Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
No 9 year old is mentally ready for marriage. Were you?
I know 40 year olds that aren't "mentally" ready for marriage...whatever. Can the psychobabble and do be a good lad and admit that notions of acceptable marriageable age do indeed vary across time and place...
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
If want to accept that there was a time and place for 9 year olds to be married, we must admit that other things people did 1400 years ago (that people treat as gospel), actually do indeed vary across time and place...
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
9 year olds don't have the mental maturity to marry. Nor do 13-year olds.
Mental maturity is subject to what needs to be accomplished to fit within a society. Centuries ago there was not much needed in terms of becoming an active member of the society and hence regarded as mature. Intellectual pursuit and earnings potential was not a hinderance to being regarding as mature. Generally, maturity is a measure of how much you know about the society you live in. Physical maturity and mental maturity are not proportional either.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
Psychological and emotional maturity are necessary to manage the relationship with the husband, his family and all the responsibilities that come with marriage. A woman needs a little more experience before adults decide what and with whom she is goind to do with the rest of her life.
A young girl is going to be at the mercy of an older man for everything, becoming a virtual slave, play toy or both. Why would a man even want to marry a child? Marriages are supposed to be partnerships. Not, father/daughter relationships.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
Psychological and emotional maturity are necessary to manage the relationship with the husband, his family and all the responsibilities that come with marriage. A woman needs a little more experience before adults decide what and with whom she is goind to do with the rest of her life.
A young girl is going to be at the mercy of an older man for everything, becoming a virtual slave, play toy or both. Why would a man even want to marry a child? Marriages are supposed to be partnerships. Not, father/daughter relationships.
Given the state of todays girls I would not argue with that whole sole. However like I said it depends on the state of the society or ones environment as a whole. I have seen especially among Arabs many females get married at ages 13-14 and so far I have not seen anything wrong with them psychologically or mentally. They do all in-house and outside chores very well. They are good mothers and move around in society and even study. Maturity is relative to the environment you live in. For a boy who is a farmers son, he needs little maturity to assimilate into the family profession and is probably only hindered by physical strength to carry on the profession of his family. There is not much learning needed to bare the full responsibility of the profession and lifestyle. However if you drop that same boy into fast-track city life, he'd be lost. So his maturity level is relative to the society he lives in. In one society or environment he is perfectly mature enough to carry out all tasks and responsibilities whereas in another he might appear as a complete buffoon. Have you ever seen Crocodile Dundee?
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
Mental maturity depends on the environment you were brought up in. If i go back to pak, to some pind, there are young kids i would say probably more mature and tougher than me.
In a rough environment, where you are not cushioned from birth, and are required to take on adult roles from a young age, from looking after younger siblings, cooking for everyone, bringing in water, their roles are serious in that thier survival more or less depends on it. Hence; these kids adapt to their adult roles and grow up much earlier then their counterparts elsewhere.
secondly; the idea of marrying young girls is not specific to Islam. It was not long ago where the age of consent for girls in europe and US was ten years old. At present its 16, which lets face it; is not that mature an age in this day an age at all. So if you're looking at the mental maturity argument, it doesnt really flow,.... 'cept back in the pinds maybe.
Thirdly; ancient christian and jews (mentioned in the talmud and bible) permitted marraige to girls way younger than 10!! so if youre going to judge, id take off my rose tinted glasses and look across the whole spectrum.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
Given the state of todays girls I would not argue with that whole sole. However like I said it depends on the state of the society or ones environment as a whole. I have seen especially among Arabs many females get married at ages 13-14 and so far I have not seen anything wrong with them psychologically or mentally. They do all in-house and outside chores very well. They are good mothers and move around in society and even study. Maturity is relative to the environment you live in. For a boy who is a farmers son, he needs little maturity to assimilate into the family profession and is probably only hindered by physical strength to carry on the profession of his family. There is not much learning needed to bare the full responsibility of the profession and lifestyle. However if you drop that same boy into fast-track city life, he'd be lost. So his maturity level is relative to the society he lives in. In one society or environment he is perfectly mature enough to carry out all tasks and responsibilities whereas in another he might appear as a complete buffoon. Have you ever seen Crocodile Dundee?
First off, 13-14 years old is a LOT diffrent than 9. I don't care what century, society or profession you are in.
But there just isn't enough time for a young girl to even know what she wants out of life to be married off to some old man. She will be morphed into whatever the husband wants her to be (if HE is lucky), and that's just not fair.
Anyway, what can a man possibly get out of marrying a young girl?
Using your analogy, a girl will never have the chance to find out if she wants the farm life or big city life, her choice has been taken away before she could make it.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
First off, 13-14 years old is a LOT diffrent than 9. I don't care what century, society or profession you are in.
But there just isn't enough time for a young girl to even know what she wants out of life to be married off to some old man. She will be morphed into whatever the husband wants her to be (if HE is lucky), and that's just not fair.
Anyway, what can a man possibly get out of marrying a young girl?
Using your analogy, a girl will never have the chance to find out if she wants the farm life or big city life, her choice has been taken away before she could make it.
Peace Seminole
13, 14 and 9 and so on are not absolutes i.e. they are not covered for every person. Those girls not ready for marriage 'individuals' will not get married at even 16 years, but those who can and will are allowed to get married.
One person's 9 year old can be more mature than another person's 12 year old. I totally disagree with climate argument also. Even within western society you will see some girls become in understanding of their womanhood earlier than others. My sisters for example have been kept back from maturing mentally and man girls their age are already using their sexuality to entice boys but also some furthermore are having full on relationships. My cousin's daughters are 9 and 11 and they look older and more sexually aware than my sisters who are in their mid teens.
More than environment, genetics dictates the maturity of a person.
Now to answer the question about why would a man want a girl ...
The answer why a man would want a youthful wife is so she can spend her stronger years taking care of the children. She will learn about life young and when she gets older she will become very wise and experienced in life matters.
The reason why a woman may want an older man is to have financial support and to be in a position of care and safety. Your attitude towards relationships suggests a modernist approach which tends to contradict natural inclinations where the majority of women are more happier and suited in positions where they have minimum responsibility not maximum by becoming a partnership in the global sense. Islam puts most of the responsibility on the man and women do like this; despite wanting equality in this era they internally want more to be done for them.
The concept of women choosing their hubby's a large proportion of women choose men who resemble their own fathers. You are mistaken if you think that women are inclined towards the same age in their men. Even in today's Western society you will find few Westerner males where their wives are older than them. Having said this, there is no reason to prohibit any age difference either way.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
First off, 13-14 years old is a LOT diffrent than 9. I don't care what century, society or profession you are in.
But there just isn't enough time for a young girl to even know what she wants out of life to be married off to some old man. She will be morphed into whatever the husband wants her to be (if HE is lucky), and that's just not fair.
Anyway, what can a man possibly get out of marrying a young girl?
Using your analogy, a girl will never have the chance to find out if she wants the farm life or big city life, her choice has been taken away before she could make it.
When you realize that todays society and its norms are different from the socities centuries ago, then this discussion can go forward otherwise not. You are acting obstinate to win the argument rather than focus on the realities of today and centuries ago. Its simply wrong to compare the two societies and judge its people using the same yardstick. Its not rocket science to understand that.
Re: Muslim attitudes towards rape [split: Muslim Women Gang Raped.. ]
If want to accept that there was a time and place for 9 year olds to be married, we must admit that other things people did 1400 years ago (that people treat as gospel), actually do indeed vary across time and place...
Depends on how it was said. There is NO commandment in Islam to marry a 9 year old. Nor do we have to dive deep into cheap-shot rhetoric to abuse historic figures just because a certain salient practices (be it marriage customs or mode of transportation) no longer are practical.