Mullahs, Aids, sex and condoms

The title is deliberately intended to create a shock-effect. (BTW, if there can be perverted&pointless threads in Life 1, then i see NO REASON whatsoever for anyone to have objections about this thread). If we get complacent about this issue, then it will only wreak havoc upon our country - make no mistake about that. Your children & grandchildren will have to deal with the effects of our complacency. If this issue is treated with the social and fiscal seriousness it deserves, we can still hugely affect the ending for the better, Insha’Allah. Before anyone judges anyone else, walk a thousand miles in their shoes. Even then, you don’t have the right to judge anyone. Whatever they have done, however they have contracted the disease, Allah will deal with that - just as He will deal with the sins i, and everyone else, have committed. Our job is not to judge.

The Imam below sums it up perfectly.

**Battle to beat Pakistan’s Aids taboo**, Paul Anderson, BBC, 1 December 2004

Pakistan is a good example of a country that is learning fast but late about the threat of HIV/Aids.

Unlike India, recorded prevalence in Pakistan is small and the authorities are working to keep it that way. However, there are still plenty of complaints that government departments and NGOs have done little to help those infected or indeed have any idea of the full extent of the problem.

Pakistan’s hosting of a big Aids conference this week to mark World Aids Day on Wednesday may help. The conference is focusing on the effects of Aids on women and young girls. Delegates from south and south-east Asia have converged on Islamabad for three days of ministerial and expert discussions.

For Pakistan, like most Muslim countries, HIV/Aids remains a taboo subject. The official count of the number of people infected, just under 3,000, is dismissed by experts as an irrelevant distraction which masks the true extent of the challenge ahead. The problem is where to start. There is little testing, tracking or counselling, let alone treatment, of those most at risk.

Some health experts, like Dr Asif Mirza from the Family Planning Association of Pakistan, believe that the country is on the brink. “This is definitely going to explode and we are afraid of that day and we must prepare ourselves for that,” he says. “We are not actually diagnosing people. The people are not coming to the surface. The first case was diagnosed in '87. Even after 17, 18 years we still talk about stigma and discrimination. And the people who are already diagnosed, we don’t look after them properly. We don’t provide them proper information. We don’t even test their families. Of course, government is doing a lot but still I think there’s work which needs to be done.”

Shukria Gul, the first woman with HIV in Pakistan to come out publicly and campaign on behalf of fellow sufferers, now counsels those who have nowhere else to turn. She contracted the disease from her husband who received a contaminated blood transfusion and later died. “The doctors treated me as if I had an illness you get from just touching people. In my neighbourhood people started pointing at me, saying ‘she’s the one with Aids’.”

Shukria set up one of Pakistan’s few direct support groups and her experience has made her highly critical of government departments dealing with HIV.

“They give money to agencies who do nice work on paper. Maybe they do work but I haven’t seen any of it on the ground. Aids will never be contained unless small grassroots groups like mine are supported, so we can spread the message of prevention by direct contact.”

In recognition of the unique reach of religious leaders, the message is also being spread in mosques across the country. Aids activists have mobilised them for sermons and impromptu sessions.

One such cleric, Maulana Shams ur-Rehman, says: "The Prophet Mohammed said most of the plagues that afflict man occur when he strays from God’s path.

“But it’s not right to ostracise anyone with HIV. It’s the duty of every Muslim to help other Muslims. We have to increase awareness and prevent the spread of Aids.”

There is the same message from a vastly different quarter. Pakistan’s sex workers say clients know little about Aids and even less about safe sex. Sex worker Sayeda in Lahore says most clients do not even know what a condom is.

“When we give them to them they say ‘what’s this?’ But I send people away if they refuse to use them.”

Prevention of HIV infection is clearly Pakistan’s best hope but it only works through collective awareness and effort, and that is still a long way off.

excellent article Nadz.. as always :)

its sad that people get treated like this... sadly it reminds me a recent indian movie i watched (Phir Milenge..) it deals with the same thing. As in dealing with aid and an HIV affected person..

its unfortunate, that regardless of these issues being brought to light, so little is done about it..

quote:

One...cleric, Maulana Shams ur-Rehman, says: "The Prophet Mohammed said *most of the plagues that afflict man occur when he strays from God's path. *

But it's not right to ostracise anyone with HIV.** It's the duty of every Muslim to help other Muslims.** We have to increase awareness and prevent the spread of Aids."

1 I am a bit confused. If a man is dying of plague it is because he strayed from the god's path and god punished him. so once again why you want to save people who God has punished? aren't you working against His will doing so?

2 typical Mullah mind.....love for humanity extends only upto other muslims.

I dont think its a taboo subject to talk about but i agree, if someone is infected fingers r raised “why”.

Although we all know the reason of infection could be any, even a lil old used blade of a barbar’s shop.

sadzzz : the movie is a copy of “philadelphia” staring tom hanks & D. washington, if u havent, i suggest u watch it…one of the greatest movie of all time.

:bravo:

interesting article nadia.

a similar stigma is attached to a HepC that unlike Aids is actually quite prevalent in pakistan. one of the biggest causes of HepC/AIDs in pakistan, unlike other places, are hospitals sadly. both for doctors and for patients.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Yogi: *

2 typical Mullah mind.....love for humanity extends only upto other muslims.

[/QUOTE]

^ typical banya mind, where does the post say that its the duty to ONLY help other muslims.

there were some threads on more or less the same issue last year, so I thought of posting their urls, just in case…

http://www.gupistan.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=124820&highlight=HIV%2FAids

http://www.gupistan.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=128569&highlight=HIV%2FAids

nadia, now almost every thread title of urs has to do something with sex. I think u need to get a man.

lussi grow up...how will u feal if somebody gave the same reply to your sister or mum???.

lol Alli beta...why don't u post with ur real nick?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by lussi: *
nadia, now almost every thread title of urs has to do something with sex. I think u need to get a man.
[/QUOTE]

Odd comment in a thread about AIDs.

A bit off topic, but on CBC today a doctor was mentioning something interesting related to AIDs.It seems that a lot of people overlook the population of elderly folks who also have AIDs.This was about Canada btw.

I guess the key is awareness of such issues.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by underthedome: *

Odd comment in a thread about AIDs.
[/QUOTE]

what's so odd abt sex?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by lussi: *

what's so odd abt sex?
[/QUOTE]

Nothing. Suggesting someone needs to "find a man" because they bring up the topic of AIDs is what's strange.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by underthedome: *

Nothing. Suggesting someone needs to "find a man" because they bring up the topic of AIDs is what's strange.
[/QUOTE]

i think u need to read my post again...

They actually had a show on HIV in Pakistan on GEO’s ‘Uljan Suljan’ yesterday. If anybody is interested, they are continuing the discussion of AIDS/HIV in Pakistan on their next show which I believe will be next Tuesday evening.

Anyway, a woman was on the show telling of her experience, how she got HIV and how she was treated by doctors in Pakistan when they diagnosed her. Actually, I think it may have been Shukria Gul who was on the show. :confused: Her husband was working in South Africa when he was in an accident. He needed blood and he was given HIV contaminated blood. He had no idea, came home and ended up passing HIV to his wife.

Rather than helping her deal with the disease, the doctors ended up blaming her and implying she was promiscuous. The doctors themselves were not really aware of all the details about the disease other than it is ‘bad’ and she felt as if she had no support or help at all. It’s still very taboo to even discuss it in Pakistan.

They had some other doctors on the show trying to increase awareness and even talking about the need for people to use protection if they are going to be sexually active.

Another interesting point which was brought up on this show was how it should be mandatory for all people who are getting married to have blood tests the way it is done over here in the West. That way, people can find out before hand if their future partner has any disease and they can decide then and there if they want to go through with the marriage. Right now, no tests are done which is why so many people end up passing on diseases unknowingly to their partners.

The doctors on the show were also discussing how many doctors reuse needles on different patients which also helps spread HIV. There seriously need to be some guidelines and punishments implemented against irresponsible doctors cause most of this is avoidable.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ravage: *
interesting article nadia.

a similar stigma is attached to a HepC that unlike Aids is actually quite prevalent in pakistan. one of the biggest causes of HepC/AIDs in pakistan, unlike other places, are hospitals sadly. both for doctors and for patients.
[/QUOTE]

i know... the HepC situation is awful in pakistan. I know cus a lot of family members back home suffer from it and its mostly due to some simple surgery they had in their childhood where docs used dirty needs and utensils.... same thing happened to my mum

lussi, the topic dragged u into here huh... what does that say bout u?

Very Good to read Nadia.. But I dont think Our thinking Style Can be changed so Quick.

WE all know that ONE of the Reasons among all other reasons having HIV is sexual envolement. But Our Society is not Yet That Grownup.
As sex is considered something very very bad, so when ever the person become HIV +ve.. the First thing comes to mind… Oh.. He/she has Comitted a Crime… they are sinners… bas.. Dont talk to them.. etc etc

Its only the Awareness… and.. I fully support that we should educate the people about it.

But I will Blame the Person or Persons who Announced AIDs as a SEX orieted desiese.

I remember when I first heard of it and read about it , the maiN stress was on SEX.

Later different statments came.. that There are lots more Reasons for it… and blah blah

Now its Realy hard to Take that image of HIV from our ppl’s minds. BUt… offcourse we should try :slight_smile:

:wave:

JONY… offcousre… Phledelhia is Outstanding movie and TOM hanks tou .. Tabahi :smiley:

Thanks everyone for the informative replies.

Sadzzz, aww… Thank you :slight_smile: “Phir milenge”… hmmm i haven’t seen that one. Was it good?

By the way, you mentioned the issue of Hep C. i didn’t realize it was that serious… Thanks for sharing your thoughts on that, i appreciate it.

Yogi, nah i don’t that’s what the Mullah intended. Anyways, whatever, i really don’t want to get into arguments about what this particular Mullah intended to say. i think his comments are very positive; you obviously disagree. Baat khatam :flower1:

Jony!!! meray dost, How you doing? :flower1: i haven’t seen Philadelphia either… that’s on my must-watch list now. Is that where the song “Streets of Philadelphia” comes from (Bruce Springsteen)?

Ravage, Yes you are right… i never even thought about Hep C. Thank you for bringing that up.

Minerva, Thank you :~)

UTD, Thank you :~)

Mehnaz, wow thanks that was very interesting. Unfortunately i don’t get GEO :~( Yesterday was World Aids Day, hence this thread. i went to this talk yesterday, and the main speaker (a reporter from the Globe and Mail) mentioned that the #1 at-risk group, in sub-saharan Africa, for HIV-contraction, are monogamous married women. They get it from their husbands who sleep around. i wonder if that is true of other regions in the world? The idea of testing for it before marriage is obviously a very useful idea and would be very helpful…but i think, it would be a huge huge taboo to even raise that question wouldn’t it… i can’t imagine a situation where the family of one party asks the other, however diplomatically, that they would like the other family’s son/daughter to be tested for it. That would be true of Canadian society as well, because where i live - there is huge stigma against this issue. Maybe if it was made mandatory governmental policy (to be tested before marriage)… hmm now there’s a cool idea.

Golden Scorpion, Thank you so much for your positive reply. It is much appreciated. :flower1: :wave: i agree with all of your comments you posted.

i should have mentioned in my first post - the article focuses upon Pakistan, but to be honest - this is an issue that i think every society, every SINGLE society on this planet, is facing - with the stigmas, taboos, et al. Everyone can be embraced by ignorance.

Thanks all :slight_smile: i thought i would get anday tamaatar hurled at me, but on the contrary, the majority of replies seem to be quite mature Masha’Allah. wow maybe the times - they are a-changing;~) for the better, Insha’Allah.

PTV in 1995-96 aired a drama directed at AID patients & some other taboos in Pakistan society. The drama stopped airing after a few episodes. I am trying to remember its name .. does anyone else remember it? I think the star of the drama was Jamal Shah & he probably wrote it too.