Re: Moderate Muslims?
Peace Dushwari
I'm not entriely clear at what is being said by yourself here so I will again reiterate and clarify the differences between the meaning behind the term 'middle path' the general term 'moderate' and the acquired politicised meaning of term 'moderate'.
*what i said is that kinaat pasandi or moderation is important - that is where the balance of deen and dunya management at the same time, is, if we can maintain it with a clear conscience. *
You say 'extremes are not moderate' let's test this statement ...
What does it mean to be extremely moderate then? If moderate means being inconsistently religious then extremely moderate could mean being very inconsistently religious, which actually means irreligious. If moderate means being good, then extremely moderate would mean being very good, which actually means that one gets closer to the 'middle path' than those who are merely good.
extremely moderate is not a finite term, just like moderately extreme is not.
*the middle path, will always leave room for improvement hopefully on to the way that can be felt as the right way, instead of the wrong way, where one's own conscience can come in as a wedge that stares the person, innerly hard enough and eventually that person realizes that what was done was wrong altogether. *
My problem with the media buzzword 'moderate' is that they have decided to take ownership of the meaning of the term. I'm not going to let that happen where Islam is concerned. I think this is where you see subjectivity in my version of the term. Okay so then let's look at other terms that describe Muslims within the Qur'an.
i agree with you, here that some terms have been given connotations, that are not the correct meaning. what we can do, is that take these terms and as redefine them, through a consistent effort which is what you have done - refedined the term subjectively. ** but for it to make difference to that effect in a broad sense, if such terms were taken hostage and it is borthering u then detach the religious aspect of it from the worldly and deal with them separately, but inwardly keep religion at the forefront. **
*also remember, the Almighty Maker is the judge and to strive to get justice and to raise others' concience, many a times in life, everyone has to bite the bullet, if u will, to obtain one's own aim. it is noble when u do it with respect for others. and help others realize that my religion is worth everything in the universe, since its message is peace and life constructive approach not life destructive. *
Mo'min, Mohsin and Muttaqi ... These would be Believer, Excellent and God-Conscious (Fearing).
Before I go into detail regarding these terms, I would like to say that the term 'moderation' does not necessarily draw a dichotomy against the term 'extreme'. To be extreme is to be very much of something. To be a 'moderate' according to the pro-secular political definition is to be a 'part-timer', but it is not to say that one cannot be an extreme 'part-timer'. It is quite possible to be a 'part-timer' at everything, that in itself is an extreme behaviour.
'Extreme' is really only a helping word that puts emphasis on the word that it precedes. Therefore, to be zealous is one thing, but to be extremely zealous is another. To be conservative is not an extreme unless it is everything that one is being conservative with, being liberal is not equivalent to being the opposite of 'extreme' because it is possible to be extremely liberal. However, where dichotomies do exist one can say opposite conditions of extremely liberal is extremely conservative behaviours.
*it is also possible as i've seen in a man, that a person can be liberally extreme in his faulty committments of fear of those committments. *
*zeal is compassion and compassion guided by pragmatism. any one of us, women or men, who are unable to balance religion with world living, are actually not living the religion, as religion makes us stronger to deal with elements of temptations. *
*in one example, if someone drinks and does not do any immoral activity linked with having been intoxicated, and they are other wise, very caring people in haqooq-ul-ibad, yes, they are breaking a rule and that accountability is but between the person and the Maker. *
*right to guilt tripping that person, is not any one's privelege. *
so, yes, u may **say to that person, 'that u are drinker and therefore have a bad character and that's the end of it.' **
*what u are actually falling for in this attribution is that it is unfairly generalized. so it is an extreme reaction of ur towards that person. *
similarly, when u are outrightly publically demoralizing that person, u are also extreme, which is what 'fundamentalists do'
*regardless of how rotten they might be, in themselves. *
*a third possibility, u may overlook that drinking aspect in the individual and then say to ur self, as long as i am not asked to drink with this person, i should be fine with that person. *
*this is reasoned liberal. *
*extremely conservative behavior now will be that u think of that person to be a lost soul, because to u what is only ONE negative. has paralyzed ur ability to see the rest of the person. *
To be moderate is to be neither extremely conservative nor extremely liberal, but it is possible to be extremely moderate, which is when a person never takes extremely conservative nor extremely liberal views. The political 'moderate' may take extreme views, whereas the Muslim should not.
let's see here this example: if u were to meet a pandit, as a Muslim, would u not be respectful to him and his religion? and would u not be peaceful in ur effort to answer his questions about Islam? or would u right away say, 'u are a pandit and a hindu, and an indian, so i am not going to be even taking u as a human being'?
extreme, right?
think for ur self, what will be the moderate type, here?
As for the 'middle path' is it not a truism that a hypocrite is he who is lenient on himself and strict on others with regards to religious matters?
*yes, that is hypocrite as u described and these are worst kinds of people. *
*yet, moderate is one who is able to be fair across the board. *
*and s/he wont hide doing anything that relates to their self reputation as a Musalimah or Muslim. *
As for those who are fair by treating themselves the same as others well this is purely being fair ... Muslims should be fair.
they could be fair.
Where however, do the following group of people go? Would you say that they are not following the 'middle path' when they are lenient on others and strict on themselves? For this characteristic is one of the moh'sin - where the person excels in good beyond mere requirement, but not to an excess which causes more damage than good. There is an optimum the one who tries to reach this optimal good is the one who is 'improving' ... and improvement is an ongoing process, one can always improve.
'a little damage' is not a requirement, either.
yes, improvement is an on going process and that is why change is crucial, but wise people change quickly and fully.
what is better than : a mumkin mohsin and saliha or no?
even Allah pardons, right, if the hearts of people change, even the Maker, lets a second chance.
here is where i would re present ur own words to u - achivements dont matter as much as the efforts made to achieve certain goals do.
We are not judged on our achievements, we are judged on our efforts, if we are effortlessly 'moderate' compared with those who are 'striving' to be so much more 'moderate' who are the ones likely to fall into extremes and who are the ones likely to be 'consistent'?
Quite appropriately we are never to commit shrk, but by this 'never', is it not an 'extreme'? Or we must never force the deen onto people, by this 'never' is it not an 'extreme'? Are we to be politically moderate would it mean that we 'must pray five times a day' or 'must not pray five times a day'? If 'must pray' is extreme, then why is it that 'must not' is not?
prayer offering is between the Maker and the created human beings **
*prayers are a farz. and as we pray to Allah in Allah's praise, and ask for forgiveness, we are doing both - m o d e r a t i n g - asking for something for ourselves, while prasing the Maker. *
*the test here is **that one is not so afraid from the Maker, that never asks any thing in the prayer. *
and that one is not selfish when offering prayers and only then offers prayers when in need of Allah's divine help
what happened to the ability of a ashraf-al-mukhlookaat, then?
Allah never says, u sit around and pray and i will make all provisions for u.
does Allah said it ever?
I'll say this again:
Islam is the definition of being a moderate human being, the only thing we must be extreme with is our attempts to religious Muslims. (I say this with leniency on others and strictness on myself) And May Allah (SWT) help me in purifying my intentions. Ameen.
*i agree that Islam encourages moderation. *
*problem is that too much now at this point is taken out of context and all of us live in our little safety nets of a meshed outlook, about religion and the worldly life we live. *
thank for the wish and the prayer. **
*May Allah make us all able in recognizing Allah's creation and its meaning. *
**amen.
dushwari