Israel's "right" to exist

What do you guys think? Does Israel have a right to exist? and if yes, where on earth - Somewhere in Alaska, Russian Siberia, Europe or Antactica?

Israel since its creation has cost thousands of lives and put the whole middle eastern region as well as the whole world in danger.

Israel after occupying Palestine now has the gutts to attack and kill innocent civilians in its neighborhood.

All those people who support the creation of this illegal state must be ready to provide space for the jews instead of occupying Muslim lands.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Alaska is good
heck, the canadian north is more or less empty also, so is greenland. Send em there.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Or better yet..the south pole. Their own entire CONTINENT!

Then again, they are probably gonna start oppressing the emperor penguins :(

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Israelis: The land belongs to us. Jews were here long before the advent of Islam. Judaism is much older than Islam and the so the city of Jerusalem means more to us than to you. It was only later that people started converting to Islam and their numbers increased and they took over the city. The significance of Jerusalem has been celebrated in Judaism for thousands of years. It also clearly states in Bible that Lord had promised us this land.

6 "Therefore, say to the Israelites: 'I am the LORD, and I will bring you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians. I will free you from being slaves to them, and I will redeem you with an outstretched arm and with mighty acts of judgment.

7 "I will take you as my own people, and I will be your God. Then you will know that I am the LORD your God, who brought you out from under the yoke of the Egyptians.

8 "And I will bring you to the land I swore with uplifted hand to give to Abraham, to Isaac and to Jacob. I will give it to you as a possession. I am the LORD.' "

We are the chosen people. Here we are today. The prophecy has been fulfilled. There is no returning back. We were ever ready to negotiate peace with you but the terrorist acts against our people have left us with not choice but to retaliate against the Palestinians and end all sorts of negotiations. Hamas is a right wing group and they are against the very existence of Israel. Israel exists and it’s a fact and Hamas needs to get over it. We have controlled our right wing groups who are also against the very existence of Arabs in Israel yet Hamas seems to have free reign over Palestine.

**Palestinians: **We believe our God is the same. It is a tenet of Islam to believe in all the messengers including Abraham, David, Moses, Jesus and Mohammad (Peace Be Upon Them) as messengers of God who came to guide human beings to the right path and they all taught one lesson: worship one God. Therefore David, Moses, Jesus and Jerusalem are as significant to us as they are to Jews and Christians.

Agreed that Jews were here long before Muslims and that Judaism celebrated the significance of this city long before Islam. We do not object to your having access to Jerusalem. But there are certain things that cannot be overlooked. Firstly, just because you were here thousands of years ago does not mean you have to destroy our livelihoods, our houses, infrastructure and render us useless. You can live here without doing all that. Secondly, just because you were here thousands of years ago does not mean you have to force Palestinians out of their homes and into the camps. You can still celebrate the significance of this city without making Palestinians homeless. Thirdly, just because you were here before us does not mean you have to airlift hundreds of thousands of Jews from all around the globe and land them in Jerusalem while disregarding 60,000 Palestinian refugees who have been living in camps for over 50 years. Those Palestinians have been made refugees in their own country.

If your logic is that the land should be yours because you were here before Muslims, then according to this logic ½ of the world’s population must be displaced to end all conflicts. Aborigines should be able to claim the whole of Australia; Native Americans can claim the whole of North America, Mexico can have parts of Texas, Arizona etc because those people were already there before Europeans landed. It would be insane to even entertain such a thought that present population in these regions be asked to move. That means redrawing the world map going back to caveman era.

You see the world has double standards -- While the whole world is content with Israelis destroying our houses, taking our lands from us and building settlements after settlements to accommodate Jews from as far as Europe and Africa, they wouldn’t want the same to be done to them. How would an Aussie feel if an Aborigine dug a tent in his backyard and claimed the land belonged to his ancestors? No one in their right mind would abandon their house. Why should we have to? It seems like hypocrisy has no bounds. It’s not the Israelis; we believe the whole world has failed us by not doing anything.

You say terrorism against Israelis is the cause of Palestinian suffering. We have no infrastructure, schools, institutions, companies. Everyday our men are humiliated when crossing Gaza strip to go to work. They stand in lines for hours just to cross the check points installed by Israelis. Our children grow up in a hopeless environment. They see their elders getting no where. What do you expect them to become? A doctor? An engineer? With no schools or institutions to go to? How is that possible? And so our kids end up in the hands of Hamas who hasn’t done squat for Palestine. If Hamas really cared about Palestinians they would have stopped terrorism against innocent civilians and focused on education, building schools and institutions where our kids could go to and have a future.

What I Think: There are two things that need to be done.

First, Hamas has to go. The reason is like the Israeli right wing they don’t want to compromise and are an impediment to the peace process.

Second, Israel should gain Palestinian trust and also take responsibility for its actions. Thanks to the everyday display of F-16s, Tanks and heavy machine guns, the Israelis have created an image that of a Tyrant who wants to keep Palestinians oppressed by force.

Now let me tell how Hamas can be removed and what Israel can do to gain Palestinian people’s trust. It is not going to be easy but peace **is *possible. I think if Israel, instead of demolishing Palestinian property, started building schools, hospitals and institutions where Palestinian kids could go to and have a future, there would be less teenagers who would end up in the hands of terrorists. Once the Palestinian people started *seeing** the Israelis doing something constructive in their neighborhoods they would be more accepting of Israelis. Believe me they will be, because they have no hope in Hamas. By building schools and other facilities for children, Israel can put an end to Hamas’ recruiting of teenagers for terrorist activities. But if Israel continued to retaliate with force (like they are doing now in Lebanon) they will only reinforce their image as an oppressor. They **need **togain the trust of Palestinians and other neighbors (Arab countries) in order to peacefully co-exist with them. They cannot continue to be America’s 51st state, not for long!

Last but not the least, religion has to be kept out of this conflict otherwise there is no end. Everyone was created equal. We need to understand people have different religious beliefs, often times beliefs contradict with one another. That's why I think religion should be kept out when negotiating on such issues. If an Israeli Jew walks upto a Palestinian Muslim or Christian and tells them he is the 'chosen one' and that the land was promised to him by God, what do you expect the other two will do? I am sure they won't turn around and walk away quietly for where else would they go?

Then what's next, a Native American telling us to pack our bags and leave because spirits of his ancestors said so?

We have got to keep our beliefs to ourselves rather than imposing them on others. We have to understand everyone has their own beliefs!

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

^^Palestinians (earlier known as Filistine) were much earier than Jews...

Most of the jews now living in Palestine are immigrants...and troublemakers...so its high time that they pack up and leave now with some dignity... :)

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Send them to Mars? They can own the whole planet.

bad joke i know

couldnt resist

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Can anyone tell if a Palestine State ever existed in entire history?

And where does money contributed for poor Paleastine refugees go?

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

They do have a right to exist, but certainly not at the expense of oppressing others.

Antarctica sounds good.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist


Palestine never existed, it was all part of the ocean, they created the whole land by land-filling-the-ocean, then created rest of the cities just before 1948 to provide a land to Jews.

Re: Israel’s “right” to exist

The was not a single country in history in North America before the creation of the USA.

By your logic, since there was never an indepenent country in North America in history before that, the USA should never have been made.

Re: Israel’s “right” to exist

Also, if we do some research on Safardic/Sephardic Jews and Ashkanazi/Ashkenazi Jews, we get to know that Sephardic Jews belong to Children of Israel tribes, but majority of Israel today are Ashkanazi Jews (immigrants, who are not semite looking, i.e., does belong to that tribe). Please do some research on Khazar and Khazaristan. Also, Sephardic Jews used to or still put ‘H’ in brackets, i.e. [H], at the end of their names, indicating/claiming to be the real Jews. Or ask a Jew if he is Sephardic or Ashkanazi and watch the embarrassment at his face.

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Bravo SugarFree. What do you think should be done about Jerusalem? divided how i.e.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

what is wrog with a two state idea, and with holy sites handled in a way that ut does not box any one group out?

I mean its either a two state solution, or Israel give israeli citizenship to all palestinians, give them the right to vote and be a part of Israel.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

You were told to keep the two issues separate.

It is like Bharatis asking. Does Pakistan has a right to exist?

The answer is heck yes!

Even when Pakistan is much smaller compared to Bharat,
Or Israel is much smaller compared to Arabized areas,

Pakistan has guts to take on 10 times bigger enemy.
Same way Israel has guts to take on 10 times bigger enemy.

Pakistan doesn't beg Bharatis for its right to exist
Israel doesn't beg Arabs for its right to exist.

Pakistan uses its strong military to enforce its rights.
Israel uses its strong military to enforce its rights.

So any Arab lackeys eyeing Israel,
Or any Bharati lackeys eyeing Pakistan.

Beware, our shoe will fall on your head if you challenge our right to exist.

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

dont sweat it Antiobl

even with all the huffing and puffing of these anti-israeli posters in GupShup they are not going to make one IOTA of a difference in the existence of Israel

what exactly have these anti-israeli posters contributed?

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

Its difficult to say.British or more accurately the United Nations divided the region of Palestine between jews and palestinians in 1947 much the same way India was divided between muslims and hindus.However,jews did not have an overwhelming majority in the region that was to become Israel according to U.N,they were only 55% of the total population in that region and the rest were arabs...and most of these jews had migrated to the region in 1920's and onwards before that they were hardly 6% of the total population in the region.Did British let them in on purpose because they wanted to create a jewish state as was the idea behind 'Balfour Declaration'?.The arabs would say yes.Another claim by Arabs against Israel is that after 1947 a lot of Palestinians were forced out of their homes by jews and to this day are living in refugee camps which is not entirely true because when arabs declared war on israel they asked palestinians to leave their homes and come back when they've won the war,they never won the war and a lot of Palestinians were left homelesss.I think all Arabs including Hamas should let past be past and recognize Israel,however Israel has to do its part and withdraw from all occupied territories gained after 1967.

Re: Israel’s “right” to exist

You learn new things everyday. so 55% of total is not a majority? :konfused:
I hope you have mixed up somewhere in your statements cuz what you said are not correct numbers.

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they are correct numbers...not an overwhelming majority i said..55% were to rule 45% arabs

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

However the difference was that Hindu majority Bharat was wise enough to respect the international borders until 1971 (Kashmir didn't have international border just a Line of Control).

On the other hand, Arab majority states were not wise. They thought they can pee on Israel (per one of my Arab acquaintances), and Israel would drown.

Well the end result was that Pakistan survived through many trials.
And Israel survived through many trials and challenges.

Arabs started war of 67 and Egyptians, Syrians, Jordanians, and Palestinians ended up peeing in their pants.

Jordanians realized the $tupidity and quit their plans to pee on Israel.
It took another war and Egyptians also quit their plans to pee on Israel.

Syria, Iran, and Iraq didn't change their plans.

GW-I and II ended Iraq's plans to pee on Israel.

Now we have Iran and Syria left with their lotas (garden pot used after peeing), and let's see what happens in coming months and years.

May Allah give us all enough brains to help us avoid unnecessary wars.

It took another war before

Re: Israel's "right" to exist

And it is yours to give away?