Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
vegas has the most tastelessly flashy and garish buildings one next to the other along the strip. that is pretty much the comparison for those trying hard to take offence at a vice connection.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Wow.. some reply's just astonished me. No wonder we don't posses any love for culture as a whole Ummah. A quick question, is there any Islamic Heritage museum on the scale of Lourve or BM? Nope its bidat.. kill them brother, yeh kill kill kill.
Who is talking about killing? Your reply is rather asinine and grossly exaggerates the issue to say the least. The fact of the matter is these sites, those mud houses have zero significance as far as Islam is concerned and artifacts recovered from there can go towards the museum. If whole purpose of preserving those houses is so that people can oooh and aaah then thats pretty stupid as well.
The only killing which would take place is people dying in stampedes if place of worship isn't expanded. Of course, when place of worship needs expansion then what about providing living spaces for those who will come from far? Easy access to the Masjid? Take the "darbaari" hat off and look at it from economic perspective and that's how you effectively cater to needs of the people. If *lahoris *(and bidatis) managed the affairs of Mecca and Madina, it would still be in same condition it was 200, 300, 400 years ago and you would see more people praying in mud houses (out of aqeeedat) and at grave yards and towards prophets grave than towards the kaba.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Well historical places are quite important sometimes if you view them with the architecture perspective. for instance
Al-Hamra in Spain, Taj-Mahal, Leaning tower of Pisa, Heiga Sophia in Turkey etc
Historical places which are associated with personalities but have less architecture worth. for instance
Gas chambers in Poland, Agh khan's home in Karachi/Hunza , (late) Pope John Paul II's home in poland, Altaf Hussain's Home in Karachi etc.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
What significance is a 5x5 foot mud house? What can you gain from its history?
Did Prophet (pbuh) ask us to preserve those homes so that they may benefit us here in life and after? If they were so important, he would have said something to that affect that "hey these homes of my wives and my sahaba are really important, mosque will expand but leave room in the masjid for these houses." Ridiculous.
Al-hamra in spain, taj-mahal in india are really different story, they don't have competition with a religious masjid EXPANDING since it was built and will continue to expand.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Wow.. some reply's just astonished me. No wonder we don't posses any** love for culture** as a whole Ummah. A quick question, is there any Islamic Heritage museum on the scale of Lourve or BM? Nope its bidat.. kill them brother, yeh kill kill kill.
Try saying something about burqa/abaya and you'll see the love. lol
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
What significance is a 5x5 foot mud house? What can you gain from its history?
Did Prophet (pbuh) ask us to preserve those homes so that they may benefit us here in life and after? If they were so important, he would have said something to that affect that "hey these homes of my wives and my sahaba are really important, mosque will expand but leave room in the masjid for these houses." Ridiculous.
Al-hamra in spain, taj-mahal in india are really different story, they don't have competition with a religious masjid EXPANDING since it was built and will continue to expand.
Peace jaan leva
The Saudi government have a restriction on Hajj travel for people who live within the Arab region, I believe it was once in five years, instead of putting the money higher and building more hotel space they can extend this restriction to the world ... let's say once in five years for all people, once in seven years for people in the Arab region and leave the Hajj trip affordable and retain the sites of classical antiquity.
As for what significance certain sites have ... well I wonder why "zayyarah" is amongst the biggest commercial activities in the Hajj. In fact why do we have the Muqaam-e-Ibrahim inside a glass and brass vessel bang in the middle of the mataaf area - that gets in the way ... doesn't it?
It is an inherent need in humans to visit places of significance. It puts context in to the hearts of travellers to feel that they are at where those blessed people have been. Blessed because they were favoured by Allah (SWT).
They should build housing in a concentric manner - i.e. like a stadium is set-up instead of resorting to building upwards at the first chance and just like the muqam-e-ibrahim they can build structures or have markings of the sites of historical significance. This includes homes of the close companions of RasoolAllah (SAW) ...
Saudi government have a big responsibility indeed, but that should translate to accomodating as many of the Muslims in their religious and emotional needs balanced against their comfort needs. I bet many Muslims today if they had a choice of luxury on Hajj with no semblance to the past versus fewer facilities with sites in tact then they would choose the latter.
Islam encompasses all aspects of the human condition ... and although there are some aversions due to the fear of shirk in early Islam with the enlightened state there is no doubt that Muslims will view such sites with architectural and historical regard in a mature manner. For those people who believe du'a at such sites is noble and praiseworthy they should be allowed to practice their beliefs.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
psyah,
Peace.
[QUOTE]
As for what significance certain sites have ... well I wonder why "zayyarah" is amongst the biggest commercial activities in the Hajj. In fact why do we have the Muqaam-e-Ibrahim inside a glass and brass vessel bang in the middle of the mataaf area - that gets in the way ... doesn't it?
[/QUOTE]
So, if kufaar are comparing the hotels to SIN city, we will compare these mud houses to muqaam e ibrahim? Insanity. Are these also mentioned in the quran and hadith like those that a muslim should visit during hajj?
Why don't we try to learn from those WHO LIVED IN those houses and not care so much about the dust in those homes - their lives are well documented and some of us have seen their houses too, yes its mud and dust, lets move on. Maybe we would be in different condition if we cared about things which really matter. Here we are with so much chaos, problems and calamities on muslims and we have some worried about 1500 year old mud houses.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Vegas is not only for gambling, drinking and whoring around, plenty of which happens in saudi palaces, so get a clue as well.
Have you seen Vegas?
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Al-Hamra in Spain, Taj-Mahal, Leaning tower of Pisa, Heiga Sophia in Turkey etc
Gracisa Mucho, if Al-Hamra, Taj Mahal, Pisa Tower & Heiga Sophia were in any so-called Muslim country it would be demolished by now or people were washing clothes over them. Turkish are totally different breed compare to Arab & South Asian Muslims.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam’s holiest site ‘turning into Vegas’
Exactly the same logic was present by Taliban before they exploded the Buddgas of Bamiyan. No wonder this thinking is widespread. Keep it up :k:
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Now thats disgusting
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam’s holiest site ‘turning into Vegas’
No. Here you are talking about preserving the holy sites of ISLAM and on the other hand LYING about Taliban and what they did to Buddha statue…
Taliban’s argument was that if US and western nations are going to put SANCTIONS on people of Afghanistan, so their families and kids DIE of HUNGER then why should the TALIBAN care about some statues? The world cared so much about the statues but no body gave a DAMN about what sanctions were doing to the afghan economy, afghan kids and families. That was the whole point. Read the press briefing that Taliban ambassador back then gave to the media.
And on top of that your source is wikipedia? WIKIPEDIA? Give me a break man…
Instead of TRYING to associate me with Taliban (feeble attempt which failed miserably), why don’t you come up with a logical, reasonable explanation for WHY you want to have us put up with MUD HOUSES of 6th century? kya karain un gharon ka? achaar dalna hai? muraba banana hai? rassi main daal ke haar banana hai? Taveeez bana lain? KYA karna hai?
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam’s holiest site ‘turning into Vegas’
dunno about mud huts but the above two points are very troubling.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam’s holiest site ‘turning into Vegas’
What did Ibrahim AS do?
What did the Prophet Muhammad SAW do to idols?
The problem is that people start licking and kissing anything which was once touched by sahaba or the prophet SAW.
Utter stupidity is shown by people as of today who despite following the teachings and be good human being,… think if they have gone to Hajj or touched/kissed these items, they are blessed and pious.
**
Only few places are sacred all others are not.**
And to have historic value is to negate the philosophy of Islam that everything material is ‘faani’.
If there was no need to have a Kaaba to go around then you and I know, even Kaaba was once gone and was rebuilt.
**
There the importance is on Tawaaf as religious ritual, not on Kaaba as a building!**
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
No. Here you are talking about preserving the holy sites of ISLAM and on the other hand LYING about Taliban and what they did to Buddha statue....
Taliban's argument was that if US and western nations are going to put SANCTIONS on people of Afghanistan, so their families and kids DIE of HUNGER then why should the TALIBAN care about some statues? The world cared so much about the statues but no body gave a DAMN about what sanctions were doing to the afghan economy, afghan kids and families. That was the whole point. Read the press briefing that Taliban ambassador back then gave to the media.
And on top of that your source is wikipedia? WIKIPEDIA? Give me a break man....
Instead of TRYING to associate me with Taliban (feeble attempt which failed miserably), why don't you come up with a logical, reasonable explanation for WHY you want to have us put up with MUD HOUSES of 6th century? kya karain un gharon ka? achaar dalna hai? muraba banana hai? rassi main daal ke haar banana hai? Taveeez bana lain? KYA karna hai?
he he he. the taliban main reason was they are idols that's why they have to be destroyed.
and Wikipedia is the most common source with links to sources ,study ahead.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
I have to say, the clock tower was handy for keeping track of time during tawaf.
Do we really have to keep track of time there... doing tawaf?
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
British army used those idols in Afghanistan as target practice in 19th century. They did survive that long though.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
Do we really have to keep track of time there... doing tawaf?
Yes, because the last bus to our camp at Mina was leaving at a specific time and I needed to make sure my tawaf was done in time to be able to leave the masjid and get there before it left. I didn't bring my watch from Mina.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
this makes me sad and upset at the same time.
what they should do is make hotels for the poor, and make them free, so they dont end up sleeping on the streets/area around the Haram.
Re: Mecca for the rich: Islam's holiest site 'turning into Vegas'
British army used those idols in Afghanistan as target practice in 19th century. They did survive that long though.
mm yeh mr. aurangazeb = peekachu history lesson wala.. brits never made it as far north as bamiyan in the anglo-afghan wars. sad afsos...