Jesus Versus Finality

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

From the writings of acknowledged divines and reformers
about “Khatamun Nabbiyeen”
In the government of Pakistan ‘white paper’ a noted Muslim thinker, Allama Abdur Rehman Bin
Khaldun (may Allah have mercy on him) (died 808 A.H.) is mentioned. He is noted to have said
“Wa Yum Saloona… Khatamatun Nabbuwat.” That is people categorize saintliness or holiness
according to degrees of rank. The one who has attained the highest rank is termed ‘Khatam-Al-
Auliya’. Similarly in terms of prophethood, the Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be on
him) achieved the highest rank and was called ‘Khatamul-Anbiyya’. (Muqaddama by Ibne-Khaldun
pg. 271-272, published in Egypt)
That is to say ‘Khatam’ has no relevance to time. It is indicative of the highest degree or rank. If we
use it to mean ‘the last’ then we have to agree that sainthood has come to an end as well. God
forbid we would be depriving the Ummah of this blessing as well.
Hazrat Abu Saeed Mubarak lbne Ali Makhrumi (died 513 A.H.) the patron saint of no less a person
than Hazrat Syed Abdul Qadir Gilani (may Allah have mercy on him) says “Wal Ahkhara…Wa
Sallama Khatamun Nabbiyeen” - man holds the highest position in the Universe. When he soars
high all the noble qualities in all their magnitude mentioned above find their manifestation in him
and he is called The Perfect Man. Boundless, indeed, are the noblest qualities that found their
perfection in our Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be on him) and that is why the highest
title of “Khatamun Nabbiyeen” was conferred upon him.” (Tohfah Mursala Sharif pg. 51) These
passages contain similar themes but all aspects of ‘Khatamiyyat’ are not covered in these.
Hazrat Maulana Rum (may Allah have mercy on him) (died 672 A.H.) says, “Behre Een Khatim
Shud Ast…Khatum Sanat Bar Too Ast.” The Holy Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be on
him) was declared ‘Khatim’ because he excelled in munificence and in perpetuating the spiritual
blessings to his followers. When a craftsman excels and achieves perfection, don’t we say that
craftsmanship has come to an end with him. (Masnavi Maulana Rum ch. 6 pg. 18-19)
This is the same theme expressed by the Promised Messiah (peace be on him), as noted earlier
where he says that an important aspect of ‘Khatamiyyat’ is that the Holy Prophet (peace and
blessings of Allah be on him) passed on to his followers the spiritual blessings he had achieved.
Maulana Muhammad Qasim Naunotawi, chief of Deobandi sect (the sect which today is in the
forefront of those distorting the meaning of ‘Khatamun-Nabbiyeen’) writes: “Charged with the duty
of delivering Divine Commandments to the people, prophets may be likened to governors. They are
God’s vicegerents on earth. They therefore hold a position of authority. The office of a governor or
minister is considered the highest in a chain of subordinate officers. A governor or a minister has
the authority to set aside the orders or directives of his subordinates. Their orders, on the other
hand, cannot be set aside by the subordinate officers. The final authority rests with the governor.
Similarly, the one in whom prophethood found its perfection was declared The Seal of The
Prophets - ‘Khatamun-Nabbiyeen’, as there is no rank higher than his. (Mobahesa Shahjahanpur pg.
24- 25).

taken from “Finality of Prophethood” by Hadhrat Mirza Tahir Ahmad

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

says it all :smiley:

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

Where does this say that “Was changed for someone who looked like Eesa (as)”?

and the right translation of the second Ayat you qouted is"
[19:16] And peace was on him the day he was born, and the day he died, and peace will be on him the day he will be raised up to life again.

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

You have qoutes from the writings of acknowledged divines and reformers, do you not believe that the people mentioned above were misguided?

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I think Ahmed Deedat has already corrected this mistake that it means the day he dies. Need to learn Arabic.

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

Here is another proof of Jesus's (as) death. Please also read this and tell me what you think about this:

"And Muhammad is but a messenger. Verily all Messengers have passed away before him. If then he dies or is slain, will you turn back on your heels? And he who turns back on his heels shall not harm Allah at all. And Allah will certainly reward the grateful. " Chapter : 3 (Al-`Imran) Verse : 145

It's my B'day today...
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

All messengers? when did Qad Khalat start to mean ALL ???

was it translated by Promised Messiah too?

plus wrong reference.

Where does it mention Esa:as:

:konfused:

brother take all the ayaahs in context and then read all of them. If you take the context then you will know that out of millions of prophet:as:, Allah mentions that Esa:as: was not killed.

the Correct reference:

3:144 Muhammad is no more than an apostle: many Were the apostle that passed away before him. If he died or were slain, will ye then Turn back on your heels? If any did turn back on his heels, not the least harm will he do to Allah. but Allah (on the other hand) will swiftly reward those who (serve Him) with gratitude.

London Guppy Meet
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

This is exactly what Qaddiyanism does to Islam and any other innovations that appear in Islam…

The word ‘Dies’ has been transformed to ‘Died’…

The word ‘Khatam’ is transformed to mean ‘Perfect’…

And the term ‘terminate’ has been transformed into lord knows what…

Is this what Muslims are supposed to turn a blind eye to? Blatant twsiting of the Truth?

We are supposed to ignore these fallacies in the name of moderation…

Then the Muslims, who were to keep intact the fabric of Islam will watch as people like Mirza Sahib, Asra Nomani, Amina Wadud and Irshad Manji twist the words of Allah :swt:…

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

No, he has made a mistake.

And just an FYI, Promissed Messiah (AS) knew Arabic better than these modern day Arabs. I can point you to many of his Arabic writings and Qaseedas. Many Arabic scholers have read them and many have already accepted him as Promised Messiah.

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I can only take it as a MIRACLE :smiley:

It's my B'day today...
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

You have to! otherwise you’d be implying that proper understanding of the Holy Quran has become the domain of Arabs for eternity! Quran is not just Arabic, it is a far bigger miracle which contains guidance for all rightious people and men of understanding, not just men who speak Arabic.

I can talk to a born American in English about a complex concept for hours, but it might fly over his head - on the otherhand a new immigrant who has understanding but a limited grasp of the language might understand it right away.

~*Bonus*~
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

yes.. for 14 centuries, they had the wrong understanding of Arabic,

:mash:

just like qad khalat has now new revealed meaning of **ALL **:slight_smile:

It's my B'day today...
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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

Who is “Ahmad Deedat” and why did he have to correct this mistake now after 1400 years? How many more things need “correction” in order to prove us wrong?

“qad khalat min qabli-hi-r-rusul” means ‘Messengers before him had passed away’ . Not sure where you got “many” from. Please explain?

This was revealed when the false report of Prophet’s (SA) demise was spread at Uhad. Please read the following for detailed comentory:

http://www.alislam.org/quran/tafseer/?page=162&region=EN

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So you are saying “qad khalat” means “many”?

who is correcting “mistakes” here?

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**[5:117] And when Allah will say, 'O Jesus, son of Mary, didst thou say to men, 'Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah?' he will answer, 'Holy art THOU, I could never say that which I had no right. If I had said it, Thou wouldst have surely known it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy mind. It is Thou alone Who art the Knower of all hidden things;

[5:118] 'I said nothing to them except that which Thou didst command me - Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. And I was a witness over them as long as I remained among them, but since Thou didst cause me to die, Thou, hast been the Watcher over them, and Thou art Witness over all things; **

So, the Chritians took Jesus (AS) and his mother (AS) to be Gods only after Jesus (AS) death, according to Holy Quran. But if he is still alive, why do christians believe him (as) and his mother (as) to be Gods? Quran says they started calling them Gods after Jesus's (AS) death. Another proof for the ones blessed with open eyes!

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

The verse proves that:

The corruption of Christian doctrine took place after the death of Jesus(as). If Jesus(as) is still alive, as some Muslims believe, then Christianity must still be pure.
The same Jesus(as) will not appear a second time in this world, as he would then become aware that Christians had now taken his mother as Divine, and could not, therefore plead ignorance in front of God's judgment seat.

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Re: Jesus Versus Finality

On one occasion the enemies of the Holy Prophet Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon him, challenged him that they will not believe in him unless he "ascend up into heaven" and "send down to us a Book." (17:93) The Holy Prophetsaw replied: "Holy is my Lord! I am but a mortal sent as a messenger." (17:93)

Thus the Prophets, like all humans, lived and died on the earth. If Jesus is alive today, he must be more than a mortal.

IF ANY HUMAN BEING WAS ABLE TO GO TO HEAVEN WITH HIS PHYSICAL BODY THEN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN OUR BELOVED HOLY PROPHET MUHAMMADsaw, THE GREATEST OF ALL PROPHETS. But the verses above indicate that since he is but a man, it is not possible.

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“When Allah said, O Jesus, I will cause you to die and will raise you to myself, and will clear thee of those who disbelieve, and will place those who follow thee above those who disbelieve, until the Day of Resurrection, then to Me shall be your return and I will judge between you concerning that wherein you differ.” (3:56)

The verse clearly indicates that Hadhrat Jesusas was to die a natural death and then only would he be raised to Allah. The verse does not say that Hadhrat Jesusas will be raised first then will die.

An important word used in the Quran is mutawaffi, derived from tawaffa. When God is the subject and a human is the object, tawaffa means to take away the soul, i.e, death.

Zamakhshari (467-538 A.H), an Arab linguist of great repute says, “Mutawaffika means, I will protect you from being killed by the people and will grant you full lease of life ordained for you, and will cause you to die a natural death not being killed (Kashshaf).” Scholars and commentators like Hazrat Ibn Abbas, Imam Malik, Imam Bukhari, Imam ibn Hazm, Imam ibn Qayyin, Qatadah, Wahhab and others are of the same view.

Note that the same word Tawaffa, has been used in other places in the Quran to indicate death. For example, 2:235: “and those of you who die (yatawaffou-na) and leave wives behind, these wives shall wait concerning themselves for four months and ten days.”

Another important word is rafaa, which means raising, elevating, lifting, exaltation, honor. When the rafaa of a man is spoken of as being towards Allah, the meaning is invariably spiritual elevation and exaltation. For example the Quran says about Prophet Enoch: “We exalted him to a lofty station (19:58).”

A commentary of the Quran by Ibn Khatib (“modern” Egyptian Commentary) summarizes: “And those who assert that Jesus is dead, point to the word of the exalted God: every soul shall taste death, and Jesus, peace be upon him belonged to the human species for which death is ordained. Some people presume that he is dead, and lies buried in a locality which they mention by name, and may be it is India, and God - may He be exalted - knows best what He has said and done.”

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or sleep as in 6:60

The primary meaning of ‘wafat’ is not death, it is ‘to take, reclaim, gather, receive, recall an object or amount completely and entirely’… hence Yusuf Ali gives 3:55 as “O Jesus! I will take thee…” and Pickthal has it as “O Jesus! Lo! I am gathering thee…”

al Tabari in his commentary said in part: “The interpreters have differed over the meaning of wafat as mentioned by Allah in this verse. Some of them said (it means): ‘I will cause you to sleep and raise you whilst you are sleep’. This (interpretation) is reported from al Rabi’… others have said it means: ‘I will take you from earth and raise you to myself,’ so they say that the meaning of wafat is ‘to grasp/take’ as it is said: ‘I reclaimed (tawafayt) my goods from so and so.’ They say therefore that the meaning of ‘Inni mutawaffika wa rafiuka’ is that ‘I (Allah) will take you from earth alive’. This (interpretation) is reported from al Waraq, al Hasan al-Basri… (and) Ibn Jurayj and Ka’b al Ahbar…”

Ibn Kathir in his commentary said: “Many have said that the meaning of ‘wafat’ here refers to sleep.”

these commentators also look at 'wafat’ to mean death in the verses relating to Jesus but their overall preference is in favour of the above meanings

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**[6:61] And He it is who takes your soul by night and knows what you do by day, then He raises you up again therein, that the appointed term may be completed. Then to Him is your return. Then will He inform you of what you used to do. **

So the that translates to taking of the soul while sleeping, not sleeping it self which is once again consistant with the other verses which proove Jesus’s (AS) already died.