So if you have already decided that you are not a Muslim then why do you have to proclaim this here again and again? You can go live your life and leave us alone to live the way we want to.
The same can be said about you , No body is shoving Islam down your throat on these boards. You are the restless soul who wants to believe that Islam is not a true religion but you cannot find your peace. 1.2 billion Muslims have found their peace in Islam no matter what you say or do they are not going to agree with you. But you are looking for ones who would agree with you. You will find 4.8 billion who agree with you and have their own website you can go and find your peace there.
But then you wished to go through it one more time. Why ? care to share ?
I am not sick of you asking questions but I feel that you are scared to let go and not firm in your belief of Islam not being religion of truth. If you had that belief you would not try this way or that way to get a definitive answer about the falsehood of Islam.
Yes our belief is firm and that gives us peace of mind and solace , you are still dangling with an straw . May Allah help you. Ameen.
No you did not , you will come back and tell us that you have been through this 21 times and want to believe one last time that Islam is not a true religion and you want to go work with Pope.
I can see that you were born in a Muslim family and that is a big problem for you , you cannot let go of what was instilled in you from your childhood. So why fight it ? What will you loose if you believe in what you do not want to believe in ?
I have told you in another thread belief is a lifelong struggle. Specially for those who think , and it is a big test. May Allah show you the right path. Ameen.
What makes you think that if you can prove that Mohammed(SAW) married more wives than he(SAW) was allowed to , you have found a definitive answer to your search for truth ?
Then you will work to find answer to bigger questions.
For example, If everything needs a creator , then who created the creator ? Do you have definitive answer to this question ? I do not. That is why I believe in one single creator Allah and Allah’s profit(SAW). The day I can find answer to this question and you can find definitive answer to this question I will join your ranks, till then Alhumdulliah , I am a Muslim.
^I think she wants to be the devil's advocate to get her peace.
She wants to become muslim again but the doubts come either from her or by reading material out there.
She wants completely satisfactory answer at her own standard and is unable to find.
OP has not accepted any other religion either and she does find islam to be most fascinating. Weather it is because of her earlier part of life or her own research, not known.
Eventually she will find the answers, only of she looks at the right places instead of internet.
Advice to OP: Throw your computer in garbage if you want to use it for seeking knowledge of faith! Meet with real people, Muslims or whatever religion, and ask questions from real people of knowledge. You are wasting your time and making others amused of your half baked ideas.
Go join the peace corp. Nothing wrong with it. Why try to 'threaten' others with it? :)
I can’t go on with life, I want to see things from your perspective, from my family’s perspective, I just don’t get it! When muslims criticize everything else, why don’t they hold Islam to the same level of interrogation/questioning? The definition of morality is worlds apart from what it used to be centuries ago yet Muslims hold on to the definition of morality in the Quran.
Technically, you are. My entire community is muslim like you, everything they do from eating to what they wear to what profession they choose has to be in accordance with Islam. And my family is not even all that typical either!
I say absolutely nothing because I don’t want to upset them..but Islam is embedded in my lief to the point I can’t leave it behind even if I want to. Someone says something and I start wondering, I start looking for answers and then I end up here eventually.
I am restless and have always been!I have forever asked questions not just about Islam but about everything in general. Islam is a true religion, it’s a religion and that’s exactly what it is- organized. I am not here to get people to agree with me. I am just trying to see things from your perspective…and then when I do see it, it makes no sense.
For the same reason you want to belong to a group (your family & community). I don’t want to feel like an outcast so I keep trying..I find my peace and then someone says something in regards to Islam that how it’s so peaaceful and that sends me looking for answers yet again. Then I flip through the pages of Quran to find pertinent interpretations and find nothing…maybe I just don’t get it! Am I dumb or am I not reading what they have read? How do you take a verse out of the Quran and interpret it in a way that fits your definition of morality? You are ok with taking the verses out of context as long as they justify your actions, but then the same people turn around and curse those terrorists who are infact doing the exact same thing!
I will admit, I am scared to let go. You want to know why? Because if anybody has read the Quran, they know how horrible the punishment is for nonbelievers and Allah will null all good deeds of a nonbeliever. I love my God, I ask for forgiveness from my God, but this Allah of Islam categorizes humans in slaves, masters, concubines, prisoners, men(a degree higher than women). It recognize this as the natural order! Slavery is long gone but it wasn’t Muslims who outlawed it, they were pressured to do so by the West. There’s so much that doesn’t align with my belief system. I see humans as complete equal of each other. No one can own another human under any circumstances. This religion of truth is old politics. There are excuses why Islam couldn’t do away with slavery, concubinage and all that because it would lose “control”. When a question of multiple marriages arise, it was to strengthen political ties among tribes. When questionable Ahadith are layed out, they must be from a nonreliable source. How can you have the punishment of Zena when men can have 4 wives PLUS concubines but a woman must be married to one man. Women then by default are more likely to get persecuted because she is only allowed one man. If the west never intervened, Muslim men would still be marrying 4 women and having unlimited concubines. No woman would be thrilled to see her husband bringing in another wife, if she is, it’s A LIE or she is insane. Everything is permissable for men yet anything that addresses women in the Quran is a requirement, justice?
When you legitimate something so horrible such as slavery, you are not guilty of committing a crime against humanity. Look at the historical Arab slave trade/markets, these fine rich righteous men had all been muslims yet openly bought and sold slaves.. You can post verse after verse from the Quran showing how it was only permissable under certain circumstances, but the truth is, the Quran allowed it and that was all that mattered for these bast#%ds.. For every male slave, there were two female slaves for the sole purpose of concubinage. The west learned slavery was horrible, and abolished it..don’t tell me Muslims were the first to abolish slavery… they did nothing, if anything, allowing slavery increased the number of slave markets.
Well, then what is Islam if it’s not politics? It was all politics to have control over people. The Quran talks more about what to do with prisoners than it talks about helping the poor. It talks more about sex, wives, punishments then it talks about how to maintain peace. It’s a book on rules of war, and what man needs to do to have full control over those beneath him. It talks so much about what needs to be done with nonbelievers and how to not be like them as if all nonbelievers are not humans. It warns believers against nonbelievers to a point where Muslims will not befriend a nonmuslim because it may “rub off” on him. Hell, I can pick up a land constitution even that is more just than what you call “Quran the ultimate guide”
Where do you see God in all this? Only a man would care so much about how to win a war, have multiple wives, divide property, what to do with war prisoners, blame Jews for everything, painful chastisement, hell fire, how to spend money, eat chicken only if it’s slaughtered by a believer, etc…
You cannot confine GOD! God is god. You don’t know what it is…
What Pope? Let me remind you, I don’t affiliate myself with any organized religion. No, I will never say I believe in Islam and Quran… I know this for sure now. But I will continue to provoke your thinking with my questions…
Sanity and my belief in humanity and justice.
There are two approaches to this.1) If the Quran was Muhammad’s invention then he could marry any number of women and if your belief in Allah’s apostle is so strong that whatever he did was ordained from God, then you would not blink twice even if he murdered a million people..
2) If the Quran’s interpretation is taken as it’s written, then he did violate it. I would rather believe this because this would prove at least that he was no more of a super human than we are. He was capable of making mistakes and he did make mistakes.
Good question! I have actually wondered about that so much that I don’t honestly know if there’s only one God. We don’t know our creator, for all we know, it could be some 4rth dimensional creature who drew us and the world and put us in it..and for every 4rth dimensional dweller, there must be a toy universe like ours that it plays with and hence he is the god of that universe. Who knows…really?
I sometimes wonder what if we all die and we leave the world and it turns out that every religion was indeed a true religion and there are multiple Gods and multiple heavens and hells. We will be asked what religion we believed in and if we satisfied the god we believed in then we would be sent to heaven. My imagination runs very very wild…
Nobody knows…
P.S. I know it is painfully long…sorry for going off on a tangent unnecessarily..
They come from me. I don’t google everything I write here. I do have Islamic books. I never ever post anything from any anti-islamic website. The only reason I started this thread is because I came across it while looking up a different interpretation of a verse.
That’s somewhat true. I do want answers that align with my belief system, and I believe in equality and justice. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. If Islam does indeed preace peace, equality, and justice then it shouldn’t have taken me 10 years to find it, I still haven’t found it. I see it in many Muslims but not in the ultimate book of guidance you call Quran (and ahadith). You really believe 10 years ago as a kid I would be sitting on my computer going through anti-islamic websites and cooking up stories to feed you? OK genius.
Fascinating? Not so much… sensible? To some extent. It is because of my childhood and some of it is due to my own research.
Tell me this. What material is NOT available on the internet? I know an anti-islamic website when I see one and I stay away from them. Nothing that I write comes from any anti islamic sources. It’s all my interpretation of Quran and Hadith. I have Quran and tafsir on my computer, Al-Bukhari..and other historical documents pertaining to Islam and other religions.
Real people of knowledge? Why go to such people? Does that mean if I start going to church and meet the awesomest, full of wisdom, and just christians, Christianity will impress me and I shoudl become a christian? replace that with people of any faith, there will always be some full of wisdom who choose to lead simple lives and help others. This doesn’t mean I will start preaching the same religion they follow. does this make sense?
First of all, put this in the back of your mind that YOU will provoke our thinking. That's what Satan said and that's his job to provoke us to stray away from the TRUTH.
Secondly, one who is confused about if God even exists or there are multiple Gods, he/she is definitely far away from even accepting Islam a religion.
I ask you again, like the brothers have said, close this computer and GO OUT in the search for truth. Just like you want to join the peace corps, why not join a masjid? Your problems are like those of feminists really, go ask a Muslim woman how much peace she feels in this way of life. But I know you will not be satisfied because nothing makes sense to you, even if it taste so sweet, you will find bitterness in it!
God guides who He wills, so PRAY PRAY PRAY for guidance..and pray SINCERELY believing in Allah exists, not just for the sake of it. Pray your heart out, insh'Allah you'll see a sign that will change your life like it has for other converts.
......Well, then what is Islam if it's not politics? It was all politics to have control over people. The Quran talks more about what to do with prisoners than it talks about helping the poor. It talks more about sex, wives, punishments then it talks about how to maintain peace. It's a book on rules of war, and what man needs to do to have full control over those beneath him. It talks so much about what needs to be done with nonbelievers and how to not be like them as if all nonbelievers are not humans. It warns believers against nonbelievers to a point where Muslims will not befriend a nonmuslim because it may "rub off" on him. .......
All these examples are what the 'anti-Islam group loves to quote out of context. It all sounds so familiar. Please read the Book yourself.
** "The Quran talks more about what to do with prisoners than it talks about helping the poor."
**The above line clearly demonstrates that your entire knowledge of the religion originates from the www and that too from the 'popular' areas.
What Muslims do in daily life, in the name of religion, is only rituals. I admit we are really bad at human-human relations and blaming Quran for it is not a great idea!
I can quote from Bible where even God himself is demonstrated fighting. Would that make Bible a violent book?
^ You people need to read my posts before commenting on them. I have said this a million times, I am not anti-Islam and neither do I get this information from any www.antiislam websites…Whatever I write comes right out of my head or Quran and Hadith. This is the ONLY website link I have ever posted that’s anti-Islam because I had the same question. I don’t go digging around looking for anti-Islamic stuff to post here. I have better things to do than waste my time like that. If it is all TOO SIMILAR then maybe for once you should look into it and THINK.
Do not quote anything from the Bible either, the Bible too is quite violent (new testament not so much).
InLimbo- Nothing happened to it. I am waiting to get the information from them.
cricketplaya- I am not joining any masjid. I would rather give my time to those who need it. If I could be convinced I would have been convinced by now. What better place to look than the Quran itself? Yes, I do pray but it’s not a ritual prayer like yours. I pray in my heart.
Perhaps, the conviction you’re looking for may be found at the hands of a learned scholar who can answer your questions in great depth.
But, I’m afraid the reaction of those who feel you’re just flaming is quite justified from the way you have posed your queries.
Example: You point out something from Holy Quran, and ask a question, but in the same breath you go on and assume what you see to be the truth and when someone tries to answer it, you brush their response off as a ‘mere justification’.
In the norm of things, and a learning mind would pose a question, and wait for a response. And then if you don’t find the answer satisfactory, you can move on and seek answer(s) elsewhere instead of pointing at the crowd and feeling offended.
In short, majority of us here, and almost all muslims for that matter take Prophet Muhammad’s life as being one of the founding blocks of the faith you know as Islam. When you term what he said or did as “lustful”, you are violating the forum policies which clearly state that no member may defame any holy figure. Period.
Please refrain from such, and hopefully your questions will be answered.
For now, since you seem to have satisfied the purpose of the thread, and seem rather displeased with the responses received. This thread will be locked, it may again be reopened after review by moderator(s). You may start another, but be mindful of the sensitivities of others’ beliefs while posting.
care to share ?