tortures and confinement of suspects in secret prisons would remove it further from its avowed goal of state and nation-building in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

the list was in 'the news' ie jang, if incorrect the government will reply. if they dont will you accept the government/army got it wrong?@road

Re: Pakistan ‘suicide blast kills 35’

Bajaur survivors shifted to secret location](http://dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006\11\08\story_8-11-2006_pg1_3)

BAJAUR: Three men who survived the recent military raid on a madrassa in Bajaur have been shifted to an undisclosed location, reported BBC on Tuesday. 

**Abubekar (20), Syed Wali Shah (18) and Noor Rehman (16) were taken to hospital following the strike and the Red Cross was funding their treatment, but journalists were not allowed to meet them.

It is not yet known whether the ban on meeting them had been imposed by the federal government or the provincial government. **

Talking to BBC, the three men rejected the government’s claim of foreign terrorists’ presence in the madrassa at the time of the strike. They said “we never participated in a militant operation, nor did we ever go to Afghanistan”. online

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

Now mushy the liar has become the source of ultimate truth. That is such a pity...

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

You are actually going to beleive people that murder our troops over Musharraf?

I admit our government is not perfect but its not in the habit of killing its own people....

Re: Pakistan ‘suicide blast kills 35’

Bomber kills 42 Pakistani troops
A suicide bomber has killed at least 42 soldiers as they exercised at an army training school in north-west Pakistan.

It is the deadliest attack by militants on the army since it began operations against pro-Taleban and al-Qaeda fighters close to the Afghan border.
There was no immediate claim of responsibility for the attack.
It happened in the town of Dargai in North West Frontier Province, not far from where the army said it killed some 80 militants last week.
The BBC’s M Ilyas Khan says Wednesday’s attack could undermine recent agreements between the military and pro-Taleban militants in other border areas.
Emotions in the region have been running high since an air strike on a religious school (madrassa) last week in the neighbouring area of Bajaur, in which the army said 80 militants were killed. Local people insisted the dead were innocent religious students.

More at: BBC NEWS | South Asia | Bomber kills 42 Pakistani troops

Re: Pakistan ‘suicide blast kills 35’

Afghanistan strikes back at Pakistan
By Syed Saleem Shahzad

KARACHI - After a number of recent incidents, it is emerging that for the first time since the fall of the communist regime in Afghanistan 13 years ago, Afghan intelligence, likely with foreign assistance, is active in Pakistan.

At the same time, several attacks on Pakistani military bases - the most recent a suicide attack on Wednesday morning that killed at least 35 soldiers - add to the overall volatility of the country. And this comes at a time that the top brass are gathering at

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General Headquarters in Rawalpindi to make a vital decision on Pakistan’s role in the “war on terror”.

Last week, a car bomb ripped through the office of the inspector general of police in Quetta, the capital of southwestern Pakistan’s Balochistan province. One policeman and two other men were killed.

This followed a bomb attack in Peshawar, the provincial capital of Pakistan’s North-West Frontier Province (NWFP), in which nine people were killed and more than 30 injured.

And on Tuesday, NWFP Governor Ali Mohammad Jan Aurakzai escaped unhurt in a rocket attack while he was addressing a council in Wana, headquarters of the South Waziristan tribal agency.

Initial investigations into the Quetta attack pointed to suspects of Afghan-Uzbek origin. A subsequent massive raid netted more than 70 Afghans, a few of whom admitted connections with Afghan intelligence.

A joint investigation team comprising Military Intelligence, Inter-Services Intelligence and the Intelligence Bureau then grilled these suspects and concluded that the sophisticated and organizational nature of the operation was beyond the known capabilities of Afghan intelligence on its own.

“KHAD [Khadamat-e Etela’at-e Dawlati, Afghanistan’s secret police] was the most active agency in the region throughout the 1980s, but most of its counter-intelligence missions were assisted by the [Soviet] KGB. KHAD’s external wing carried out bomb attacks in cities such as Peshawar, Quetta and Karachi, as well as assassinations of mujahideen leaders,” a senior security official told Asia Times Online on condition his identity not be revealed.

“Now, no KGB services are available to Afghan intelligence, and none of the old Soviet-trained Afghan officials remain. Thus it is a matter of surprise for Pakistan to see Afghan intelligence using methods which only a few intelligence agencies, considered the best in the world, are capable of applying,” the security official said without giving names but clearly hinting at British, US and Indian intelligence.

Information acquired from the suspects rounded up in Quetta and other parts of the country revealed a network working through the Afghan consulates in Karachi and Quetta, where the Afghan Foreign Ministry had attached a number of staff who were not career diplomats but activists of the Northern Alliance. The Northern Alliance, a mostly non-Pashtun grouping, bitterly opposed the Taliban during their rule from 1996-2001.

According to Asia Times Online contacts, during interrogation some of the suspects talked of plans for death squads to launch attacks in Karachi and Islamabad. The facilitation was to be through the Afghan consulates in Quetta and Karachi.

The death squads were to target top religious leaders considered pro-Taliban. One of the names learned by this correspondent is Maulana Noor Mohammed (a member of parliament from Quetta), in addition to some non-political clerics in the tribal and border areas.

Certainly, such killings would anger the large pro-Taliban following in Pakistan; at the same time, they would likely fuel sectarian strife in the country as the blame would fall on Shi’ites.

More instability would be the obvious result.

Army in the firing line
On Wednesday, a suicide bomber blew himself up at an army parade ground in the town of Dargai in NWFP, killing at least 35 soldiers and wounding 20. Dargai is mostly pro-Taliban.

The first reaction would be to assume that this attack had nothing to do with Afghan intelligence operatives - why should they attack the Pakistani army, which is ostensibly on their side?

But if it was Afghan intelligence, as a section of Pakistani intelligence is convinced, the argument is the same as it was for the Quetta attack. In that incident the attackers selected the office of the inspector general of police because insurgents in Afghanistan target Afghan police and the Afghan National Army (ANA), in what the Afghan government calls Pakistan-sponsored attacks. So these would be tit-for-tat responses.

Wednesday’s attack could also have been undertaken by al-Qaeda-linked militants. Indeed, they would be the immediate suspects. This would be because they are seeking revenge for the air attacks on a madrassa (seminary) in Bajour agency last week in which 80 people died. US drones are believed to have been involved in the attack, which officials said targeted militants.

Further, the militants would want to sabotage peace deals between Islamabad and the tribal areas. North and South Waziristan recently concluded deals under which the army would withdraw in exchange for the tribals stemming the flow of militants across the border into Afghanistan. Bajour agency was on the brink of signing such a deal when the air attacks came.

Shifting tides
According to Asia Times Online contacts, the Hezb-e-Islami Afghanistan (HIA) led by Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, once the favorite of Pakistan’s groups, has come out into the open in southwestern Afghanistan in a form of alliance with local Afghan governments. Gulbuddin has been considered an important player in the Taliban-led insurgency.

HIA commanders have taken control of many villages and towns. Here they have hoisted HIA flags alongside those of the local Afghan administrations, which are already filled with former HIA members. Hekmatyar has already signaled for a deal with the Afghan administration in Kabul.

Certainly Hekmatyar would not have changed his attitude toward foreign forces in Afghanistan and still demands that they announce a schedule for leaving. But Hekmatyar has always been against killing ANA or members of the police. The present arrangements in parts of the southwest between the HIA and Afghan administrations are purely local and not between North Atlantic Treaty Organization forces and the HIA.

Nevertheless, this is an important development and a positive one from Kabul’s point of view.

At the same time, a number of Baloch insurgents, including top commanders of the Baloch Liberation Army, are in Kabul - again, for the first time since the fall of the communist regime in Afghanistan in 1992. The Pakistani government has been battling an insurgency in Balochistan province for many years. The last thing it would want is the insurgency to receive support - moral or any other form - from Afghanistan.

Pakistan’s choices
Pakistan has been walking between the devil and the deep blue sea ever since it signed on to the “war on terror” in 2001 after ditching the Taliban.

It has constantly been criticized by Washington and Kabul for not doing enough to root out al-Qaeda militants and Taliban elements in its territory, while at the same time President General Pervez Musharraf has drawn open hostility (including assassination attempts) from militants, clerics and even sections of the armed forces.

As stated above, Pakistan recently tried to bring some security to the semi-autonomous tribal areas by signing agreements with the Pakistani Taliban in North Waziristan and South Waziristan, and was about to strike one with Bajour.

Pakistan tried to convince Washington that such deals would be beneficial to the “war on terror”, but Washington thought just the opposite, with visions of a vast uncontrollable zone emerging in Pakistan as the strategic backyard of the anti-US movement in Afghanistan. Thus the widespread conviction that the US took matters into its own hands by launching the Bajour attack.

Apparently, Musharraf wanted to follow up this action with further attacks on suspected militants, but was dissuaded from doing so by his top brass, who argued for reconciliation with the Taliban at all costs.

As a result, Musharraf is back to square one with regard to Washington and the Taliban: he just doesn’t know which way to turn. The reports of Afghan counter-intelligence activity in Pakistan make the decision all that much more difficult.

Boiled down, Pakistan has three choices, all of them tough:

Go head-to-head with Pakistan’s militants and face intense instability in which Afghan intelligence would be ready to play its part;
Strike a Waziristan-like deal with militants and face Washington’s wrath in the shape of more air strikes and other conspiracies, including even a coup;
Reassess its whole policy in the region and come up with something that would allow Islamabad once again to gain friends in Kabul as well as keep its Western allies happy.

According to reports from Waziristan, a new video by al-Qaeda leader Dr Ayman al-Zawahiri will be released soon in which he will call for a global jihad against the US and its ally, Pakistan.

Against this background, Pakistan’s top brass will debate the options above. Whichever path they choose, it will have a defining influence on the “war on terror”.

Syed Saleem Shahzad is Asia Times Online’s Pakistan Bureau Chief. He can be reached at [EMAIL=“[email protected]”][email protected].

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/South_Asia/HK09Df02.html

NATO fighting the wrong battle in Afghanistan
Nov 4

NATO takes the fight to Pakistan
Nov 2

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

the MNA from Bajore on ARY disclosed that the people killed were were from 15-25 years old and they were preparing for the ishraq prayers
whoever is claiming 5 year old killed was not there
The government argument is baseless too, since how come they were negotiating for a peace traety with the same people in few hours after the bombing if they were terrorist
One of the government spokesman claimed that video of the training camp was made by an F-16 which makes no sense at all (ARY)
Read the Asia Times article and several questions will be answered

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

if education is your criteria then believe in every word coming from the likes of Benazir and US masters of Mushi

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

U being serious? If so, a reality check is needed ASAP

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

this is the extreme danger with the bajour bombing, we could be being played. the intelligence reports from a few months ago about isi involvement in afghanistan was always going to be followed up on. maybe this is the response by us/british/afghan/indian intelligence.

if half true we can safely assume iraq sectarian violence was no accident.

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

I was not in any mood to write much on the topic as it seems here most are just arguing for the sake of argument and few want to think or learn anything, so better let people argue. Regardless, this statement by symk made me undecided, as I do not know if I should laugh or cry and I have not decided yet :)

Read this statement by someone from MMA and think. MMA is suppose to be a religious party, and their spokesman should know about Islam more then common people (I mean, suppose to :))

Symk:

[quote]
the MNA from Bajore on ARY disclosed that the people killed were were from 15-25 years old and they were preparing for the ishraq prayers
[/quote]

Now, is there anything to wonder? Well, yes.

Claim is made that people in madrassa were there together preparing for Ishraq prayer. I hope I am reading it right, please correct me if I am not, maybe I am getting old and need glasses :)

Why am I saying that? Because, time of Ishraq prayers is after sunrise, that means, after fajar paryer.

Sunrise was around 6.30 AM. Now, the time that madrassa was bombed (5.00 AM), it was not even fajar time, it was well over an hour before fajar time (that was suppose to be after 6.00 AM). It was more then couple of hours before Ishraq time (that was suppose to be much after sunrise, or earliest around 6.45 AM).

So, what this MMA spokesman want to say, is that, these people in madrassa wanted to skip fajar and were preparing for Ishraq?

Now, does MMA claim have any leg to stand? I cannot understand that:

Firstly, why anyone would get together, for any type of prayer in madrassa and not in mosque?

Secondly, why anyone would start preparing for Ishraq prayer, two hours before time? Rather, at time when it was not even fajar prayer (there was over an hour for fajar prayer), that was suppose to be before Ishraq parayer.

I found it mysterious and now dumbfounded. Can anyone clear that? :)

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

pathetic excuse for a human beings these people are

They will pay for it here soon!

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

I may sound stupid to most of you. But I have no confidence and trust in our present govt. **
**Who knows, it might be a formed plan to cover the Bajour incident. Yes, govts all over the world do that kinda stuff.

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

I may have quoted him wrong he may have said Tahajjud prayer ut it was a prayer before fajar. ARY did mention in that interview that the information ministry and ISPR were repeatedly contacted to come for the interview with local MNA from Bajore but they declined
How come the government did not arrest and investigate the 3 survivors of the bombing on the madrassah if they were really terrorists??
Latest statement from Durrani is that none of the people killed were from Al- Qaeda or Talean.........who were they then and what is the proof?
The team of lawyers who after visiting the area declared the Govt story as pack of lies were arrested instead of showing them the proof
Anyway both the acts were acts of violence against the poor citizens of Pakistan and needs to be condemned. I hope this doesn't become a full fledged gorrilla war which our Army will never be able to win (keep the examples of british, russian and US defeats in mind)

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

Good points Sa1eem as usual on this thread. They won't answer you, just skip by these KO points you've made. 5am is well before any normal person studies, let alone kids, and is well before even Fajar prayer..

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

Musharraf is a helluvva lot more stable than the Mullah Liaquat Ali's which you believe. I wouldnt trust Musharraf on all issues, but I do trust him when it comes to not deliberately killing innocent people as he's not a fanatic and only fanatics or madmen go round targetting innocent people.

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

that is what ur great mushy has done to innocent people in bajore and invited trouble for his own troops, so he is a fanatic by your standards

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

Problem is that Army may have killed one group of terrorists, they have motivated a hundred more to take up arms. Terorists are really like the hydra, chop of one head and two pop up in its place.

Re: Pakistan 'suicide blast kills 35'

^^If there's no cause for the terrorists there won't be any, and Bajaur is just being stirred by the MMA and some of the crackpot traitors on here. MMA are too stupid to realize the Afghan Northern Alliance want this.