Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
I came to know that very recently
The delay caused due to dual policy of British rulers and their bureaucracy from Northern India, who discouraged use of Punjabi in Punjab. While British patronised Sindhi in Sindh (Sindhi’s current alphabet was developed during British era), they went in opposite direction as far as Punjabi was concerned.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
If you like to have a drink, Indian Punjab is heaven with damsels too :)
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
while we discussed it a little in a thread ( http://www.paklinks.com/gs/culture-literature-and-linguistics/562114-huqqa-mehmaan-aur-sikh.html ), how come free use of wine, etc is an acceptable norm in Sikh society? Khushwant Singh said that due to ban on smoking, most of Sikhs used to be bathroom smokers. With this perspective, I can’t understand open consumption of wine in Indian Punjab. seems @KKF’s line ‘ye sab deen se doori ka nateeja hai’ come to play here 
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
We must admit that Pakistani Film Industry or you can Say Punjabi Movies business was finished after murder of Sultan Rahi. Who can forget Maula Jatt even now every one will laugh on this movies but that movie did great business at that time.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
No doubt about it that he was a great actor, but he was typecasted. One after one , same role. If he lived longer, he might have lost the charisma which attracted his viewers.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
No doubt about it that he was a great actor, but he was typecasted. One after one , same role. If he lived longer, he might have lost the charisma which attracted his viewers.
but you knew about the viewers who watched his movies in cinema. They loved him and never got bored with his movies. Basically that was the poor class of our society who always tried to copy him.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
The pious one don’t, the impious like me can enjoy such pleasantries offered by nature god himself.
Generally those who drink are those who need god occasionally or never.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
The pious one don't, the impious like me can enjoy such pleasantries offered by nature god himself. Generally those who drink are those who need god occasionally or never.
In other words, you want to say majority of Indian Punjab turned atheist :)
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
In other words, you want to say majority of Indian Punjab turned atheist :)
No not atheist, they compromised on few things for enriching life :)
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
If you like to have a drink, Indian Punjab is heaven with damsels too :)
Just a small question is drinking alcohol accepted in Sikhism?
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
Just a small question is drinking alcohol accepted in Sikhism?
No.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
Punjabi movies do good business even in Sindh. examples: ChooRiyan, MuhabattaN SachiyaN.
You got Filmazia, Silver screen for Pakistani movies (including Punjabi movies) and they are on air for a decade or so, which says they got viewers. Apna is a Pakistani Punjabi channel.
Interestingly, there is a Pashto channel (something AUJ) which telecast not only Pashto movies, but also bolly movies dubbed in Pashto. Last week, they were showing SRK speaking Pashto in Rab ne bana di joRi :D
I think the Pashto channel is AVT
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
I think the Pashto channel is AVT
could be. I just forgot the name, but it did started with A.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
India is more developed than Pakistan and India’s economy is growing at a much faster rate. The same probably holds true for Indian Punjab as well. Punjab is still the most prosperous and the most developed province of Pak with a Human Development Index of 0.670, according to Wikipedia. India uses a consumption-based methodology to calculate HDI that differs from the conventional formula used by UNDP, and as such the figure for Indian Punjab is likely an understated estimate. But, interestingly, despite the different methodologies used, Wikipedia lists Tajikistan as a comparable country with similar HDI as both Indian Punjab and Pakistani Punjab. So perhaps both Punjabs have roughly similar levels of development.
Just like everywhere else, utilities are not free in Indian Punjab: Power tariff up by 9% in Punjab - Hindustan Times
That’s one of the perks of living in a secular state: if you want, you can have beer with your meal when dining at a restaurant. Or water. Or a soft drink like Sprite. So long as you’re an adult, it’s up to you to make a choice for yourself.
Anyway, while the other Punjab may lack a little in the drinks department, it is just as renowned for its food as Indian Punjab. There are even fancy restaurants specializing in cuisines from around the world: Top 10 restaurants in Lahore: Where to eat in 2015 - Pakistan - DAWN.COM
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
**As a minority in India, **Punjabi's in India are far more aware of their distinctiveness, and are more sensitive of the prospect off having their culture diluted and marginalized by greater India. Pakistani Punjabis being an overwhelming majority take their Punjabi-ness for granted as there is no perceived threat to their heritage as such. So while Sikhs feel compelled to protect their heritage, Pakistani Punjabis do not feel the need to do the same. So the hardcore aspect of Indian Punjab stems from the inherent insecurity of a minority culture. Indian Punjabis have to maintain their culture in its most pristine form, otherwise they would lose it. And it didnt help that most Punjabis went to Pakistan, leaving the remaining Punjabis a small minority in greater India..
Not sure that I agree with your first statement. Punjabis in India refers to people who trace their origin to the state, so they are as much a minority as people from say Tamil Nadu. Or did you mean Sikhs ? Not sure if you are aware but there are enough non-Sikh Punjabis in India.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
Not sure that I agree with your first statement. Punjabis in India refers to people who trace their origin to the state, so they are as much a minority as people from say Tamil Nadu. Or did you mean Sikhs ? Not sure if you are aware but there are enough non-Sikh Punjabis in India.
Thats a good point. Im referring to people who reside in Punjab, and speak Punjabi, view themselves as Punjabis. The Punjabis who most strongly identify with the Punjabi identity are the Sikhs. And I suppose in the case of India, when referring to those who most strongly associate with "Punjabi-ness," your likely thinking of the Sikhs.
But your right, i dont know how many people in India consider themselves to be of punjabi extraction but dnt speak Punjabi or reside in Punjab. But then those people have already lost to a certain degree that aspect of their cultural heritage. But still the questions of who is actually a Punjabi arises. So this is a bit more complex a topic then it appears on the surface.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
Thats a good point. Im referring to people who reside in Punjab, and speak Punjabi, view themselves as Punjabis. The Punjabis who most strongly identify with the Punjabi identity are the Sikhs. And I suppose in the case of India, when referring to those who most strongly associate with "Punjabi-ness," your likely thinking of the Sikhs.
But your right, i dont know how many people in India consider themselves to be of punjabi extraction but dnt speak Punjabi or reside in Punjab. But then those people have already lost to a certain degree that aspect of their cultural heritage. But still the questions of who is actually a Punjabi arises. So this is a bit more complex a topic then it appears on the surface.
True. There are enough non-resident Punjabis (Sikhs and others) in India whose cultural identity is still intact. Also Punjabis living in neighboring states i.e. Delhi, Haryana, Rajasthan, Himachal and Jammu are de facto Punjab residents due to the cultural similarities.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
True. There are enough non-resident Punjabis (Sikhs and others) in India whose cultural identity is still intact. Also Punjabis living in neighboring states i.e. Delhi, Haryana, Rajasthan, Himachal and Jammu are de facto Punjab residents due to the cultural similarities.
Well I guess "identity" in general is sort of a subjective thing. Who really is a Pakistani, or an Indian, or a Sindhi, Hindu or Muslim etc. We tend to use these labels to make things simple for ourselves in understanding who we are... But if we were to dissect our identity to such degrees, then no one is really who they say they are... Punjab itself is so diverse and "Punjabi" is hardly descriptive of an ethnic group...
For the sake of argument, I simplify it by assuming there is a genuine Punjabi Indian who is living in Punjab and speaks a generic form of Punjabi and is for all intents and purposes the stereotypical Punjabi, even though I know this distinction is more illusory then real.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
For the sake of argument, I simplify it by assuming there is a genuine Punjabi Indian who is living in Punjab and speaks a generic form of Punjabi and is for all intents and purposes the stereotypical Punjabi, even though I know this distinction is more illusory then real.
Interesting discussion :) I think I understand where you are coming from though since most Pakistani Punjabis live in Punjab (vs other parts of Pakistan) so there is some homogeneity there. However, cant really apply that to to Indian Punjabis since the Pakistani side is bigger than the Indian side, and most people who moved from the Pakistani side to India during partition ended up settling in various parts of India (not Punjab). Also, there has been a lot of migration driven by jobs etc which has spread people geographically.
There are many Punjabi families living in Mumbai for example who would fit the rest of the criteria you have mentioned. Bollywood is full of such people.
Re: Pakistan Punjab vs Indian Punjab
Interesting discussion :) I think I understand where you are coming from though since most Pakistani Punjabis live in Punjab (vs other parts of Pakistan) so there is some homogeneity there. However, cant really apply that to to Indian Punjabis since the Pakistani side is bigger than the Indian side, and most people who moved from the Pakistani side to India during partition ended up settling in various parts of India (not Punjab). Also, there has been a lot of migration driven by jobs etc which has spread people geographically.
There are many Punjabi families living in Mumbai for example who would fit the rest of the criteria you have mentioned. Bollywood is full of such people.
Ofcourse. Although there really isnt that much homogeneity in Pakistans Punjab either. Southern portions of Pakistan Punjab for example speak Seraiki, which as far as I know is similar but not the same as Punjabi. Also, as in India, the Punjabi language isnt confined to Punjab as many Kashmiris speak a Punjabi dialect, Hindko is also not considered Punjabi but is very similar to the dialect spoken in Northern Punjab.
But still even if the actual defintion of Punjabi is debated, there is still a very real sense of being "Punjabi" among a large segment of India. That segment which views their mother language as being Punjabi as distinct from Hindi. My point was that among that segment, Sikhs perhaps more then anyone else, have seen their Punjabi-ness as something that must be preserved because to them its something very real. That sense of BEING Punjabi, whatever that means, I think is instilled in them by the realization that there is a much bigger community of non Punjabi speakers. And the fact that there are so many people living outside of Punjab who claim to be from there but dont speak Punjabi as a mother tongue or view it as central to their identity, only deepens this insecurity over losing that cultural heritage regardless of whether the "Punjabi" identity was ever real of mythologized.
And yes many Indian Hindus who were from Pakistan Punjab did not settle in Indian Punjab. The "Dutts" for example, such a Sanjay Dutt etc are of the Mohiya tribe which hails from the Chakwal region of Pakistan Punjab. (Interesting fact about the Mohiyyas is that they are known as "Hussaini" Brahmin, as one of their ancestors fought at Karbala and lost his sons in the battle. So during Muharram they also take part in Shia traditions such self flagellation etc. The place where their ancestor lived in Baghdad is still know as "Al Hindia."). I dont think the Chakwali dialect is still spoken anywhere in India, although my father did once meet an old Sikh man who was from a town called "Neela Dulha" who was so excited to hear someone speaking in his Chakwali dialect after so many years.