Dhulfiqar, comments like these only create more hatred. Please use your best judgement when saying something like this. Islam is a religion of peace.
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*Originally posted by Dhulfiqar: *
Islam is not something that is to be taken as jest and mockery… It’s no joke yeah!
Why the hell would someone say something like that knowing what the consequences would be? Disbelievers are allowed to debate and question Islam but they are not allowed to make a mockery out of it just to take their frustration out. At the time of our Prophet (sallallaho alayhe wassallam) Christians would have debates with our Prophet (sallallaho alayhe wassllam) and he even allowed them to pray in a corner of our second most sacred Mosque when the time for their prayers came but they weren’t interested in a proper debate because deep down they knew Islam is the truth from God that’s why when the Prophet (sallallaho alayhe wassallam) challenged them to a Mubaahila (calling for Gods’ wrath upon those who lie against Him) the Christians got the sh!ts and turned down the offer and legged it back home. And during the Muslim rule over Al-Andalus the Christians there would have frequent debates with our scholars…
If this punishment for making a mockery out of Islam didn’t exist then Islam would be reduced to the same as Christianity, heck have you not seen in the movies? They say and depict stuff about Jesus Christ (alayhis salaam), which as a Muslim makes my blood boil.
Blasphemy is no joke… It’s got nothing to do with tolerance and freedom.. We’d rather be intolerant about blasphemy…
The problem is with your way of thinking and your preconceived ideas of right and wrong…
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Then let's agree to disagree because I think the problem is with your way of thinking and your preconceived ideas of right and wrong. You assume Christians or non-Mulsims believe deep down they know Islam is the truth from God. Your'e wrong. They don't. I'm not saying it is respectful or the right thing to mock someone's religion or prophets, but you can't force respect by threatening to kill people who do it. Eveyone's religion is just as holy and true to them as Islam is to you. What if everyone threatened to kill those who mock their religion or prophets?
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Then let's agree to disagree because I think the problem is with your way of thinking and your preconceived ideas of right and wrong. You assume Christians or non-Mulsims believe deep down they know Islam is the truth from God. Your'e wrong. They don't. I'm not saying it is respectful or the right thing to mock someone's religion or prophets, but you can't force respect by threatening to kill people who do it. Eveyone's religion is just as holy and true to them as Islam is to you. What if everyone threatened to kill those who mock their religion or prophets?
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They have every right to believe that their way is the only true way and that their god(s) are/is the only true god(s) or that only their scriptures are holy, a Muslim has been forbidden by God in the Koran to show disrespect towards other peoples religions and we demand the same for ours.
I never assumed that all non-Muslims know deep down that Islam is the truth, only those who are sincere will see the truth, some people however their hearts have been sealed due to their arrogance and the truth seems unfair and falsehood appears as fair to them.
Give me one example from sunnah of huzur (saw) where he have ordered to kill a blasphemer. Neither Quran nor sunnah says anything about killing such person. On the contrary Islam is a religion of peace and Huzur (saw) is 'rehmatu lil alameen'. How can u relate such intolerant behavior to a person (saw) of such high standards. During his (saw) lifetime there were many blasphemers, but none of them got death neither at the hand of huzur (saw) nor by sahaba .
It is upto Allah to decide what to do with a blasphemer. That is why we have concept of heaven and hell. Isn't Allah sufficient to punish whoever does blasphemy against his loved one?
May Allah guide us all to the right path. Amen!
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*Originally posted by Dhulfiqar: *
They have every right to believe that their way is the only true way and that their god(s) are/is the only true god(s) or that only their scriptures are holy, a Muslim has been forbidden by God in the Koran to show disrespect towards other peoples religions and we demand the same for ours.
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I agree that we should all respect other people's religions but respect cannot be demanded.
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I never assumed that all non-Muslims know deep down that Islam is the truth, only those who are sincere will see the truth, some people however their hearts have been sealed due to their arrogance and the truth seems unfair and falsehood appears as fair to them.
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So it's not all non-Muslims that deny Islam, only the insincere and arrogant?
^
Yep and they are free to carry on being insincere and arrogant, the loss is their own, the good Lord shall judge between them...
I thought God forbids to show disrespect towards other peoples religions. How can you expect people to respect your religion when you call them arrogant or insincere? Why should others (who are JUST as convinced of their beliefs as you are of yours) not label Muslims in the same way?
They are more than welcome to label us just the same but it doesn't change the facts and believing that ones own way is the only way does not neccesarily mean insulting or showing disrespect to other peoples religions in that sense... by disrespect I meant immature remarks and swearing etc. nothing wrong with questionning the validity of other peoples religions but that can be done in a respectable manner.
And calling them arrogant or insincere is respectful? You can question a religion's validity without calling its faithful arrogant, insincere or imply that their hearts have been sealed.
seminole, you're talking to a wall dude. When I see that the "moderate muslims" only response to a freak like this is "show me where it says this in the sunnah" it really makes me question the notion that Islam is a religion of peace. They need to clean house. Even the most fundamentalist right wing christians hate the KKK.
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*Originally posted by Stu: *
...When I see that the "moderate muslims" only response to a freak like this is "show me where it says this in the sunnah" it really makes me question the notion that Islam is a religion of peace. They need to clean house....
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Yeah, they should behave the same way as extremists/fundamentalists and not discuss it at all.
Tell me one thing. All the kuffars who did the greatest of blasphemies during the life of muhammad (saw), called him with 'names' and not only that, tried to murder him and threw stones at him; were all be forgiven at the time of Fatah Makkah. Why didn't Huzur(saw) ordered for all of those who fought against him to be slayed or be put to death? Instead, as we all know, he forgave them all. He also forgave Hinda who ate liver of Hadhrat Hamza (ra). This is because he was 'rehmat' for not only muslims, not only humans but all 'alameen'.
This is an example for us to follow.
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*Originally posted by zakiahmed: *
Tell me one thing. All the kuffars who did the greatest of blasphemies during the life of muhammad (saw), called him with 'names' and not only that, tried to murder him and threw stones at him; were all be forgiven at the time of Fatah Makkah. Why didn't Huzur(saw) ordered for all of those who fought against him to be slayed or be put to death? Instead, as we all know, he forgave them all. He also forgave Hinda who ate liver of Hadhrat Hamza (ra). This is because he was 'rehmat' for not only muslims, not only humans but all 'alameen'.
This is an example for us to follow.
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very well said zakiahmed
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Yeah, they should behave the same way as extremists/fundamentalists and not discuss it at all.
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No, IMO they should be ridiculed and treated with utter disgust. He is saying that YOUR religion requires the cold-blooded murder of someone who ridicules your faith -- something an individual has the right to do even if it is in poor taste. Doesn't that anger you?
If hindu's had the same rule, half of the posters in this forum would have bounty's on their heads ala Salman Rushdie.
this is Islam, and no hindus and christians have right to decide what Islamic rulings r....
if it says anyone insulting the Prophet(saw) be killed, then thats it....
to hell with the human rights activists, and to hell even with the muslims who feel sorry such a criminal but cud not shed a tear for all the muslims being killed just because they say "la ilaha il Allah"....
there r many incidents in the time of the Prophet's(saw) life where people who insulted his person wud be killed by the companions....
i remember of one certain poet who used his poetry to insult the Prophet (saw) and he was killed although he was a leader of his tribe....
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*Originally posted by zakiahmed: *
Why didn't Huzur(saw) ordered for all of those who fought against him to be slayed or be put to death?
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the order was to kill them even if they seek protection inside the Ka'aba itself (normally killing in the Haram is no t allowed)....
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*Originally posted by armughal: *
this is Islam, and no hindus and christians have right to decide what Islamic rulings r....
if it says anyone insulting the Prophet(saw) be killed, then thats it....
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The way you have written, it seems that an order was given by Allah swt or Prophet PBUH... can u share it with us?
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*Originally posted by armughal: *
the order was to kill them even if they seek protection inside the Ka'aba itself (normally killing in the Haram is no t allowed)....
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Get your facts straight.
The Prophet(saw) marched on Mecca with ten thousand men. He(saw) prayed for victory without bloodshed. The army moved with speed and was soon near Mecca. Abbas begged the Prophet for mercy on behalf of the Quresh. The Prophet did not want war. He sent Abbas to the town to work for peace. Abbas brought Abu Sufiyan to the Prophet's camp. Abu Sufiyan saw a big army there. Every tribe has its own campfire.
The sight gave him a big fright. When he faced the Prophet, he was no more the big-mouth enemy who had boasted loud at Uhud. He knew the Prophet had won. He knew the idols of the Quresh had lost. He had the sense to know what was coming. He had to save Mecca. He could do so only by making peace. He appealed to the Prophet for mercy. It was granted. Abu Sufiyan, the enemy warlord, was from that moment a Muslim. Abbas begged the Prophet for a favour for Abu Sufiyan.
"Why not?"
said the Prophet(saw).
"Whoso enters his house shall be safe. Whoso keeps indoors shall be safe. Whoso enter the Holy House shall be safe."
A peaceful entry
Abu Sufiyan hurried to Mecca. From the top of hill, he said,
"O Quresh, Muhammad is here with what you cannot fight. Whoso enters my house shall be safe, whoso keeps indoors shall be safe, whoso enters the Kaaba shall be safe."
The Prophet(saw) then proceeded to Mecca. On the way he made a halt at Zitowa. As he saw no Meccan coming to give him battle, he gave thanks to God. Then the forces of Islam made a peaceful entry into the town. The Prophet first visited the Kaaba. There he made a short speech. He(saw) said,
"There is none worthy of worship but Allah. He made good His promises and helped His servant and defeated all the tribes."
He next said all men were equal and that all were children of Adam and Adam was made of clay. He then asked the Meccans,
"O Quresh, what kind of treatment do you expect from me?"
They said,
"Mercy."
He(saw) answered back,
"There shall be no action against you today. Go, you are all free."
Then the House of God was cleared of all idols. The Quresh saw their gods in dust. The wondered how helpless the false deities were. The Prophet then strictly forbade fighting in Mecca.
It was one of the biggest conquest where there was not a single blood shed.
Zaki the Pagan Meccans all became Muslim at the conquest of Mecca and my understanding tells me that that’s why they were forgiven.
Apostates are also given three days to rethink their decision aur agar akal thikaaney aa jaey to they are let off.
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*Originally posted by Seminole: *
And calling them arrogant or insincere is respectful? You can question a religion's validity without calling its faithful arrogant, insincere or imply that their hearts have been sealed.
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For someone to not see the Truth for what it is they must be arrogant, insincere or simply out of their heads… end of story…
It’s not always correct to be politically correct…