Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

Society Religion & Philosophy
1

Astaghfirallah, Allah help you people.

Khalifat is an integral part of Islam, and no one is Muslim if he denies the law of Allah swt. What is the difference between you and Indians if you feel this way. Pakistan is a Muslim country, made for Muslims, to be governed by the laws of Allah swt, if you don’t like it, please go to the West or India where you can live under secular godless system.

True democracyin Pakistan would establish the Khilafat, and these corrupt politicians know this, so they cheap and lie and use emotion to whip up support for themselves.

If you two hate Islam so much, then why are you Muslim? Why don’t you go back to being Hindu? Atleast you wouldn’t be hypocritical in that regard.

You secularists dissapoint me, but you should be more concerned about the dissapointment of Allah swt.

I have stated before, as I will now, that the way to help Pakistan is to rejuvinate the faith of the people in Allah swt and to help rebuild the society with the economic system of Allah swt, charity system of Allah swt, political system of Allah swt, and the social system of Allah swt. Islam isnot only a rleigion, it is a way of life. If you reject this, you are not truly Muslim.

Pakistan is a Muslim country, not a secular country, it was made for Muslims. If you don’t like Islam, go to India. You will get along fine over there.

2

Ammar bhai

do you even read what is posted above?

The post has nothing to do with religion.

Let me write again.

The post has nothing to do with religion or secularism or being anti-religion.

One does not have to be religious person to be a good person.

*One does not have to be religious to be a doctor, enginner, honest man, hard working person, great politician, philosopher, great scientist, clean person, a person with civic sense, a person with conciousness, a person with love for others and a person to be prioductive as a whole in this world. *

None of these qualities require a person to be 'religious'.

As it is we see fake religious people commiting all sort of crimes even after they come back from Hajj and circling around kaaba.

**This thread does not mean that someone who is not agreeing with you is an aetheist. **So no need to say Astaghfirullah.

You started religious discussion and want everyone to talk about it. What a great way to argue.

If you cannot get out of the this circle then no one can help you.

Read the bolded sentences in my posts.

Have a decency to agree that Pakistan has so many weaknesses and no direction at all.

Aside from this topic: Since when palestinians become your brothers and do you ever wonder if they even consider you their brothers? The answer is plain and simple no. They don't care what you have or don't. They never treat Pakistani as their equal brothers or whatever. Millions of Palestinians live outside 'Palestine and drink alcohol, dance in clubs and their daughters drink and date with anyone and you have a false brotherly connection with them? Wow.

Try dating an arab girl.....she will not look at you second time dude!! Get a reality grip. Oh maybe because you will call her 'sister'!! :-)

3

What are you? A simple idiot or a terrorist Fasadi?
You are trying to derail this thread by insisting on Khilafat as a solution and calling every one that says anything against Khilafat as non-muslim. Khilafat is not a Farz, not a divine law. How a Khalifa will be selected and how he will operate are not clearly defined any where. That is why these basic princples were a matter of dispute from the time of first Khalifa. Khilafat died centuries ago when Arabs of Hijaz sided with the British against the Turkish Khalifa. Even that Khalifa was just in name only as there have been seperate kings in different muslim lands for centuries. If anything, it can only be described as a tried and failed system.
Contrary to your assertions, Pakistan is suffering from 60 years of Mullahism. It is the Mullahism that has destroyed the fabric of society in Pakistan. It is overdue that secularism as envisioned by Jinah be established and fitna by Mullahs like Maududi be finished.

(Why was the word b r a n d i n g editted? Mods?)

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Well said Ajju Bro!

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Re: What is Pakistan and Pakistani?

Khilafat is Fardh bro. You can deny it but Allah's prophet has made this clear, if you wish to read.

The problem with Pakistan is the lack of iman and the lack of akhlaq. Religious rejuvenation is what Pakistan needs more than anything. I am a firm believer in the message of Rasoolullah, and if you disagree allah help you.

The Muslism throughout the world are our brothers, and this is the belief also of the vast majoirty of the Muslims of Pakistan. Have you two become so detached from reality that you no longer even care of what your people think, or what Allah swt thinks. Are you better than Allah swt that you have found a system which serves you better than the Islamic model of governance.

Denying of scholars of repute and knowledge and denouncing the message of Allah swt is at the gates of kufr and hypocrisy. We must watch ourselves so we do not fall into error.

Our primary goal in this life is to worship Allah swt, and to recieve our reward for this. There is no harvest without tawaqul allah (trust in Allah swt). We can work forever, but if we reject Allah swt for one second, all of it is for nothing.

Trust in Allah swt and work to establish the system of Alah swt, and work hard with trust in Allah swt, and Pakistan will become greater than even you or I could dream of.

If you decide to respond to my article, please list your religion and your religious beliefs (i.e.- Islam, ahlus sunnah wa al jama'ah, etc.

Khilafat is related tot his topic, as long as we ignore it, we will sink lower and lower.

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Re: What is Pakistan and Pakistani?

Also, believing in Khilifat does not make you a terrorist. If it does, then do you believe our Prophet Muhammad (s) is also terrorist?

Astaghfirallah, la howla wa la quwatta illah billah.

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Khilafat is no Farz, it is not even Sunnat. It is not defined how a Khalifah is selected and that is why there were disuptes about whether Hazrat Ali should have been the first Khalifah, or Hazrat Abu Bakr or Hazrat Omar or Hazrat Usman. Muslims are still fighting and killing each other over the Khilafat rights of these sahabees along with rights of Hazrat Hasan, Hussain, Muavia, Yazid, etc for Khilafat. It is also not defined how a Khalifa will stop being a Khalifa in his life time. That is why Hazrat Usman ended up getting murdered that way.

I have no hesitation in refuting these so called scholars of repute when I can see that they lie and bring Fitna.

I find it funny when internet Jehadees start questioning the religion and sect and start going into irrelevant spiels.

8

Dude, just get out of your home if you are in Pakistan and visit “majority Muslim” households, you will get an idea if majority of people in Pakistan are “religous” :hehe:. Islam is more of a culture now instead of “religion”, people visit mosque just to repeat what they’ve memorized in childhood and come back home thinking their “aakhira” is saved. You probably only read JI or Tanzeem-e-Islami papers. If majority were really “religious” we wouldn’t see parties like MQM, PML N/Q/ABCDE, PPP in power or even if these were the ruling parties we wouldn’t have corrupt government, we wouldn’t have corruption in the society.

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Re: What is Pakistan and Pakistani?

One man has been working hard in derailing the thread by shouting khilafa khilafa.

If it is so much of farz then why no one has established it yet? Its not the time for khilafat, its time to be plain and simple good in actions.

As I have mentioned above, there is no example in the centuries of human history where religion was necessary to make human being a good human being and live in harmony with each other. Religion is important but not a necessity for being honest and hard working.

Despite being secular or non-religious, other countries are not full of dirt and garbage on the road or depriving their citizens from basic needs.

Going to masjid and do ibadat is well and good but it has proven not to be enough.

It has made people lazy and sluggish minded since people falsely believe that doing ibadat is all they need to do. One can then lie, cheat, steal, hide taxable money, kill others etc. Jannat will still be their home eventually.

Under 'Haza Min Fazle Rabbi' frame on the wall people give and take bribe.

Real action is needed.

Pakistan is now full of hypocrit people and that is why it has no direction.

If religion is a culture then one must be ashamed of it since people never learned to be good despite having religious culture.

10

Can you please give references from 'Quran' or 'Hadith of Prophet (SAW)' where word Khalifa is used?

As what I know, Prophet (SAW) did not used the word Khalifa or Khalafat, neither claimed the title Khalifa for himself. Prophet (SAW) used the word Ameer for those in authority. Later, after the death of Prophet (SAW), Muslims started calling the 'head of state' as khalifa, regardless of their character or whatever. Thus, in Muslim history, there were many Khalifas amongst Omayyad, Abbasids, and Ottomans, who were drunkards, evils, murderers, and most of them were corrupts to their core.

If you believe that your Islam is not complete without a khalifa and you are seriously looking for a khalifa to fulfil your Islam, than today the Khalifa of Pakistan is widower Zardari, who as President is head of state, and thus, if your Islamic belief is that you have to have a Khalifa, than it is your Islamic duty (according to your belief) to call him your Khalifa. :D

Moms 2012- 2013
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Re: What is Pakistan and Pakistani?

Astaghfirallah, what kind of kaffirkhana have I arrived in. I didn't know there was a site made for Muslims on the internet where someone who advocates Islam and Khalifah is termed as a terrorist and jihadi.

Now there are people who even say that there is no need for Khalifah and that Islam is no longer needed. La howla wa la quwatta illa billah.

The word Khalifah is mentioned several times in the Quran, one of the peaces is in Surah Baqarah.

30. Behold, thy Lord said to the angels: "I will create a vicegerent (Khalifah) on earth." They said: "Wilt Thou place therein one who will make mischief therein and shed blood?- whilst we do celebrate Thy praises and glorify Thy holy (name)?" He said: "I know what ye know not."
31. And He taught Adam the nature of all things; then He placed them before the angels, and said: "Tell me the nature of these if ye are right."
32. They said: "Glory to Thee, of knowledge We have none, save what Thou Hast taught us: In truth it is Thou Who art perfect in knowledge and wisdom."

[QUOTE]

As a result of his monotheistic conception of the world, man acquires a special outlook on the life and the universe. It is with this outlook that he says: There is no deity and no lord of the world and life but Allah, and that man has to play no role in his life except that of the vicegerent, for Allah has appointed him His deputy on the earth and has assigned to him the position of leadership.
Man's relation with nature is not that of the owner and the owned. In fact the relation between them is that of the trustee and the trust. Irrespective of their social position one man's relation with his fellow man is that of the two colleagues performing the same duty of the vicegerent of Allah, and not that of the master and the slave, nor that of master and the servant. This description of the four sides of the social relationship of vicegerency to which the Qur'an has referred, is closely related to the conception of cosmos in Islam.

[/QUOTE]

al-islam.org/trends/10.htm

We come to the conlusion, with the study of our religion that for Muslims Khilafat is a necessity. Denying the Khilafat is an act of kufr, and it is liable to make one Muslim a Kaffir (acknowledging though that the final decision is with Allah swt).

It is the height of hypocrisy to criticize someone for stating the obvious stance of Islam towards government (serving Allah swt as primary duty, i.e. Khalifah). Some misguided people like to believe that they are more knowledge othan the scholars who recieve their guidance and hudge by the laws of Allah swt, thus these people believe they are more capable to settle their affairs than Allah swt and the Prophet Muhammad (s). How can these people be allowed to rule for 60 years? This mindset is what has led to Pakistan's fall as a nation and the anarchy today.

Every Muslims believes that faith in Allah swt is the primary duty of every individual. If a person does not believe this, he no longer a Muslim first, his religion is what he considers most important, whether money, power, or anything else. Of course, Allah swt will judge based on his decree and He has the final judgement. But do we want to falter in our beileif in Allah before the Judgement Day? Do we want to be cast out of Allah swt's mercy on that day and be a companion of the Hellfire.

Work hard and believe in Allah swt. Allah swt will do the rest.

12

What do you understand by word "khalifa" here? Is this same khalifa as the term we use for "ruler"?

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Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

Surely we will make successors ( khalifa ) amongst you as we have made successors before you. ( surah jummah ).

This gives us the hint of imam mehdi and the period of khilaafat after him.

Aaj Kiss Baat Par Gussa Aaya ??????
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(Below are my views and if somebody finds them offensive then i apologise in advance)

The essence is in the ‘batin’ but we have become too obsessed with the ‘zahir’. I agree with the people who say that the prayers and outward deeds/rituals are of no use if your inside is corrupt. Some people have stated that things were not so perfect after the Prophet (saww). I would like to point out that there were evil elements within the Islamic circle even in the time of the Prophet (saww) and Quran testifies to that.

Khilafat after the Prophet belonged to Imam Ali but his rights were seized. Brutal force was used against anybody who stood up for the truth and the suffering parties were the Prophet’s family (whom loving is obligatory is made by Allah (swt) himself in the Quran), and the pious Sahabas among others. The suffering continues until today. And until the reuturn of Imam Mehdi and Isa (as) the battle between ‘Haq’ and ‘Batil’ will continue. It is happening rightnow too; you just have to look!

I would like to share the following video:

wasalams

ramesha

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Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

Khilafat is a fardh.

Spiritual rectification is needed in order to achieved that fardh.

Start learning your deen, implement it, and allow khilafat to flourish.

Stop being such cowards, and pansies, grow some, and stand up for the oppressed, Revert to the old ways of living peacefully and prosperously, money has contaminated our minds, capitalism has spread in us like a disease.

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Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

Ameen brothers. Ramesha, thank you for the video, it was very well made though the premise that this is from all Muslims is wrong since the Sunnis do not accept the Imamate. But nonetheless, thanks for sharing the video. I think we can all agree that what happened in Karbala was a major crime and other injustices of the usurpers (like Yazid) should be recognized.

Khilafat is fard upon every Muslim, if soemone does not know about Khilafat, please ask your local imam.

It is regrettable that this topic was split from theemaning of Pakistan, because the meaning of Pakistan and the status of Khilafat are related. It is the will of the people of Pakistan to establish Islamic law and justice under Khilafat. The secularists have hijacked the state and so far have prevented the Khilafat from establishing itself.

We should not let prophecy dictate what is right and wrong. We should always struggle to do what is right. Not only that, there is a hadith that a righteous government will establish itself in the land of Khurasaan, the name of Iran, Afghanistan, Pakistan area during ancient times. So we should struggle to establish the edicts of our rleigion and have no shame in it.

17

Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

I agree with Crescent_ and ammar. Khilafat is something muslims should strive for, because it will be the most just and prosperous time period not only for muslims but for all citizens of the muslims lands. The injustices of today will become a relic of yesterday, if and when Caliphate is established. And inshaAllah it will be established, if not by our generation than the generation after ours. Those who stand in its way and block it will be swept like mudhouses in the way of a Tsunami which reshapes all that comes in its path.

pyaar mujhase jo kiyaa
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Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

bro ammar, are you saying believing on the idea of khilafat is fard OR living by the khilafat system is fard?

I asked you this because if Khilafat is fard then the Prophet would've clearly appointed himself a successor because if it is an integral part of the religion then surely the Prophet could not have left any doubts over this matter. OR if you say that living by this sytem is fard then how could we perform this fard when we do not even have a khalifa and never really had one for quite a few centuries now!!!

19

I have a little knowledge about the topic of islam and status of politics in islam.But to my little knowledge,Quran never laid the principle of ruling and choosing, it give some fundamental priciples for state and for ruler and according to time and need , any system can be established which satisfies these principles a. For example Prophet(pbuh) never ever announced about his successor ( Sorry Ramesha for Ghadeer Khum twisting lie). Abubakr(ra) was not chosen by Prophet(pbuh) but by majority though Banu Hashim initially not accepted also some Ansar great sahabas at Saqeefa.Fatima(ra) also disagreed with it but still majority say accepted Abu Bakr(ra), so he became Caliph. Umar(ra) was again differntly chosen alone by Abu Bakr(ra). Usman(ra) was chosen by majority of Medina people asked secretly by Abdur Rehman bin Auf(ra) , i think during a tie between Ali(ra) and Usman(ra). Ali(ra) was chosen by majority again.

Muavia(ra) was not chosen by anyone, similarly Yazeed and other Ummayyads and Abbassid, Fatmids, Ottoman all were ancestorial monarchies wrapped up in the cover of Caliphate.

Thats why All Ahle Sunnah have unanimously consensus that there are ONLY 4 RIGHTFUL CALIPHS .one exception is Omer Bin Abdul Aziz of Ummayyads, considered mostly as a 5th Caliph.

So, in all these 5 caliphs which were chosen differntly not by any hard and fast rule because this rule is not either in Quran not in any Hadees but on the basis of that all these 5 people time and again announced that " If we lead u on the way of Quran and Sunnah, obey us, if not, then its not farz on u to obey us."

One such hadees also gives the same perspective Prophet(pbuh) said

Even obey a habshi slave as your ruler if he takes u to the path of Allah and Sunnah.

Since these 5 people at thier most followed Quran and Sunnah, so they are considred as true caliphs rest are not. In the same sense, present democrartic system who chooses anyone with majority and that person takes Pakistan to laws of Quran and Sunnah, he will be consider as Caliph, in my little knowledge.Parliment can counter jurisprudence issues with modern times means Ijjtihaad, can negate any law against rulings of Shariah but to do that we must have those people in Assembly who atleast know about qurana nd sunnah, not those bunch of sharabi and kababi, land lords families of 200 years which we see mostly in Pakistan National Assembly and Senate today :smokin:

20

Re: Khalifa, the definition, requirement (split from What is Pakistan thread in PA).

Senate and National Assembly in the sense that 5 rightful caliphs also have Shoora consisits of those sahabs who excel in the fiqah,shariah,quran and have deductice powers to extract any problem faced at that time. Umar(ra) shura consists of all great sahbas including Ali(ra). Infact 80 lashes for a drinker was not in quran and sunnah but Ali(ra) deduced it and Umar(ra) accepted it and implemented it. Similarly Umar(ra) orderedd that when Ali(ra) is in Medina Mosque all fiqah issues will be asked from Ali(ra) not me.

So Shoora of that time somehow have a resemblance with present National Assembly and Senate though they are chosen by people. Moreover Caliph was answerable to Shura even to common man as Prime Minister is answerable to NA.Changes can be made as appropriate.

But its hard these days to have consensus over any ‘Caliph’ in these days. Deobandi want to make Mufti Rafi Usmani as Caliph of Pakistan, Brelvi want to make Dr.Tahir ul Qadri as Caliph, Shias vote for Sajid Naqvi and Ahle Hadees will choose Hafiz Saeed of Laskrai Tayyaba and nobody will agree on any single :smokin:

Akheeeeeer hee Shugal lagai ga :smokin: