It is dangerous to equate freedom of speech with right to insult. So think about this.
Whoever is writing Malala's speeches and interviews need to be really careful. The country where Malala's currently living in, hate speech against the Jews is plain old anti-Semitism, not freedom of speech!
When you preach against an ideology (I'm talking about Islam against deities followed in Arab), isn't is considered blasphemy for those who followed those deities? We do advocate prophet's preaching on the basis that the message he brought is the only truth.
Just for few moments lets be neutral and evaluate preaching of Islam and statements against Arab deities from third party perspective. Aren't there any verses in Quran which attack religious sentiments of people of Makakh? Were not these verses created anger among the followers of those deities. When they reacted and start persecuting new Muslims, we call it cruelty, exploitation and whats not and condemn such actions to the core. This indirectly suggest that we expect that they should have behaved differently and did not come with the type of reaction they came.
Now lets come to today's world, where you can know whats being said and done in countries you don't have any control on. Here our scholars have that strange attitude which is 'tera kutta kutta hai mera kutta tommy'. They condemn the reaction from kuffar e Makkah when their deities were attacked, but repeat the same behavior when their religion or Prophet is attacked by any Tom, Dick and Harry, who is even not living in your vicinity as was the case with Kuffar e Makkah and newly converted Muslims.
Please help me understand is there any justification for such dual behavior (as a neutral person). If we (our religion our scripture) attack someone's religious sentiments its fine, we shouldn't deserve to be persecuted and one who did persecution will meet the fate as is Abu Lahab (as per Surah e Lahab), but when someone attack our religious sentiments then we also get the same 'that person crossed his limits and should meet the same fate as Abu Lahab'. This seems 'Chit bhi meri, pat bhi meri' attitude, beyond my digestion (I don't like Hajmola BTW).
Govt should tackle that. I would say spare it if that charged person confess his mistake. But if someone does it persistently and on purpose govt should take severe action against it. If its extreme to some people then be it. I believe what quran says, murder is bad but fitna is worse than murder. Civilian should not take this matter into thier hands.
If this is ur point of view MASHA ALLAH ( which is correct IMO ) than where is the difference between us. We both are on the same page . Hence Mumtaaz qadri must not be a shaheed for you as well as you shud be condemning F paracha on twisting the quranic verses and preaching people to kill others. which is the main topic of this thread.
Are you still talking about Rushdie? Then let me tell you, he did not preach anything, he deliberately wrote inflammatory piece of fiction work to cause maximum offence.
If you want to equate freedom of speech with full licence to write/say inflammatory rubbish with the intended purpose of causing maximum offence then a lot of Mullahs can also get a free pass. So these are double standards and lines have to be drawn somewhere. So let's say no all kinds of hate speech/inflammatory baiting, and discourage it.
I do not support fatwa on Rushdie's head whatsoever. But that doesn't mean I'm gonna sit here and say yeah bruv Rushdie well done for taking the piss out of nearly two billion people's faith in the name of freedom of speech.
If this is ur point of view MASHA ALLAH ( which is correct IMO ) than where is the difference between us. We both are on the same page . Hence Mumtaaz qadri must not be a shaheed for you as well as you shud be condemning F paracha on twisting the quranic verses and preaching people to kill others. which is the main topic of this thread.
Ajaz is of the view that Paracha did not ask for mob justice. May be he is right as far as the video is concerned (though in video he quoted a verse with translation saying 'kill them wherever you find them', which is what we call mob justice). But the way JI glamorised Qadri entitling him with Rehmatullah Aleh and Shaheed, arranging Million March for him, and not coming a specific statement against mob killing says that JI supports mob justice as a policy.
^ remember munawar hassan asking for the culture of jihad and qattal to be promoted if we want to save pakistan. Their policy is very clear. Else they will not make Qadri a hero.
Watch the videos of various so called great religious leaders at the dharna . What language they are using. I can never think of some one using such words and than ism-e-muhammad in same breath. What they are teaching to their followers. For me these are the most dangerous species and msot dangerous for pakistan specially and humanity in general.
Are you still talking about Rushdie? Then let me tell you, he did not preach anything, he deliberately wrote inflammatory piece of fiction work to cause maximum offence.
If you want to equate freedom of speech with full licence to write/say inflammatory rubbish with only purpose of causing maximum offence then a lot of Mullahs can also get a free pass. So these are double standards and lines have to be drawn somewhere. So let's say no all kinds of hate speech/inflammatory baiting, and discourage it.
I do not support fatwa on Rushdie's head whatsoever. But that doesn't mean I'm gonna sit here and say yeah bruv Rushdie well done for taking the piss out of nearly two billion people's faith in the name of freedom of speech.
I'm not talking about Rushdie, I'm talking about overall attitude and reaction when Muslims are intellectually challenged. Muslims consider it their right to preach whatever they want, but are intolerant about differing views. This intolerance is not just for mentally retarded Rushdie, this intolerance also engulfed different sects. This intolerance is also for people like Taseer, who just talked about misuse of man made law (Yes blasphemy law is man made as likes of Paracha failed to bring any specific and clear verse in support of such law).
^ remember munawar hassan asking for the culture of jihad and qattal to be promoted if we want to save pakistan. Their policy is very clear.
Munawwar Hussain is the worst thing that happened to JI in recent times. I had some hopes from Sirajul Haq, but the kind of reaction JI showed on Qadri's execution changed my views about him.
I'm not talking about Rushdie, I'm talking about overall attitude and reaction when Muslims are intellectually challenged. Muslims consider it their right to preach whatever they want, but are intolerant about differing views. This intolerance is not just for mentally retarded Rushdie, this intolerance also engulfed different sects. This intolerance is also for people like Taseer, who just talked about misuse of man made law (Yes blasphemy law is man made as likes of Paracha failed to bring any specific and clear verse in support of such law).
add junaid jumshaid , parvez rasheed , and maybe few more in coming days..
I have seen a statement from Sarwat Ijaz (fake or genuine) whereby he has declared Tariq Jameel as blasphemer.
BTW, the role of Tableeghi Jamat is quite shady when it comes to blasphemy issue. They have kept silent on the matter (though they are not vocal against terrorist attacks as well and sonay pe suhaga Tariq Jamil’s picture with know terrorist Aurangzeb Farooqui are in circulation in media). The only time, Tariq Jamil felt the fire when his chaheeta Junaid Jamshed was booked and attacked for blasphemy charges.
BTW, I don’t have good words to say for Zaid Hamid, but he has rightly pointed out role of Tableeghi Jamat in a recent letter addressed to Tariq Jamil.
^ Different ppl have different opinion about Tableeghi jamaat . Same as many ppl have different opinion about salman taseer. In any ways I dont see both of them involve in any sort of blasphemy.. Same as some ppl. put this blame on parvaiz rasheed as well. Soon this going to be a tool to punish / revenge opponents.
It wont be a surprise if liberals like say we should drop kashmir cause.
and what is the definition of supporting kashmir cause for u. In case supporting the rights of kashmiris whether to go with india or pk or be independent than I am all for it. But if the definition is to act like what TTP is doing in PK than i am all against it.
If this is ur point of view MASHA ALLAH ( which is correct IMO ) than where is the difference between us. We both are on the same page . Hence Mumtaaz qadri must not be a shaheed for you as well as you shud be condemning F paracha on twisting the quranic verses and preaching people to kill others. which is the main topic of this thread.
I already said he is explaining punishment of one general aspect of blasphemy. He isnt suggesting everage people go and kill. I havnt investigated the case myself but Salman taseer persistently passed extremely insulting remarks off the record as Qadri side claimed. Qadri side agrue that salman taseer used to provoke qadri even after requests from qadri to not to do so. I wont judge but the way salman taseer responded to blasphemy law in public, I doubt he didn't do anything to provoke qadri. I would still say that qadri shouldn't have taken law into hi hands but govt or any official shouldn't be free to disregard peoples sentiments.
See if we open up a discussion, we can always come up with solutions, alternatives and improvements. For which part you still feel a hint of disagreement? Let's see if I can reason that.
Include fasadi liberals like sabeen/malala along with fasadi mullah who abuse sahaba (r.a.) and the mullah who suggest his followers to kill others. As you said hate speech should be criminalized i believe most of problems will be solved.
I already said he is explaining punishment of one general aspect of blasphemy. He isnt suggesting everage people go and kill. I havnt investigated the case myself but Salman taseer persistently passed extremely insulting remarks off the record as Qadri side claimed. Qadri side ague that salman taseer used to provoke him even after requests from qadri to not to do so. I wont judge but the way salman taseer addressed his concerns over blasphemy law I doubt he didn't do anything to provoke qadri. I would still say that qadri shouldn't have taken law into hi hands but govt or any official shouldn't be free to disregard peoples sentiments.
Fareed paracha shud give his thought clearly. He as well as many molvies are keeping their thoughts vague in this respect. If he is clear about not taking law in his hand than he shud condemn act of qadri first hand not appreciate . His appreciation provokes many more weak minded ppl to become shaheed.
If muneeb rehman is in favour of this act . He shud kick his job and leave this govt. After all for him it is matter of his imaan.
Same goes for other govt paid molvies..
Fareed paracha shud give his thought clearly. He as well as many molvies are keeping their thoughts vague in this respect. If he is clear about not taking law in his hand than he shud condemn act of qadri first hand not appreciate . His appreciation provokes many more weak minded ppl to become shaheed.
If muneeb rehman is in favour of this act . He shud kick his job and leave this govt. After all for him it is matter of his imaan.
Same goes for other govt paid molvies..
That is a small clip from a full program. That doesn't even let us know what question was asked. I dont think rating hungry media will ask questions regarding procedure and implementation.
Watch part 2. See how Mullahs ignored the question why there are no such laws in other Muslim countries and then came reference to this. Bus poori duniya main Pakistan ke laanti Mulla Muslaman hai, baqi sab aadhe Muslaman hain.
BTW, due to recent video on youtube, everyone now knows that as far as punishing non-Muslims for blasphemy is concerned, Fiqah e Hanafiya (which is followed by majority Muslims including JI) has different view from others. But, Pakistani Mullas will not apply such rulings for Asia Bibi, as they are blood thristy rascals.
This Tanzeem e Islami guy is saying that blasphemy law has protected non-Muslim minorities from wrath of general public. Wow just wow. As if we don’t know what happened in Gojra. As if we don’t know what happened in Badami Bagh Lahore.
Further, this Molana is of teh view that Prophet forgiven all people in his life, except who badmouth him (did gustakhi don’t know what kind of Gustakhi this Molana is referring). When people plan to kill someone, do they respect such person. How come kuffar e Makkah planned for murder of the Prophet, but did not disrespect him. How come people of Taif stoned Prophet, but didn’t disrespect him? How come Abu Sufiyan kept on arranging battles after battle against Muslim, but didn’t disrespect prophet?
He quoted few incidents where Prophet himself order for killing those who disrespected him. Wow, now I knew I was wrong to call Lesley Hazleton biased for quoting such incidents in her book ‘The first Muslims’ to prove that Prophet behaved like an egoist at various occasions. Now Mazhab ke thekedar themselves are quoting these incidents to prove that very point.
Include fasadi liberals like sabeen/malala along with fasadi mullah who abuse sahaba (r.a.) and the mullah who suggest his followers to kill others. As you said hate speech should be criminalized i believe most of problems will be solved.
