Pakistan sect endures persecution

This has to stop & laws needs to be changed. Let the people worship whoever/whatever they want to.

Pakistan sect endures persecution

No Pakistani minority is as victimized as the country’s 4 million Ahmadis, who believe in Islam but are viewed by the rest of the country as heretics. There are even legal restrictions on them.

By Alex Rodriguez, Los Angeles Times

2:39 PM PDT, July 6, 2010

Reporting from Faisalabad, Pakistan

Rifles slung over their shoulders, the guards pacing in front of Naeem Masood’s fabric shop glower at anyone who walks by. It’s not thieves or vandals that Masood is worried about. He needs protection from assassins.

In April, the 29-year-old boyish-faced Pakistani found his father, brother and uncle slumped over in the seats of their car, their faces and chests riddled with more than 60 bullets. All of them were dead, victims of what Ahmadis in their Faisalabad enclave say was a deadly warning from extremists: Renounce your sect or leave the city.

No Pakistani minority is as victimized as the country’s 4 million Ahmadis, who believe in Islam but are viewed by the rest of the country as heretics. Because they revere another prophet as well as the prophet Muhammad, the Pakistani government has declared Ahmadis “non-Muslims,” made it a crime for members to refer to their places of worship as mosques and even barred them from extending the common Muslim greeting, salaam aleykum.

The Ahmadi community’s vulnerability was evident May 28, when Pakistani Taliban gunmen stormed two Ahmadi mosques in Lahore, Pakistan’s second-largest city, and killed more than 90 people caught in a maelstrom of gunfire, grenades and suicide bombings.

Though Pakistan is a multiethnic and multilingual society, it has a long history of marginalizing minority groups. Shiite Muslims have been the target of radical Sunni Muslim groups for years. Last year, in the central Punjab city of Gojra, a mob of 1,000 angry Muslims set more than 40 Christian homes ablaze, killing seven people.

The plight of the Ahmadi community, however, provides a window onto the intolerance that permeates Pakistani society. Ahmadis say the risk they face is heightened by the fact that, in a society where hard-line religious parties wield unchallenged clout, they are viewed as traitors to Islam.

Ahmadis consider themselves Muslims but believe that their late-19th century founder, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, was a prophet of God, a belief viewed as heresy by Pakistani Muslims who regard Muhammad as Islam’s final prophet.

The sect’s marginalization was set into motion in 1974 when Pakistan’s parliament enacted the law b*****ng Ahmadis as non-Muslims. The crackdown on the Ahmadis intensified in the 1980s during the rule of Gen. Zia ul-Haq, who ordered a maximum three-year prison term for any Ahmadi who called himself a Muslim, carried out the Muslim call to prayer or referred to an Ahmadi place of worship as a mosque.

“As a result of Zia’s decrees, the state facilitated the mullahs who were already against us,” said Syed Mehmood, spokesman for the Ahmadi community in Faisalabad. “That’s when the persecution started. Hundreds of Ahmadis were jailed just because they said Salaam aleykum.”

Mehmood said the persecution continues today, forcing Ahmadis in Faisalabad to find creative ways to survive. As a result of the killings of the three Ahmadi businessmen in April, along with recent kidnappings and other acts of violence against Ahmadis, community members routinely change their routes to and from home, vary the time of day they arrive and leave work, and lie when asked on the phone about their whereabouts. Many of them have put their social lives — going to parties, meeting friends for lunch or tea — on hold.

At Zaheer Malik’s Toyota dealership, a gleaming glass and silver-paneled building out of place amid the cinder-block merchant stalls on the outskirts of Faisalabad, tall, broad-shouldered armed guards stand watch in the parking lot as well as at the foot of the stairs leading to Malik’s second-floor office.

Malik, a wealthy Pakistani Ahmadi in his mid-30s, says he has received several threats recently, including one in May in which a man came to the showroom and urged his driver to quit. "They told him, ‘Your boss is not a Muslim and we might do something to him,’ " Malik said. " ‘It’ll be better if you leave the job. We don’t want you to die with him.’

“For last the month, I can’t go to the gym, I can’t go anywhere to have dinner, can’t go to parties, I just stay home,” Malik said. “Every day I’m changing schedules, changing cars. Every day I’m telling someone I’m in Lahore when I’m really in Faisalabad, or I’m in Dubai when I’m actually in Karachi.”

Omar Ahmed, 27, keeps a pistol with him at all times and stations armed guards outside his jewelry store. Ahmed took over the shop after his father, Ashraf Pervaiz, was killed in the same hail of bullets that killed Masood’s father, Masood Javed, and his brother, Asif Masood. Ahmed says that if he could leave Pakistan, he would. But his predicament is the same as Naeem Masood’s: As elder sons, they have to stay for the sake of their families and the family businesses.

“We’re in a battlefield every day,” Ahmed said. “We have to live with the fact that we are Ahmadis.”

Ahmadis say they don’t expect much help from city police, who they say have shown little interest in solving crimes committed against their community. Masood said he recently visited police headquarters to ask whether investigators had made any progress finding the killers of his father, brother and uncle.

"They said, ‘You tell us the names of the gunmen, and we will go and capture them,’ " Masood said.

Rao Sardar, a top Faisalabad police official, said it’s not a question of police indifference but a simple matter of manpower. The Faisalabad district has a police force of 7,000 officers charged with securing a population of 8 million, he said.

“That’s a very low ratio, and that’s the problem,” Sardar said. “We’re doing all we can do.”

Ahmadis say police indifference is only part of the problem. Laws that brand Ahmadis, a minority regarded elsewhere in the world as a Muslim sect, as non-Muslims only serve to breed intolerance within Pakistani society, large segments of which are illiterate and easily swayed by radical imams and the country’s powerful patchwork of religious parties.

A neighborhood’s lack of reaction to an act of persecution against an Ahmadi often provides an example of that intolerance. A year ago, Laeeq Ahmed was driving home from work when, a few hundred yards from his house, gunmen sprayed his car with bullets. Ahmed’s wife, Nuzhat Laeeq, rushed to her husband, who was still alive but unconscious, and pleaded with bystanders to help. The crowd ignored her, she said.

Ahmed died the next day in a hospital. Later, witnesses of the slaying described to Laeeq what had happened, how the gunmen had celebrated afterward by chanting, “We have killed an infidel!” Despite the presence of witnesses, however, the crime remains unsolved.

“We believe that the government, its legal system and the people here won’t help us,” Laeeq said, speaking in a hushed, quavering voice behind a black veil. “The police won’t give us any kind of investigation. We have left our fate, and this case, up to God.”

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

I thought Qadiani discussions were banned from GS?

Pakistan doesn't need outsiders to define persecution. Qadianis are not persecuted. There's a law in place to give respect to Rasulullah, what's their problem? Let it be. You remove it, you'll regret it.

[quote="shami2k, post:54, topic:224380"]

Pakistan sect endures persecution

No Pakistaniminority is as victimized as the country's 4 million Ahmadis, who believe in Islam but are viewed by the rest of the country as heretics. There are even legal restrictions on them.QUOTE]

Mods this thread is misleading;

Qadianis are not a sect becauce under the constitution passed by the majority they are excluded from islam because they dont believe in the finality of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh)

how can a community be minority and a sect???

  1. "It is reported from Abu Hurairah (may Allah be pleased with him), that the Messenger of Allah (may peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), said: My likeness and the likeness of the prophets before me is the likeness of a person who built a house, made it beautiful and made it complete, except the place of a stone in the corner. So people began to go round and to wonder at him and say: Why have you not placed this stone? He (i.e., the Holy Prophet) said: I am that stone and I am Khatam an-Nabiyyin (the Seal of the Prophets)". (Al-Sahih al-Bukhari, Kitab al-Manaqib, ch. Khatam an-Nabiyyin; Al-Muslim; Tirmidhi, Abwab al-Manaqib, etc.) This hadithhas been mentioned in Sahih *of *al-Bukhari, al-Muslim, Imam Ahmad, Nasai and others with a slight difference in words but the sum and substance is the same. In some, the Holy Prophet is reported to have said that in the edifice of prophethood there was only one place left for a brick and he was that brick. And in some reports the words, ‘I am Khatam an-Nabiyyin’ and in some others that ‘prophets have been brought to an end with him’, have been added

  2. "The Day of Judgement will not be set up unless some tribes of my Ummah *have joined the polytheists and unless they have started worshipping idols. *And surely there shall be among my followers thirty liars, everyone of them asserting that he is a prophet, but I am *Khatam an-Nabiyyin *(the Seal of the Prophets). There is no prophet after me." (Al-Sahih al-Bukhari, Kitab al-Tauhid; al-Muslim, Abwab al-Fitan; Al-Darmi; Ibn Majah
    This hadith is also a unanimously accepted one

  3. "Surely messengership and prophethood have been cut off. There will neither be a messenger after me nor a prophet. His saying of this became hard on people so he said: Mubashshirat (good news) will be left. (Musnad, Imam Ahmad; Tirmizi

  4. "Prophets used to administer among the Israelites. When a prophet died another prophet became his successor. But there will be no prophet after me. Soon there will be *khalifahs *and they will be many." (Sahih of al-Bukhari and Muslim; Musnad of Imam Ahmad; Ibn Majah.

  5. There is nothing left of prophethood except mubashshirat (good news)." (Unanimously accepted

  6. "I am Muhammad and I am Ahmad and I am al-Mahi (the one who obliterates) by which God, the Most High, will help me efface unbelief; and I am *al-Hashir *(the gatherer) – at whose feet people will be gathered and I am *al-Aqib *(the one who comes last) after whom there is no prophet." (Bukhari, Muslim

  7. "I have been given superiority over prophets in six things… Prophets have come to an end with me" (Muslim, Nasa’i, Tirmizi

  8. "It is reported from Sa’d, son of Abi Waqqas, that the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), said to Ali: ‘You stand to me in the same relation as Aaron stood to Moses, except that there is no prophet after me." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Muslim, Mishkat al-Masabih, ch. Manaqib Ali

  9. "Had there been a prophet after me it would have been Umar." (Tirmizi ch. Manaqib Umar

This is about persecution of Qadianis and perfectly legitimate topic of discussion & all people of good conscious must speak up against this kind of discrimination/persecution. As for the outsider part, yea you living in Canada makes you an insider. And they are not persecuted?

[quote]
A neighborhood's lack of reaction to an act of persecution against an Ahmadi often provides an example of that intolerance. A year ago, Laeeq Ahmed was driving home from work when, a few hundred yards from his house, gunmen sprayed his car with bullets. Ahmed's wife, Nuzhat Laeeq, rushed to her husband, who was still alive but unconscious, and pleaded with bystanders to help. The crowd ignored her, she said.

Ahmed died the next day in a hospital. Later, witnesses of the slaying described to Laeeq what had happened, how the gunmen had celebrated afterward by chanting, "We have killed an infidel!" Despite the presence of witnesses, however, the crime remains unsolved.
[/quote]

Stop trying to hijack thread. We're not talking about anyone's religious beliefs. This is about persecution of Qadianis in Pakistan & what needs to be done to end that. What they believe or not is irrelevant here.

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

I think the number of posts about qadiani persecution on GS is greater than the actual population of the community in Pakistan.

[quote="“shami2k, post:13, topic:224429"”]

This is about persecution of Qadianis and perfectly legitimate topic of discussion & all people of good conscious must speak up against this kind of discrimination/persecution. As for the outsider part, yea you living in Canada makes you an insider. And they are not persecuted?
[/quote]

I can post more of these incidents targeted at sunnis and shias. doesn’t mean they’re persecuted.

abolishing the law will make no difference, it will incite more hatred and violence. but hey, you want to score points in world history books, go ahead, but don’t complain when more of these incidents occur, points of different kind will be scored then.

oh come on, stop being intellectually dishonest here. you quote an article by some Rodriguez character who probably has a cross on his chest, who says qadianism is a sect. give me a break. every sane Pakistani knows they’re not a sect. at least be honest here, maybe then we can discuss the “persecution” part.

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

whats there to hijack according to you the fact they being prosecuted be cause they claim to be muslims and i just wanted to prove via hadith that they are not because they tend to twist the meanings of Rasool and nabi.

fair enough; sine this is pakistan affairs forum lets talk geo stragitics and the relation of Qadiani community viv a vis Pakistan


QADIANI LEADERSHIP ESCALATES ANTI-PAKISTANI & ANTI-ISLAMIC ACTIVITIES

http://alhafeez.org/rashid/leader.htm


The Pakistani government and Taliban have a similar mentality, and it can prove to be very dangerous for the rest of the world, including the great nation we live in, the United States of America.
It is a well-known fact that Pakistan has nuclear weapons, and therefore I find that it is my duty as an American Muslim to warn all of my fellow Americans that we are in grave danger of another 9/11 if we don’t send our troops to Pakistan and put a just, democratic government into place. At this time, the Pakistani government is very supportive of the Taliban who are a group of violent oppressors that believe it is their duty to spread Islam by force.
God tells all Muslims in the Holy Quran that “there should be no compulsion in religion.” Chapter 2 Verse 257
Unfortunately, the Taliban and the government of Pakistan don’t understand this simple teaching of Islam, and I sincerely feel that this oppressive mindset will continue to allow the killing of thousands of innocent people of all faiths.
Before we allow the Taliban and Pakistan to gain further nuclear power, we must go into Pakistan and take away all of their weapons before we see a Hitler-like regime emerge, this time claiming that Muslims are superior to non-Muslims and wrongfully using Islam as a means of violence as done on 9/11.
To all my fellow Americans, all my Christian and Jewish friends, as well as Muslims, please write to your senator and representative, making them aware of the potential threat that the Taliban and the Pakistani government poses to the rest of us who desire to live in peaceful harmony. Please don’t take this matter lightly, as a Muslim, I clearly see the grave danger of the situation, and I ask for help from all those who are kind at heart.
God bless America and may God enable America to put an end to terrorism all around the world.
Jawwad Rushdi is a member of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community of York.

http://thecult.info/blog/2010/06/12/qadiani-ahmadiyya-chatter-on-pakistan/

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

[QUOTE]
The Ahmadi community's vulnerability was evident May 28, when Pakistani Taliban gunmen stormed two Ahmadi mosques in Lahore,
[/QUOTE]

just to clarify, this was not the tribal ttp of fata. they denied their role init. so various groups are jumping in now and until a group on the ground takes responsibilty foreign agencies cannot be ruled out

There was one attack on a Qadiyani place of worship and they cry very loudly about persecution, government negligence.

The people of Peshawar have been under attack for 3 years yet they have bravely soldiered on.

I am not justifying any attack on Qadiyanis or bellittling it but outside of Punjab your people are free and you pray freely.

Jawwad Rushdi needs help - he thinks more vuiolence will bring peace LOL

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

Every minority sect and minority religions in Pakistan suffer from persecution thanks to Zia's Islamization. In the early years of Pakistan no one suffered persecution thanks to Quaid-e-Azam's secular and democratic laws. But that ******* zia screwed everything up.

You are not only trying to justify it, but you're condoning it. As for what is happening in Peshawar and else where, there is no comparison. The govt is part of the problem and its instrumental in persecuting Qadiyanis by singling them out for their beliefs.

So it's the government's fault? Give me a break. Pakistan is majority Muslim state, if non-muslims wish to impersonate, the country has every right to protect it's people from the fitna which spreads by the infilteration.

If they are really persecuted as you say, they have the right to 1) obey the law or 2) move out. Now that's IF they're persecuted.

Your cries for persecution are hollow to say the least. Who owns some of the big businesses in Pakistan? My sunni chachas? LOL, qadianis do. So next time don't yell persecution like those Jews.

[mod]Hate talk will not be tolerated in this forum... please be decent and express yourself keeping dignity of every Pakistani community in your mind. We are a matured forum with majority educated forum participants where this kind of language is totally unacceptable. We have given you a chance to post again keeping a close watch on the way you behave. We have no objection if you have believe in something or have certain views different from majority of forum participants. But you must behave yourself and remain decent at all the time if you do not want to lose your posting rights again..[/mod]

yazdi i think asiq posts may be disrespectful to any who may like zia; how about sending him a warning…

i dont see why why cricketplaya got a warning… kindly point out where his pot was un dignified or even hateful…

Aashiq Quaid-e-Azam was secular.. really..

Quaid-e-Azam didn’t want a muslim country he wanted a country for muslims. Quaid-e-azam guaranteed freedom of religion for everyone in Pakistan. He didn’t lay out the shariah law, he didn’t make alcohol illegal, he didn’t make a law which would persecute ahmadis.
Some of his words were;
“You are free, free to go to your temples, you are free to go to your mosques or to
any other places of worship in this state of Pakistan.
You may belong to any religion or caste or creed that
has nothing to do with the business of state. … We are
starting with this fundamental principle that we are all
citizens and equal citizens of one state.”

If only Quaid-e-Azam lived a little longer than Pakistan would have been very progressive and tolerant.

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

Do people notice how many indians lurk on pakistan forums in the virtual world under pakistani disguises??? i have not seen any nation in the world obsessed like mads with another nation or their neighbours the way indian are with pakistanis. a very small of thousands of indians obsessed with pakistan, pakistani affairs & pakistani people admit that they are indians while they spread disinformation, lies, fabricated stories hate between pakistani communities but almost all of them 'appear' like pakistanis. they are all over. almost everywhere on the internet. they only purpose of life seems to be spreading their own internal sickness & hate against pakistan & pakistanis but using pakistani disguise to achieve the maximum exploitation & manipulation of pakistani ethnic, religious, social communities

the original poster is one such indian (amongst so many other here & on almost every virtual place on the internet which is about pakistan or pakistani people).

what does that tell you about indians?

Looks like now they are eyeing ahmedi community to put all their energies & efforts into exploitation & manipulation of this specific community to cause destablization of Pakistan. I am kind of concerned now what the new indian plans are involving ahmedi community of pakistan & how they can use this community against pakistan's existance now (after they've tried using sunni/shiite, mohahjir/sindhi, pathan/punjabi bullsh!t ofcourse)

Re: Pakistan sect endures persecution

^yea there should be some sort of flag counter telling who comes from which country.

I don't need certification from likes you. You should stick to your conspires theories and leave rational arguments to rational people.

so where in the speach does it say the country should be secular. or does Quaid e Azan say i am secular. in fact point out any one of his speeches where he says this unequivocally. people enjoyed the same probably greater freedom under Khalafat e Rashada.

kindly watch the videos i have posted then comment.