I dont know why there isn’t a thread on this by now, but what do you guys make of this huge, unexpected, control the MMA has taken in the elections?
they’ve got pretty much all of Balochistan and NWFP in their fists…what consequences do you forsee?
Personally, I’m so thankful Mush will be around for 5 more years. Go Referendum!
I think its obvious. It proves that the people of Pakistan by and large have rejected most pro-establihsment parties like PML(Q). Even in Punjab which has always beeen pro-army, it took pre election rigging to get PML(Q) majority but PPPP still managed a good show.
People are fed up of the army and corrupt politicians and want change. They want real freedom from the center more local power.
but does this necessarily mean turning to the clergy?
No it doesn't, but what other choice is their? PPP? ANP? MQM?
Nothing wrong in giving the MMA a chance. They have been elected by the voters and we must respect their choices. Although I am no fan of further entrenching religion into Pakistan, I must say that MMA victory over the nationalist parties of NWFP & Baluchistan shows that the voters are tired of politics 'as usual.' Except for a few urban areas, Punjab going to PML was no surprise and PPPP to Sindh likewise.
Pakistan Zindabad!
My thoughts are that it will be better to have them inside parliament where their agenda can be discussed openly rather than skulking and conniving in the background. Let them see what it takes to actually get things done in a nation state other than holding big jalsa's.
I dont see any problem with the emergence of MMA. Though I may not agree with all their policies, but the fact is, the whole world had been screaming their throats dry of democracy, and now theyve got it. The people have spoken. So let the people's representatives rule. If Musharraf intervenes on behalf of America, or his personal stature, it would be a shame.
He should intervene only to avoid a continuation of the corruption that we have seen in all of the past so called democracies in Pakistan. Other than that, MMA should be allowed to rule anywhich way they want.
I comment Musharraf a great deal for making the elections so smooth and transparent, since he did not manipulate the religious parties out of contention. And now we have the EU and other western 'think tanks' screaming foul since religious parties have had a strong showing.
who says MMA gaining seats but not enough to form a central government doesn't go in favour of Musharraf? It's an excellent plan to extort more from the USA for continued cooperation in the war on terrorism.
Unlike others, I am ok with the wins of MMA. IMO, the situation in Pakistan is to get much worse before it will start to become any better (many have said that before) and these elections are part of the process.
The good thing is that they are in majority in NWFP, probably the only province or people who will actually be receptive to their implementation of ideas. This means that they have the best chance to get things done their way, without any interventions which would have been the case if they did not have the clear majority.
Their manifesto is filled with their utopian ideals for Pakistan but the ground reality is very different. Within their party, which is a mumbo jumbo of other parties, have a different understanding of these ideals. So it will be interesting to see how they overcome these differences & govern. Secondly, their cry for "Shariyat" is usually symbolic. Mostly what they want to implement are already in place, blasphemy law, refuse to give other religions freedom to preach etc. What they will probably want to add on is other symbolic ruling like forcing women to do pardah, forcing men to grow beard, change the financial system to have no "apparent" interest and a few others things. Some of these ruling they can implement in NWFP, other needs an approval from the national government (e.g: banking system) which will be hard to get with NA having limited powers to begin with.
I predict that they will blame not having the national government for all their ills & accuse the government in NA working for the interests of the Kuffar, which will either let them win majority in NA next time around or will get them eliminated all together. Only time can tell. It will be interesting to see if they get to be in the collation government rather than opposition.
Some are concerned that they won on an anti-Pakistan or a Pakhtoon notionalistic notion. Or in other words will probably rally for Pukhtonistan. I don't see that happening because MMA has parties which do not have any strong hold in NWFP & it will probably not go into their interest to support or seek such a cause.
The parties in the MMA coalition have a pretty bad record of trying to really "do the work" the jalsay jaloos and rhetoric only get so far. It will be interesting to see them deal witg ground realities and be held accountable for something.
I do suspect that they will have a pandoras box of excuses on why they cant accomplish anything.
I hope that my gut feeling is wrong and some of these parties work in a spirit of cooperation and common good for the people and actually make the country a better place. Unlikely, but one can hope.
Lets be realistic and see what changes any government had made in the 20 some years of the democracy in Pakistan, especially if they were the third largest party in NA.
As far as the claims and the difference between the ground reality and utopia, even the left and center parties want some utopian or idealistic social welfare government. So there is nothing wrong with MMA to aim at those utopian highs, which we are obligated to do anyway. Most of the parties in MMA have little or no parliamentary experience, so there would be many difficulties for them in the future.
The sense I get from the articles and comments on this board is as if the MMA is the single largest majority party in the elections. Alhamdulilah for the first time they have a majority in a province, but we should not forget how much say the provincial govt has in the national affairs, remember the tussle between PPP and PML (N) when NS was chief minister of Punjab.
So, I think that if they just stay in power in one province for 5 years (god willing, if the B-52 is not used) they can be better than PPP and PML.
When I talk about utopian ideals verses ground realities, I am refer to the very basic problems faced by the general public of Pakistan.
All parties (MMA included) usually have a hocus pocus of how they want to fight it all & mainly blame corruption for all evils or the bigger enemy west.
If the supporters of MMA think that it can do better & have some plans, please let it be known to all! If just saying we will bring "Nizam-e-Mustafa" help people get educated, generate jobs & reduce the basic prices of bread & butter, Pakistan would have been the supper power by now.
dude, all i know is I dont want to be forced into wearing a hijaab or burqa.
Let us women do what we want to.
I dont think that'll go down well with the MMA, but do they have the power to really put in taliban-type rules (if that is what they wish) ie. mandatory burqas and beards, and all the other nonsense that goes with it?
AJ, I do agree with you, we do need plans, which are based on principles to eradicate the problems, rather just a blank rhetoric of Nifaz-e-Nizam-e-Mustafa. MMA could and should start this process of explaining to its voters and opponents the goals they have in mind and the ways they are planning to achieve it.
A good start would be explaining why its necessary for all the elected NA members to take oath under the constitution and not the PCO.
PG, please.....We are talking about Pakistan , and Inshallah we will see women parlimenterians wearing Hijab in the NA for the first time in Pakistani history. Inshallah they will explain it to you that no body is enforcing them to wear that other than thier obligation to Allah.
dont get me wrong, i'm not anti-Islam. If you WANT to wear it, then wear it. But its not something you can Islamically force on anyone. And there is a big difference between a hijaab and a shuttle burqa.
ANP was actually a very pro-Musharraf and fairly pro-Pakistan party. They are also very progressive minded, unlike MMA. So why is it a good thing that ANP lost? Pashtoon nationalists these days are not like others. Jeay Sindh, MQM, BNP, BNM, and even PPP are much more anti-Punjabi. And these parties did pretty well.
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*Originally posted by PyariCgudia: *
dont get me wrong, i'm not anti-Islam. If you WANT to wear it, then wear it. But its not something you can Islamically force on anyone. And there is a big difference between a hijaab and a shuttle burqa.
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I doubt you pray 5 times a day. Do you? Just curious. I am sure that will answer your question too :)
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*Originally posted by Question: *
I doubt you pray 5 times a day. Do you? Just curious. I am sure that will answer your question too :)
[/QUOTE]
Question, I know this is directed at Pyari but since you decided to become a custodian of Islam, may I ask you put you in the place of asking how many times she prays? In the afterlife we will be decided by our own conduct and we enjoy a direct relationship with Allah, so stop intruding in the affairs of others.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by RajputFury: *
Question, I know this is directed at Pyari but since you decided to become a custodian of Islam, may I ask you put you in the place of asking how many times she prays? In the afterlife we will be decided by our own conduct and we enjoy a direct relationship with Allah, so stop intruding in the affairs of others.
[/QUOTE]
Mr. Rajput I am not intruding and not trying to be a custodian of Islam.
Thats the problem when some one try to atleast make someone realise people start bashing like they are the only one who make sence.
Now what makes u think I am trying to be the custodian of Islam. I was trying to make a point. And that is praying 5 times a day is "farz" but some people take it as if they feel like praying they would otherwise its all good. Same applies for women to cover herself. It is the responsibility of the women to cover and hide herself from na'mehram. And since PCG said who the hell MMA is to force hijjab I was replying to that.
I don't know why people start bursting on others with these remarks "hey u the custodian of Islam" without even thinking what they are talking about. Dude do you even know whats mandatory in Islam and whats not?
I have seen womens who would not even step out of their house before making sure they are covered from head to toe. And this is not some thing they are being forced to do infect its their own beliefs and will. I would suggest you to know your religion before you comment others.
Re: MMA - thoughts?
Army Danda