Muslim Woman in Florida Sues to Wear Veil for Driver's License

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Someone should inform this woman that driving is a privilege and not a right, follow the rules or don’t drive.

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ORLANDO, Fla. - Experts in Islamic law are being called to testify in the lawsuit of a Muslim woman fighting a state order to take off her veil for her driver’s license photo
Sultanna Freeman, 35, says Florida’s insistence on photographing her face violates her religious rights.

“I don’t unveil … because it would be disobeying my Lord,” Freeman testified Tuesday at the start of her non-jury trial.

Assistant Attorney General Jason Vail argued that having an easily identifiable photo on a driver’s license is a matter of public safety.

“It’s the primary method of identification in Florida and the nation,” Vail said. “I don’t think there can be any doubt there is a public safety interest.”

Freeman’s attorneys argue that state officials didn’t care that she wore a veil in her Florida driver’s license photo until after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks, an allegation the state denies.

“This is about religious liberty. It’s about whether this country is going to have religious diversity,” said Howard Marks, an attorney for the American Civil Liberties Union (news - web sites) of Florida.

Both sides planned to call experts in Islamic law at the trial, which continues Wednesday. A copy of the Quran has been entered into evidence.

Freeman, a convert to Islam previously known as Sandra Kellar, wore her veil for the photo on the Florida driver’s license she obtained after moving to the state in 2001.

Nine months later, she received a letter from the state warning that it would revoke her license unless she returned for a photo with her face uncovered.

Freeman claims her religious beliefs require her to keep her head and face covered out of modesty and that her faith prohibits her face from being photographed.

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She is obviously from the south asia where women even cover their mouth and nose. Where as Islam allows women to reveal their face but cover their head. People like this make a mockery of islam and muslims everywhere. She needs to go and read the Holy Quran herself instead of some mullah or her husband telling her.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Astronut: *
She is obviously from the south asia where women even cover their mouth and nose.

[/QUOTE]
You probably didn't read the article before jumping to conclusions. Here is what it says "Freeman, a convert to Islam previously known as Sandra Kellar". South Asian, huh? :)

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
You probably didn't read the article before jumping to conclusions. Here is what it says "Freeman, a convert to Islam previously known as Sandra Kellar". South Asian, huh? :)
[/QUOTE]

Ok my bad! :) But the bottom line is she should just wear a hijab and not that ninja outfit. Islam does not tell women to only show their eyes.

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actually if I recall correctly, covering the face is not liked and is not a religious stipulation. So someone may wantto correct her on this. Nowhere in Islam does it say that women should be dressed like batman.

kher anyways, having biometric ID devices will help in future for ppl like this lady. cuz they will be identified by their eye :D

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *
actually if I recall correctly, covering the face is not liked and is not a religious stipulation. So someone may wantto correct her on this. Nowhere in Islam does it say that women should be dressed like batman.

kher anyways, having biometric ID devices will help in future for ppl like this lady. cuz they will be identified by their eye :D
[/QUOTE]

Mr. Fraudia.. thats an incorrect assumption :)

The truth is that using the veil is considered preferrable, and covering the head (aka the hijab) is considered allowed. Ulemas have debated over whether the veil is compulsory or not, but ALL ulemas agree that wearing the veil is much more preferable.

If you need the related fatwas, references etc, I can forward them to you. And if you DO feel that covering the face is disliked, then instead of making statements it might be better to provide sources for your claim? :)

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Ammar, I am curious that if wearing the veil is so much more preferable, then why are muslim women not required to cover their faces at the most demanding of Islamic faraidh, Hajj, especially since during that time, there is a huge inter-mixing of males and females.

The quranic verse is as follows:
*024.031 *
YUSUFALI: And say to the believing women that they should lower their gaze and guard their modesty; that they should not display their beauty and ornaments except what (must ordinarily) appear thereof; that they should draw their veils over their bosoms ...

PICKTHAL: And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest, and to display of their adornment only that which is apparent, and to draw their veils over their bosoms ...

SHAKIR: And say to the believing women that they cast down their looks and guard their private parts and do not display their ornaments except what appears thereof, and let them wear their veils over their bosoms ...
The command of veil just mentions "bosoms" not face, however the ayat goes ahead and says "and not display their beauty except to their husbands". I don't see it specifically says they have to "cover" their faces. Then again, I may be wrong in how I am reading the ayat. Please share your knowledge.

Jazak Allah

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That's still better than putting your Angotha impression on Shanakhtee Card. The women is obviously a knuckehead looking for her 15 minutes of fame. Does she have a hole on her Hijab to sip Coke or Pepsi when she has to drink? What about eating? Does she mean to imply that she eats in seclusion when no one is watching her so her poise-ness can stay intact? It is jerks like her that give Islam a bad name. She has no problem getting her photo plastered all over the press, but she can't bother to have her photograph taken for a license. Idiots in Islami disguise.

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She may be doing a wrong thing by not allowing herself to be photographed for driving license but still I can't call her 'Stupid', 'Idiot' because of her style of 'Purdah'. If its her choice then she should allowed to follow any kind of 'Purdah'.

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Faisal,

Something being allowed in one circumstance does not necessarily mean it will be allowed in another. The basic reason (as far as I understand) is that it is very easy to get lost amongst the crowd, and it would be a hard time telling women apart if everyone was wearing the same black veil.

(which is why, regarding the original topic I will state that the lady in question should allow her picture to be taken as 1) it is for safety reasons 2) it is the law of the land)

About wearing the veil at Hajj:

Hadrat Aisha says: “A woman in a state of Ihram (during Hajj and Umrah) should stretch her head - cloth over to her face to hide it.”

  • Fathul Bari

Narrated 'Aisha (Radiallahu anha) who said, “The riders would pass us while we were with the Messenger of Allah ). When they got close to us, we would draw our outer cloak from our heads over our faces. When they passed by, we would uncover our faces.”

Now onto the verses: So are you stating the covering the bosom is the only requirement??

Again, you’re ignoring the verses which state that ‘O Prophet! Tell your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks all over their bodies. That will be better, that they should be known so as not to be annoyed. And Allâh is Ever Oft_Forgiving, Most Merciful’ (Al-Ahzab 33:59)

Regarding this verse:

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 6, Book 60, Hadith # 282
Narrated Safiya bint Shaiba (Radhiallaahu Ánha) "Aa’ishah (Radhiallaahu Ánha) used to say: "When (the Verse): “They should draw their veils over their necks and bosoms,” was revealed, (the ladies) cut their waist sheets at the edges and covered their faces with the cut pieces.

Sahih Al-Bukhari Volume 1, Book 8, Hadith # 368
Narrated 'Aa’ishah (Radhiallaahu Ánha) Rasulullah (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) used to offer the Fajr prayer and some believing women covered with their veiling sheets used to attend the Fajr prayer with him and then they would return to their homes unrecognized. [Is it possible to return unrecognized if the face is not covered???]

Please keep reading…

Abu Dawood Book 14, Hadith # 2482
Narrated Thabit ibn Qays (Radhiallaahu Ánhu): A woman called Umm Khallad came to the Prophet (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) while she was veiled. She was searching for her son who had been killed (in the battle) Some of the Companions of the Prophet (Sallallaahu Álayhi Wasallam) said to her: You have come here asking for your son while veiling your face? She said: If I am afflicted with the loss of my son, I shall not suffer the loss of my modesty.

Abu Dawood Book 32, Hadith # 4091
Narrated Aa’ishah, Ummul Mu’minin (Radhiallaahu Ánha) “May Allah have mercy on the early immigrant women. When the verse “That they should draw their veils over their bosoms” was revealed, they tore their thick outer garments and made veils from them.”

The truth is faisal that I can keep going. It is indeed preferrable to wear the face veil, however it is definitely not obligatory.

So instead of boring you, I will just forward you to this page where you can read more.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by fatehahmad: *
She may be doing a wrong thing by not allowing herself to be photographed for driving license but still I can't call her 'Stupid', 'Idiot' because of her style of 'Purdah'. If its her choice then she should allowed to follow any kind of 'Purdah'.
[/QUOTE]

And she makes the rest of us as muslims look weirdos in the eyes of the world by being the 'ambassador' of islam through the media. I don't think so.Things like these should be cleared to the western world by real Islamic scholars. Even though I agree many are trying to but incidents like these just create a greater misunderstanding of our faith.

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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by ammarr: *
It is *indeed preferrable to wear the face veil, however it is definitely not obligatory.
[/QUOTE]
That is all there is to it. Preferable or not, it is most certainly not part of any fard or wajib, which will raise to the level of "attacking here religious faith" in this particular case.

She chose to cover her face with veil. She can also chose to wear gloves and socks at all times along with dark glasses.
Are they preferable? Maybe. All of these (hands, feet and eyes) can be considered part of beauty, and to be hidden.
Is covering them a part of Islam? Not really.

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Yeh I can agree with that :) Its not obligatory, and she is infact violating the law of the land

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
That is all there is to it. Preferable or not, it is most certainly not part of any fard or wajib, which will raise to the level of "attacking here religious faith" in this particular case.

[/QUOTE]

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ammarr

maybe my choice of words was incorrect, but the point was the covering the face is not an required and is not an obligation as you just noted.

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Fraudia what got on my nerves was that people are actually poking fun at her.. stuff like she's from South Asia and making remarks such as what she is doing is not from Islam.

As long as we know that yes it is something that is preferred, and people respect that then I see no problem.

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well one less female driver on the road :k:

I say she should apply for one in the Holy country of Saudi Arabia… wait.. whatchoo sayin’.. women can’t drive there veil or no veil??? hmmm okaaaaaay.

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MY favorite is Saudi Arabia....

Driver’s identification rules in Muslim nations:

Saudi Arabia: Women aren't allowed to drive

Iran: Women wear a traditional Shadour, which does not cover the face.

Egypt: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

United Arab Emirates: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

Oman: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

Kuwait: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

Qatar: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

Bahrain: Women do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

Jordan: Women can drive if their faces are covered but do not cover their face in I.D. pictures

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Originally posted by ammarr: *
**Fraudia what got on my nerves was that people are actually poking fun at her.. stuff like she's from South Asia and making remarks such as what she is doing is not from Islam.*

Poking fun is one thing, but again covering teh face is a personal choice, it is not required. and what she is doing is not mandatory or required, its something that some women do either due to personal preference or cultural norms in some places.

*As long as we know that yes it is something that is preferred, and people respect that then I see no problem. *

by saying "it is preferred" if you mean that it is preferred in religious terms then you are incorrect.

if you say that it is her own preference than it is correct.

and..if it is her own preference, then she should not state it as a religious duty and a must.

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Fraudia it is preferred in religious terms.

The Quran infact does not specifically state any garment which should be worn and points to dressing modestly. The Quran also tells us to follow the Prophet as he is the best of examples, and that his wives are the best of believing women.

If we look into the lives of the Prophet, his companions, their wives etc it is evident that they all covered their faces. I have posted my sources above.. hmm and as i stated before it is wiser to make claims with reference..

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ammarr: *
The Quran also tells us to follow the Prophet as he is the best of examples, and that his wives are the best of believing women.
[/quote]

used out of context!

The 'example' the Prophet is supposed to present is of following monotheism.. this does not mean adopting his personal clothing preferences or culturally/regionally necessitated dress codes he may have followed.