Names of Hazrat Ali(R.A) children

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

Please dont get offencive from my posting. I am just learning. I love Hazrat Ali(R.A). I want to ask my shia friends that Hazrat Ali(R.A) 6th child name was Umar and tenth Uthman.
If he was hating those Sahabas as I perceive from some of the posts here or in majlisis I have attended why did he named his childrens name after them. And if did that why are shias not doing that. Who told them not to name children after these Sahabas. Who are you people following?

[This message has been edited by Degas (edited October 20, 2000).]

2

Ummm.......someone please reply......

I mean just for the fairness of it......

[This message has been edited by who---me (edited October 20, 2000).]

3

lol…

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/wink.gif

..what if people dont consider it important to reply. I mean who cares what anybody name their kids, we have more important issues to discuss brother who me. I guess its ok to name a kid anything, as long as its not a cunning name like Muawaya, Yazid, Iblees, Firaon, Namrood, IbneZiad, Omaribnesaad (yazid’s army leader in karbala, NOT the other Omar), Shimir, etc. These names may effect the kid’s nature, may, not always.

shair.

[This message has been edited by shair30 (edited October 20, 2000).]

4

degas i had no idea Imam Alis 6th and 10th sons were named umar and usman, but i sure will try to get an answer for that..but if anyone else has anything to say bout it please do

5

Never heard of that Degas!! Where did you get this info from?

6

Shakir75,
I thought every person knows that. Hazrat Ali(R.A) had 4 wives and 27 children. Fifth child was named Muhammad. Strangely I havent heard shias naming that even. The only point is that hazrat Ali died after Hazrat Abu Bakr, Umar and Uthman and he was in clear position to judge their actions. I havent found any evidence that he differed or accused them in any unislamic act during their khilafat.
You can ask any shia or sunni scholar about Hazrat Ali's children. Naming then after Those Sahabas is in my view a clear proof than trusting people who wrote things much after. May be Shair30 knows about this.

7

degas we all know one thing though..Bibi Fatima did not like abu bakr, he hurt her feelings

8

[quote]
Originally posted by Degas:
**Please dont get offencive from my posting. I am just learning. I love Hazrat Ali(R.A). I want to ask my shia friends that Hazrat Ali(R.A) 6th child name was Umar and tenth Uthman.
If he was hating those Sahabas as I perceive from some of the posts here or in majlisis I have attended why did he named his childrens name after them. And if did that why are shias not doing that. Who told them not to name children after these Sahabas. Who are you people following?

[This message has been edited by Degas (edited October 20, 2000).]**
[/quote]

Why do you guys asume that Hazrat Ali hated the sahabas? do you only have these few things do disgrace Shias? Hazrat Ali and the sahabas were good Friends and Hazrat Ali never got Angry! Hazrat Ali forgave his killer and you guys still think He hated the Sahabas! Cant you guys be more original?

9

Desert fox,
Looks like you are trying to pick a fight here.This is a decent thread so far.Let it please remain so.
"Why do you guys asume that Hazrat Ali hated the sahabas?"
I think you got the wrong idea here.We assume the opposite and that's why most reasonable people can't understand why some shias disrespect the sahabas?
"do you only have these few things do disgrace Shias?"
Who's trying to do that.I didn't see anyone doing that in this thread.Degas asked a simple question with good intentions.Again please don't pick fights where none are necessary.
"Hazrat Ali and the sahabas were good Friends"
Exactly!

10

[quote]
Originally posted by Ahmed:
Desert fox,
Looks like you are trying to pick a fight here.This is a decent thread so far.Let it please remain so.
"Why do you guys asume that Hazrat Ali hated the sahabas?"
I think you got the wrong idea here.We assume the opposite and that's why most reasonable people can't understand why some shias disrespect the sahabas?
"do you only have these few things do disgrace Shias?"
Who's trying to do that.I didn't see anyone doing that in this thread.Degas asked a simple question with good intentions.Again please don't pick fights where none are necessary.
"Hazrat Ali and the sahabas were good Friends"
Exactly!
[/quote]

Was I rude? If so I'm sorry you know people on this forum really rub me the wrong way!

Back to the topic Shias who are learned and wise know not to disrespect the sahabas! Its the radical few who ruin our image! most Shias wont say anything to The Sahabas other than "God knows which were right and which wrong and Allahs Curse be on the wrong ones!"

Hope you now get it!!

11

This thread is a total waste of time. Who cares what people name their kids, by the way i checked hazrat Ali never named any kid omar or usman. One of his kid's name was Mohammed Hanifia (r.a).

shair.

12

shair30,
This may be a waste of time for those who dont see beyond their narrow view. Can u provide of Hazrat Ali's children from any of ur source. thank God u admitted name Muhammad and if possible start naming children by this name.
This is very important as u would eventually realize how Sahabas inspite of their wordly differences got together and worked for the religion and how their petty differences were blown out of proportion by people who came centuries after.
People never mention how Hazrat Abu Bakr, Umar, Usman and Ali worked together in Islamic matters but keep on things that were not important. They were all humans trying to follow the right path.

13

degas ur first khalifa hurt Bibi Fatimas feelings, how can any decent muslim can do that??
read this:If Abu Bakr was wrong, either unintentionally or through good-will, Fatimah al-Zahara would have persuaded him; but she was
angry with him, because he refused to accept her argument and rejected her testimony and the testimony of her husband. She
became so angry, she even prevented him in her will from being present at her funeral. When she died, her husband buried her
secretly during the night. [72]

[72]Sahih, Bukhari, vol 3 p 36
Sahih, Muslim, vol 2 p 72

there is much more..so better go read ur authentic books first and then defend ur khalifas..

we shia believe that our Prophet, Bibi Fatima and our 12 Imam are infallible, that also shows the passion we have for our Prophet and his family..

The messenger of Allah (saw) said,

O People, I leave amongst you two things which if you follow, you will never go astray. They are the Book of Allah and my Ahl
al-Bayt [family].

He also said: The messenger of my God is about to come to me and I shall answer. I am leaving with you the two weighty
things: The first is the Book of Allah, in which you find guidance and enlightenment, and the people of my household. I remind
you, by Allah, of the people of my household... I remind you by Allah of the people of my household." [95]

[95]Sahih, Muslim, Chapter on the Virtues of Imam Ali (as), vol 5 p 122
Sahih, al Tirmdhi, vol 5 p 328
Mustadrak, al Hakim, vol 3 p 148
Musnad, Ahmed Hanbal, vol 3 p 17

Behold! My Ahl al-Bayt are like the Ark of Noah, whoever embarked in it was saved, and whoever turned away from it was
drowned. [107]

[107]Mustadrak, al Hakim, vol 3 p 151
Yanabi Muwaddah, Qundoozi Hanafi, p 30, 370
al Sawaiq al Muhriqah, Ibn Hajar, p 184, 234
Majmaa al-Zawaed, al-Haithami, v9, p168

Prophet also said He who hurts my ahle-bait hurts me..so if abu bakr hurt Bibi Fatimas feelings how can we have any respect for him?

all these references are from ur authentic books, because if i brought some from shia books u wouldnt have believed me..now prove me wrong

14

Sherazz, the question is about the children of Hadhrat Ali(ra), please stick to the argument and reply appropriately.

Degas has a point, prove it or accept it..

15

those names were common names during those days..even if he named them, doesnt mean he liked those people..my above post shows that these khalifa hurt him and his family..any sensible person can figure it out from it..u dont have to be ignorant bout it

16

“those names were common names during those days..”
and yes they are not very common today. Is that what you mean?

“even if he named them, doesnt mean he liked those people..”
even Ali(ra) hated them, he preferred to keep those names as there is very limited vocabulary of names in those days, is that the reason? If yazid is bad, why not Usman and Umar? Perhaps they also fall in the same category according to the fact you are narrating.

“my above post shows that these khalifa hurt him and his family..”
I am sorry to say that, your above post is according to your beliefs, your teachings and according to your sectarian agenda. There is nothing to be appreciated.

any sensible person can figure it out from it.. u dont have to be ignorant bout it”
thanks for the tip. Now please answer Degas.

17

rag tag i gave u references from ur own books..and u still have no answer for that..go read ur sahi bukhari for urself first..u wont really find any shia with those names now, i dont know of any..plus if Imam Ali named them umar and usman so what? maybe there would be alot of umar and usman in those days..since they were the biggest enemy of Ahle Bait we shia dont want to name our kids umar usman or abu bakr

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also if u want to prove a point please bring me some references from shia books, like i gave u some from ur sunni books..thank u

19

Sherazz wrote
"since they were the biggest enemy of Ahle Bait we shia dont want to name our kids umar usman or abu bakr"

These r ur own views and if u want to keep them and at the same time try to preach here no one will be persuaded.
Whatever differences that Hazrat Fatima and Hazrat Abu Bakr had were minor and were between and uncle and a niece. Even after the death of Hazrat fatima Hazrat Ali came close to hazrat Abu bakr. He was a memeber of Shura one of the six in Hazrat Umars Khilafat. He named his children during that period. If he was agrieved by Hazrat Fatimas ur so called treatment why did Hazrat Ali did all that.
Problem with u is that u dont follow Hazrat Ali. Islam is not a religion to be influenced by few family problems. Its a great religion.
If as u say shia dont want to follow Hazrat Ali its ur problem we will follow hazrat Ali.

20

[quote]
Originally posted by Sherazz:
they were the biggest enemy of Ahle Bait
[/quote]

Yaar sheraaz, I don’t think they were ever be against ahlay-bait, nor vice-versa. Even today I don’t see any non-shia abusing or insulting ahlaybait. Rather its the other way round. This is sad on your part that you consider such statements as the tradition of the Khulafa – the people for whom you even don’t find parallels on the canvas of Islam.

[This message has been edited by rag.tag.boy (edited October 21, 2000).]