My Hajj, experiences witnessing AT Towheed ----claim for saudia,

[sokoon]

Dear ibne sadique

Dear Ibne Sadique,

Assalam ale kum,

It is really sad that we muslims are still in the process of having superiority complexes.

If I am not wrong oil is in Reyad and 95% saudis in Reyad are shias. They never ever thought the way you think.

Now shall I inform them to be aware of your thinking, do not you think they would be alarmed.

They think we/ they all are muslims. And the king is their's.

Is not this, now, the kings, if have to servive they have to take shias of saudia as there friends. I think you are aware of the fact, that kings have asked saudias shias to help them in this bad time. And those good people have promised to see that their kingdom should stay.Because AKHWANUL MUSLEMIN and most of the wahabees are against Kingdom.

Although if you turn the pages of history, you would find that Mouhalla KHOULLA in which only shias were living, was encircled with oil and all were made to charred in that.

Are you muslim or just khulafaei. Be first muslim then think about the differences, between different casts of muslims.

It is wrong to say kaaba is just a place to do some arkans, GOD never comes and places himself in KAABa. It is a place where muslim ummah,and those who are rich stay for so many days. They must discuss their problems, and must find there solutions.

Do you exactly know what is sunnah means ??

If yes! tell me why Prophet did not get jeroselum in his life???? Did he do mistake. He forgot to do such an important work. So for many things God did not left time for him to tell or do; as these are small things and are not AHKAMS from GOD"S side.

God has given us aqal also. Why shall we not be thankful of this blessing also. And use it. Look at the AATABE ELLAHE on muslim ummah after that event . The graph started going down and down. If they would have discussed the problem that day, we would have been out from this enemety of america in those, few years to come.

This is HAQ Truthful BAAT you accept it or not.

Now I am discussing about sunnat as you all take ;following is just one or two small example.

I am sure you would not agree, but still let me write. You can ask with you biggest Moullana of Ahadeez-------who have made Ahadeez tree so difficult, so many kinds, and so much unnecessary they speak, just to pose their importance.

How many witnesses are required for adultration--zina

I am sure they would say two men,or one man and two ladies.

So dear you. How come you would give witness of some act which is now a days carried out in cemented rooms of a big home.Second thing no one is going to place a camera in that room for witnesses.

So this kind of MUTAFIQ ELLEH ahadeez when does not make sense in this technologically advanced environment you, talk about, how to utilise the time in Hajj.? HE(P) used to not do discussion those days.

One always have plenty of time over there in those hajj days, now adays. No one can do ebadat all the time 24 hours round the clock.

Before in Prophet's time it used to be tiresome .It was, perhaps difficult, then, to geather together. But do you know if he might have been talking or speaking with some people of his choice then. Were all khlafas used to be glued to him all the time?.

Any way regarding Witnesses of Zina.:

App key sunnat key haqeqat bus etnne hey:

The objective was do not punish until you are sure. So people used to unable to blame an innocent for such act. Because those days also no body could do such acts openly.

So to make sure today you have DNA test. Your old witnesses are useless today, and were useful to save non doers of zina.

This is the correct sunnat today do DNA test. for ZINA GAR criminal.
your AHADEEZ many of them, can not work today, mind it.

Use your brain open your mind ,see the objective of ahadeez that is sunnat not what those people used to do.

Also Hazrat Ayesha(R) was saved with ILZAM of opposition to have bad character due to these shahadats. Otherwise when she was left behind in QAFELLA many people could have raised finger on her.This was the way shahadatz were useful in those days. Later Aayat came and etc etc but at first place no one could bring any shahadat.This is the way it used to save people from being blamed by opposition parties.

This is reality., fact.You can not implement that environmental acts in todays technically advanced time, where we have airconditioned KHANAEI KAABa.We perform Hajj million times comfortablly as compared to our Rasoul's time. We save lot of time. They perhaps could not.

Another thing , Iraneans pay money for every expenditure, so do pakistani, you are totally unaware of the fact. Rather saudian earns more money than they spend on Hajj.

Please read twice before you start ---passing your Fatwa.

Wassalam sokoon

[inuit]

*Originally posted by Ibn Sadique: *

Hajj is not the occasion and place for political marches and protest rallies. Sanctity of the place and occasion does not allow it.

It was wrong of the authorities to grant permission to the Iranians to hold demonstrations in that place. But once they had granted it, it was wrong of them to suppress it with brutal force.

I don’t think it was due to religious differences but politics. This kind of incident has never happened before or since. I am sure that if Al Qaida were to hold protests or rallies in Hajj time, the Saudi authorities will act with more brutality if not equal.

The cry of the oppressed Muslims of Chechenya, Bosnia, Palestine and other places can be heard clearly and these issues are not even addressed at the largest gathering of Muslims annually. Our Hajj should not only be dry rituals but it should promote internationalism full of benefit for the material and spiritual life. The Hajj provides the Muslim community with an opportunity for social intercourse which can also promote trade, scholarship, knowledge, understanding and political harmony. It should also serve to realise the spiritual yearning and for revival of the values of Islam which the present afflicted and anguished Muslim world needs.

HAJJ: Annual Convocation

[At-Tawheed]

[QUOTE]
but what is tawagheet????
is it a plural form of taghoot????
if yes, then in which language....
and by what rule....
[/QUOTE]

Taghoot is derived from the word Tughyan. Linguistically, it means something that goes over and beyond the limits/beyond the boundaries.

The definition that we use in the Sharee'ah means anything that is worshipped besides Allaah. Whether that is a Scholar, Money, Rulers etc.

Tawagheet is the plural of Taghoot.

So I say the Tyrant Oppressive Dictator Fahad in the Arabian Peninsula is a Taghoot. Singular.

But when I say the Rulers in all our Lands are all Tawagheet. Plural.

And it is in 'Arabic. Yes.

[QUOTE]
Hope i never get on sister At-Tawheed's bad side... ouch!

[/QUOTE]

What I wrote in my post was not suposed to offend, defame, bellittle anyone on the forums. And if that is the way that it comes across, I apologise to everyone, but that was not my intention when I wrote it.

And if I have slandered or spoke ill of anyone unjustly, please let me know. And I will Inshaa-Allah take back what I said.

Peace be upon those who seek the Guidance.

[Ibn_Sadique]

Re: Dear ibne sadique

*Originally posted by sokoon: *
Dear Ibne Sadique,

Assalam ale kum,

It is really sad that we muslims are still in the process of having superiority complexes.

If I am not wrong oil is in Reyad and 95% saudis in Reyad are shias. They never ever thought the way you think.

Now shall I inform them to be aware of your thinking, do not you think they would be alarmed.

They think we/ they all are muslims. And the king is their’s.

Is not this, now, the kings, if have to servive they have to take shias of saudia as there friends. I think you are aware of the fact, that kings have asked saudias shias to help them in this bad time. And those good people have promised to see that their kingdom should stay.Because AKHWANUL MUSLEMIN and most of the wahabees are against Kingdom.

Although if you turn the pages of history, you would find that Mouhalla KHOULLA in which only shias were living, was encircled with oil and all were made to charred in that.

Are you muslim or just khulafaei. Be first muslim then think about the differences, between different casts of muslims.

It is wrong to say kaaba is just a place to do some arkans, GOD never comes and places himself in KAABa. It is a place where muslim ummah,and those who are rich stay for so many days. They must discuss their problems, and must find there solutions.

Do you exactly know what is sunnah means ??

If yes! tell me why Prophet did not get jeroselum in his life??? Did he do mistake. He forgot to do such an important work. So for many things God did not left time for him to tell or do; as these are small things and are not AHKAMS from GOD"S side.

God has given us aqal also. Why shall we not be thankful of this blessing also. And use it. Look at the AATABE ELLAHE on muslim ummah after that event . The graph started going down and down. If they would have discussed the problem that day, we would have been out from this enemety of america in those, few years to come.

This is HAQ Truthful BAAT you accept it or not.

Now I am discussing about sunnat as you all take ;following is just one or two small example.

I am sure you would not agree, but still let me write. You can ask with you biggest Moullana of Ahadeez-------who have made Ahadeez tree so difficult, so many kinds, and so much unnecessary they speak, just to pose their importance.

How many witnesses are required for adultration–zina

I am sure they would say two men,or one man and two ladies.

So dear you. How come you would give witness of some act which is now a days carried out in cemented rooms of a big home.Second thing no one is going to place a camera in that room for witnesses.

So this kind of MUTAFIQ ELLEH ahadeez when does not make sense in this technologically advanced environment you, talk about, how to utilise the time in Hajj.? HE(P) used to not do discussion those days.

One always have plenty of time over there in those hajj days, now adays. No one can do ebadat all the time 24 hours round the clock.

Before in Prophet’s time it used to be tiresome .It was, perhaps difficult, then, to geather together. But do you know if he might have been talking or speaking with some people of his choice then. Were all khlafas used to be glued to him all the time?.

Any way regarding Witnesses of Zina.:

App key sunnat key haqeqat bus etnne hey:

The objective was do not punish until you are sure. So people used to unable to blame an innocent for such act. Because those days also no body could do such acts openly.

So to make sure today you have DNA test. Your old witnesses are useless today, and were useful to save non doers of zina.

This is the correct sunnat today do DNA test. for ZINA GAR criminal.
your AHADEEZ many of them, can not work today, mind it.

Use your brain open your mind ,see the objective of ahadeez that is sunnat not what those people used to do.

Also Hazrat Ayesha(R) was saved with ILZAM of opposition to have bad character due to these shahadats. Otherwise when she was left behind in QAFELLA many people could have raised finger on her.This was the way shahadatz were useful in those days. Later Aayat came and etc etc but at first place no one could bring any shahadat.This is the way it used to save people from being blamed by opposition parties.

This is reality., fact.You can not implement that environmental acts in todays technically advanced time, where we have airconditioned KHANAEI KAABa.We perform Hajj million times comfortablly as compared to our Rasoul’s time. We save lot of time. They perhaps could not.

Another thing , Iraneans pay money for every expenditure, so do pakistani, you are totally unaware of the fact. Rather saudian earns more money than they spend on Hajj.

Please read twice before you start —passing your Fatwa.

Wassalam sokoon

Dear Sokoon

Wa ‘Alaykum Salaam

It is really sad that we muslims are still in the process of having superiority complexes.

I think you have understood me wrong, I was just responding to brother ravage’s post directed to me. I just stated the facts. No way has my post smacked of superiority complex.

The gist of my argument was that with absolute ‘control’ of Makkah and Madinah, the Shias were always allowed to perform Hajj by their own fiqh. There was no nor there is at present any hindrances on them to perform Hajj the ‘Sunni way’.

The Shias have their Muallims and organizations to conduct their affairs.

There are restrictions also placed on Sunnis who want to do ‘things’ that the Prophet (saw) never did or recommended.

If I am not wrong oil is in Reyad and 95% saudis in Reyad are shias. They never ever thought the way you think.

Sorry, you have got yours facts wrong.

Riyadh is hard core Wahabi area if I were to use your terminology

Most of the Saudi oil in the Eastern Province on the Gulf. Majority of the Shia live in this province in the cities of Qatif and Al Hasa.

I am sorry again - the shias are not the majority in this province but only around 33%. It is a wrong impression that the authorities in Saudi Arabia are ‘stealing Shia oil’.

I am giving you 2 independent links and an extract from one of them.

Of the 17 million Saudis, between 900,000 and 1 million adhere to the Shia branch of Islam; they live predominantly in the kingdom’s oil-rich eastern province, where they make up about one third of the population.

http://encarta.msn.com/text_761575422___5/Saudi_Arabia.html

http://www.metimes.com/2K3/issue2003-22/opin/new_hope_for.htm

Is not this, now, the kings, if have to servive they have to take shias of saudia as there friends. I think you are aware of the fact, that kings have asked saudias shias to help them in this bad time. And those good people have promised to see that their kingdom should stay.Because AKHWANUL MUSLEMIN and most of the wahabees are against Kingdom.

Yes, the Saudi authorities are desperate and desperate people do take desperate actions to save themselves. They are desperate for support from any section. Overall Shias make around less than 6% of the Saudi population - can’t be of much help - and they too have memories of what transpired before.

Although if you turn the pages of history, you would find that Mouhalla KHOULLA in which only shias were living, was encircled with oil and all were made to charred in that.

I am sure the above incident did take place and I wouldn’t be surprised. Unfortunately such things are always happening in history. Every innocent blood split will have to be answered for.

King Abdul Aziz, the founder of Saudi Arabia also slaughtered his own die-hard supporters whom he had used to come to power.

http://www.arabies.com/Special%20Report/Ibn%20Saud.htm

Many of the ikhwan refused to honor Ibn Saud’s acceptance of the new borders, and their continued raids into Hashemite territory forced Ibn Saud’s hand. Persuasion having failed, Ibn Saud sent a radio-equipped fleet of automobiles carrying troops and modern arms to Sabilla in March 1929. The ikhwan chieftains, contemptuous of Ibn Saud’s adoption of Western ways, spurned a final offer for reconciliation, and they and their followers were mowed down by machine guns. Ikhwan resistance continued into the following year, but their defiance could have only one end.

Is it not the case in human nature that one who carries the stick tends to use it?

The Sunnis in Iran are feeling the stick from the Shia in power.

The Dismal Reality of Ahlus Sunnah in Iran - Interview

The Dismal Reality of Ahlus Sunnah in Iran

Is there a single capital city in the world without a Sunni mosque, with the exception to Tehran -the capital of the Shi’ah-, which has forty Christian churches and a cemetery for the Baha’is?

There is no Sunni director in any of the government authorities, ministries, embassies, or local and provincial governments, hospitals or principalities; not even in the lowest government posts anywhere in Iran.

Whilst we are living in the twentieth century, we find a third of the population of a nation deprived of their most basic rights. Is there any other country on the face of the earth which prevents its people from choosing names like Umar, A’ishah, Hafsah, Abu Bakr, Zubair…

continued…

[Ibn_Sadique]

[QUOTE]
It is wrong to say kaaba is just a place to do some arkans, GOD never comes and places himself in KAABa. It is a place where muslim ummah,and those who are rich stay for so many days. They must discuss their problems, and must find there solutions.
[/QUOTE]

Hajj is part of worship of Allah (swt) and should be performed on the Sunnah of Rasool Allah (saw). We do not go to Kabaa to see Allah (swt) and no one claims that He comes there.

You say that *“those who are rich stay for so many days. They must discuss their problems, and must find there solutions”. *

Do you mean to say that solving the problems of the Ummah should be discussed by the Rich ONLY?!!?

Where did you get this from?!!?

So your criteria is for ONLY the rich to solve the Ummah problems?!!?

King Fahd and his princes and that of the other Gulf sheiks are the richest among the Muslims; so you must be very satisfied that they are at the helm of Ummah affairs!!

So Ulemah have no criteria for you?

[QUOTE]
Do you exactly know what is sunnah means ??
[/QUOTE]

Maybe I could be wrong; Please try to explain to me. I am always willing to learn.

[QUOTE]
Also Hazrat Ayesha(R) was saved with ILZAM of opposition to have bad character due to these shahadats. Otherwise when she was left behind in QAFELLA many people could have raised finger on her.This was the way shahadatz were useful in those days. Later Aayat came and etc etc but at first place no one could bring any shahadat.This is the way it used to save people from being blamed by opposition parties.
[/QUOTE]

Sorry, you are wrong here again. The only witness for Hazrat Ayesha(ra) was Allah (swt) Himself. [Read Sura Noor]. There were no human shahadats!

[QUOTE]
Another thing , Iraneans pay money for every expenditure, so do pakistani, you are totally unaware of the fact. Rather saudian earns more money than they spend on Hajj.
[/QUOTE]

The above is true and I never claimed that Saudis do a favour upon anyone.

[QUOTE]
Please read twice before you start ---passing your Fatwa.
[/QUOTE]

Please can you show me the Fatwa that I have passed?

Was-salaam

[Ibn_Sadique]

*Originally posted by inuit: *
The cry of the oppressed Muslims of Chechenya, Bosnia, Palestine and other places can be heard clearly and these issues are not even addressed at the largest gathering of Muslims annually. Our Hajj should not only be dry rituals but it should promote internationalism full of benefit for the material and spiritual life. The Hajj provides the Muslim community with an opportunity for social intercourse which can also promote trade, scholarship, knowledge, understanding and political harmony. It should also serve to realise the spiritual yearning and for revival of the values of Islam which the present afflicted and anguished Muslim world needs.

HAJJ: Annual Convocation

Inuit - - Thank you for the link; which belongs to Sufis [names in the link given below], need I say more. You will have whirling derwishes and qawali singers there too!

Imam Irshad Soofi
Chisti Nizami Habibi
Habibia Soofie Aastana
Pietermaritzburg
South Africa

Hajj is a religious duty for all the Muslims. We go to Hajj to carry out the rituals prescribed in the Quran and the Sunnah of the Prophet (saw). Any other actions such as that you have listed [trade, scholarship, knowledge, understanding and political harmony] should be carried away from Hajj vicinity and be carried out among the intelligentsia or by the people specialized in the above fields and not by people marching up and down, holding rallies and shouting death to this and that or death to the Shaytaan. Neither should it be an occasion to score national or political points.

[Sheraz_CT]

shias should be banned from holy places? lol

i m ..i’d just ignore the bitch..its not even worth it

[ThandyMazaq]

*Originally posted by Sheraz CT: *
shias should be banned from holy places? lol

i m ..i’d just ignore the bitch..its not even worth it

since you cursed a sister, i want to respond in same manner,
but i guess i shouldnt…

[little_human]

*Originally posted by Sheraz CT: *
shias should be banned from holy places? lol

i m ..i’d just ignore the bitch..its not even worth it

Stop the name calling.

[Ibn_Sadique]

*Originally posted by Sheraz CT: *
shias should be banned from holy places? lol

i m ..i’d just ignore the bitch..its not even worth it

Sister At-Tawheed - Ignore the above with patience. Your reward is with Allah (swt).

[Sheraz_CT]

if this is the attitude..she will be rewarded allright

LH…sowieee

[At-Tawheed]

Funny.

[sokoon]

Reply to ibne Sadique,

Hello!

Many things, what you wrote I have to leave it to God; The best judge.

I just want to clarify one thing which you have misunderstood. Regarding Aiysha(R).

You totally misunderstood. I have written the same what you have written.

I have written no one from opposition could brought any shahadat against her. So her AEZZAT was saved because of this sunnat to bring four shahadats.

Our Rasoul had undoubtedly doubt on her character, so he had left her to her parents home. She stayed there, almost one month, until aayat revealed.

I wrote this ahadeez became/and can only be implemented to save some ones AEZZAT, such as in case of Aeysha (R).

Regarding Iran I do not know any thing about them ,except I am witness to bad ,ill, behaviour of saudia on them on Hajj days.

Regarding shias in saudia, I heard on alam tv. I do not know much.

Regarding burning shias: When I visited saudia, about 3 times prior to Hajj,We used to take only one taxi. He was Jafferi and he told us this story.

I had gone to saudia just to perform umraas and hajj . That's all.

There also one Pakistani told us about their bad character stories after stories etc etc , I did not write it to you.

I just wrote a real story, and that also due to the fact that when I read At- Tauheed thread I thought they are really so ------- But kindly re read your replies, to see how much you have poison against ----

Take care sokoon

[Ibn_Sadique]

Re: Reply to ibne Sadique,

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by sokoon: *
Hello!

Our Rasoul had undoubtedly doubt on her character, ............
[/QUOTE]

Our Rasoul had undoubtedly NO doubt on her character,

[sokoon]

Re: Ibne Sadique

Hi!!

If you believe it that way; fine. It does not make any difference to me. But ;since I think through logic, what can I do?

I analyse, why shall he(prophet(P) had left her for almost one month after that instance?, until the Sora Barat revealed. There is no logic except what I thought. I am sorry if it made you sad to listen to my thinking. Bye sokoon

[Ibn_Sadique]

^
[QUOTE]
But ;since I think through logic, what can I do?
[/QUOTE]

I am sure that all the readers of your posts can notice the immense effort your on part to use logic to put forward your points of view. But honestly I think that your posts suffer from two ailments:

1) Maybe you think out your viewpoint in your mother-tongue [Punjabi/Gujarati], compose it in Urdu and then post it in English making (your post) at times incoherent.

2) You tend to base your arguments on wrong facts. (Example quoted below from your post in this thread)

[QUOTE]
If I am not wrong oil is in Reyad and 95% saudis in Reyad are shias.
[/QUOTE]

Now coming to your point raised in this post, tell me, as a Shia, do you believe that the Prophets (asa) (and your Imams) have complete knowledge of all the events in the past and whatever is going to occur in the future?

A simple YES or NO will suffice.

[sokoon]

Re: Ibne Sidique

Hi!!

I am not at all shia. We are going to have one imam which is going to come near qayamat. How did you feel that I am shia?

In fact anyone who starts thinking about religion would ask questions and you would put the person in shias block or Barelvi block.

I have given you the answer about the quotation ,you have mentioned I was wrong; that I got this information from a person from saudia,who used to drive us from one place to another, and his name was jaffri.

Regarding your question; I think as the teacher of my prophet and my imam is and was and would be GOD himself ;therefore both the person would know past and future along with present, as I believe they have a teacher who is the perfect one in this world.

Dear Ibne Sidique Just now a question arose in my brain, that there were two wars Jung saffeen and junge jabal; if I am not wrong.

Both these wars were between ALi and AIyesha(R)

Since you read the books let me know which of the two was right?

Since it is impossible that in a war both are right?

If you think Aiyesh(R) was right then please let me know the reasons for your choice.

And if you think Ali was right then give me reasons for your choice.

Would you write impartially please?

Thanks and regards.

[At-Tawheed]

[QUOTE]
Since you read the books let me know which of the two was right?
[/QUOTE]

If your not a Shee'ah why bring up a question like this!? What benefit will you gain from it?!

Did not Allaah 'Azza wa Jall protect you from the Fitnah that occured beween the Companions?

Then what right do you have to talk about it with your tongue.

Keep your tongue clean from mentioning any of their faults that occured after the death of the Messenger.

By Allaah It does not concern you!

Sokoon all you need to know about that fight is what al-Haafidh raheemahullaah said:

"Ahlus-Sunah have agreed that it is obligatory to forbid cursing anyone of the Companions due to the fighting that took place between them even if those on the right were known. This is so becuase they did not fight each other except after considering themselves upon the Truth, and Allaah, the Most High, has excused the one who errs in striving to reach a correct ruling. Rather, it is established that the one who errs will be rewarded with one reward and the one who is correct in his judgement will recieve two rewards." (Fathul-Baree 13/34)

[At-Tawheed]

al-Imam al-Maymoonee said: Ahmad ibn Hanbal said to me:

"O Abu al-Hassan, if you see a man mention any of the Companions with evil, then question his *Islaam*!"

"It is not allowed for anyone to mention anything of their errors (the Companions) nor insult any of them. Whoever does this, then it is upon the leader to punish him and not to forgive him but rather to confront him and call him to repent. If he repents, it is accepted from him. If he does not repent then he is again confronted and kept in jail until he repents and turns back" (as-Sunnah of al-Imam Ahmad).

Shaykh al-Islaam Abo 'Uthman as-Saaboonee said: "And their postion (Ahlus-Sunnah) is that one should withold their tongues regarding what occured between the Companions and to purify the tongues from what is considered finding fault or defciencies in them and they hold the position of asking mercy for them and loving them."

[Ibn_Sadique]

Re: Re: Ibne Sidique

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by sokoon: *
Hi!!

I am not at all shia. We are going to have one imam which is going to come near qayamat. How did you feel that I am shia?

In fact anyone who starts thinking about religion would ask questions and you would put the person in shias block or Barelvi block.

I have given you the answer about the quotation ,you have mentioned I was wrong; that I got this information from a person from saudia,who used to drive us from one place to another, and his name was jaffri.

Regarding your question; I think as the teacher of my prophet and my imam is and was and would be GOD himself ;therefore both the person would know past and future along with present, as I believe they have a teacher who is the perfect one in this world.

Dear Ibne Sidique Just now a question arose in my brain, that there were two wars Jung saffeen and junge jabal; if I am not wrong.

Both these wars were between ALi and AIyesha(R)

Since you read the books let me know which of the two was right?

Since it is impossible that in a war both are right?

If you think Aiyesh(R) was right then please let me know the reasons for your choice.

And if you think Ali was right then give me reasons for your choice.

Would you write impartially please?

Thanks and regards.
[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE]
I am not at all shia.
[/QUOTE]

Sorry, sounded so to me, but nor problems.

[QUOTE]
Regarding your question; I think as the teacher of my prophet and my imam is and was and would be GOD himself ;therefore both the person would know past and future along with present, as I believe they have a teacher who is the perfect one in this world.
[/QUOTE]

Masha ‘Allah! So the above should answer your statement quoted below:

“Our Rasoul had undoubtedly doubt on her character”

Now, you tell me, how can the one who is the perfect one in the world and whose teacher is God himself, and that person who *would know past and future along with present * can have doubts about anything?!!

This person having the knowledge of past, and the future along with the present should have known everything that transpired to have no doubts at all! Do you agree?

By saying that “Our Rasoul had undoubtedly doubt on her character” ** you are casting doubt that he had any knowledge of ** “past and future along with present”.

Now let’s have your logical answer to the above.

[QUOTE]
Dear Ibne Sidique Just now a question arose in my brain, that there were two wars Jung saffeen and junge jabal; if I am not wrong.

Both these wars were between ALi and AIyesha(R)
[/QUOTE]

Sorry, to correct you yet again, there was only one war between Hazrat Ali (ra) and Hazrat Ayeisha (ra), namely Battle of the Camel.

The other war, Battle of Siffin, was fought between Hazrat Ali (ra) and Hazrat Muawiyah (ra).

In these both battles Hazrat Ali (ra) was on the right and his opponents were on the wrong because their ijtihad was wrong. But they were sincere in reaching their wrong decision as there was no ulterior motive or malice.

This was confirmed by Hazrat Ali (ra) himself when he stated the following:

*“The thing began in this way: We and the Syrians were facing each other while we had common faith in one Allah, in the same Prophet (s) and on the same principles and canons of religion. So far as faith in Allah and the Holy Prophet (s) was concerned we never wanted them (the Syrians) to believe in anything over and above or other than what they were believing in and they did not want us to change our faith. Both of us were united on these principles. The point of contention between us was the question of the murder of Uthman. It had created the split. They wanted to lay the murder at my door while I am actually innocent of it.... * - [Nahjul Balagah Letter No. 58]

And following has been said by Hazrat Muawiyah (ra):

Al-Dhahabi narrated in "Sayr A'alam Al-Nubala'a" from Ya'ali bin Ubayd from his father who says: Abu Muslim Al-Khulani and some others went to Mu'awiyah and asked him: "Do you dispute Ali or are you equal to him? Mu'awiyah answered: "By Allah no. I know he is better than I am, and he has the right to rule, but do not you know that Uthman was killed as an innocent? And I am his cousin and the seeker of his revenge? Therefore go to Ali and tell him to send me Uthman's murderers then I will obey him." They went to Ali and talked to him, but Ali refused to hand in Uthman's murderers to Mu'awiyah. - Sayr A'alam Al-Nubala'a, vol.3, p.140]”

Anyway these are historical matters and everyone has their own version of history. We don’t take our religion from history. Prophet Muhammad (saw) had conveyed the full message of Islam before he passed away. History is very subjective & erroneous matter to be included as source for religion.

[QUOTE]
I have given you the answer about the quotation ,you have mentioned I was wrong; that I got this information from a person from saudia,who used to drive us from one place to another, and his name was jaffri.
[/QUOTE]

Just to let you know that most of the taxi drivers in Saudi Arabia are government paid informers (so, be very careful next time you are there) and they are mostly most uneducated and ill-informed from the rest of Saudi population as a whole (that’s the reason that they can only be employed for driving taxis and eavesdropping).

Don’t take what Jaffri told you as the ‘gospel truth’.