Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
ohhhh, I’m scared!
why did Allah destroy the Islamic empire by the way?
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
BTW muslim doomsayer, are you in all seriousness predicting that it will be the Islamic Army that “brings down” the US empire? I’m just curious, and just a yes or no will do.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance...
Bro...history is all about empires rising and falling...and to be honest the only ideological threat the US has now is Islam...
So things can go either way...your push for integration and for Muslims to accept capitalist belief could go to plan...you win the hearts and minds of the people and live out Fukuyamas end of history dream...
Or you further alienatate the Muslims and they begin rejecting your integrationalist call...they start calling for Allahs rule rather than yours and become a more unified set...and start calling for the Khalifah that ak47 and others call for...
You havent won yet...so dont be to happy...Islam had a huge empire at one time and that fell too...so dont be too comfortable yet...
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
That is incorrect in the islamic khilafah the missionary or capitalist will be given full opportunity to express his viewpoint and argument and then he/she will be refuted in public by discussion not violence so that it can be cleared up who has the best ideas and solutions unlike the west who will call the missionary a terrorist from bongo bongo land and then launch B 52 bombers on him and say he was Al Ciada agent!
And we will not rid the state of such people we will covince them intellectually and then if they wish to go back they can and if they are fair minded people they will also convey the ideas of the islamic state to where they came from.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
Bro, you’re kidding yourself if you think that Islamic and Western ideologies are on anything resembling the same plane. You’re suggesting that the latter is being threatened by the former on our home turf, when the exact opposite is the case.
lt’s the Islamic world that is being threatened/infiltrated by western ideology. Never, and I repeat Never, will Islamic ideology take hold in the west, nor will it extend much beyond the greater middle east.
And yes, the US will lose it’s place as the world’s only superpower at some point. Nothing lasts forever. But it will not happen in my lifetime, and it certainly won’t be usurped by an Islamic state.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
truely arrogance knows no bounds. Firoun (Pharoh) too was the leader of the greatest empire of his time, but look what happened to him. same will happen to all the tyrants, may be not in our lifetime, but allah will crush those tyrants because they never had any power to begin with and were just only given respite by Allah
Re: Islamic state and tolerance...
^I notice you didn't dispute anything I said
Re: Islamic state and tolerance...
^^ May you see your pride and arrogance being broken in your lifetime.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
Who said it’s destroyed? It’s in a slump…Like anything, after a high roll, everything slumps for awhile…
Reformations are being made fast…
By destroyed I mean like the Roman, Greek, Norse, Catholic, Mongols, Nazis e.t.c…Dynasties and empires, all gone and crumbled…
Actually you will not be scared…You are riding high on the horse many rode before you…The horse of arrogance…The Germans rode the horse, crusaders rode the horse, Romans rode that horse, England rode that horse and many others…
Now it’s the Americans’ turn to ride that horse…Don’t be scared and enjoy it…Whatever will happen will happen…
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
hayn? Do you mean Katrina was Allah’s wrath? if so, for what reasons do you think it was?
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
I don’t see it anywhere in the verse to use “power” to subdue the “non-Muslims”, also “suppress” would be very wrong choice of word, if you have read Quran there is a verse which means there is no compulsion in Islam so you can’t pick arms to convert any. What I remember of the verse mentioned by Sharaabi is that Allah swt wants us to spread Islam (not necessarily conquer geographic areas) and if anyone oppresses in you doing that then you fight them back till they accept their defeat.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
Its a an established fact that natural diasters are Allah’s wrath. It is our aqeedah that what ever good or evil comes our way, is from Allah alone.
And whatever of misfortune befalls you, it is because of what your hands have earned. And He pardons much
[al-Shoora 42:30]
Evil (sins and disobedience to Allaah) has appeared on land and sea because of what the hands of men have earned (by oppression and evil deeds), that He (Allaah) may make them taste a part of that which they have done, in order that they may return (by repenting to Allaah, and begging His Pardon)
[al-Room 30:41]
Once during the Caliphate of Umar (rah) Madinah experienced slight tremors. Umar (rah) climbed got on top of the Masjid of the Prophet and said, “Oh people of Madina, if you dont give up on your sins, i swear i will leave Madinah.”
In my understanding a natural disaster is a wrath from Allah, a blessing from Allah and a warning from Allah. Wrath for those who had sinned, blessing for those good and pious who neverthless got caught up in the disaster because they were living there. In this case their past sins are erased and good deeds multiplied. Lastly its a warning, warning for those who were not affected by the disaster and people like us who were not living in the effected area.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
Muslims, I’d like to introduce you to George Bush.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
so the sinners in East Asia, Asia, so called Muslim countries, most of Europe (which by the way is like a ‘leader’ in sinning), San Francisco etc are left alone, only south-southeast of NA is punished?
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
oh brother, its gone, all we get to do about it is read its history… it IS history, Khilafah is khalas-kapish for now, diffused.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
hmm..but the verse sharabi posted used the specific word “QITAL” meaning fighting..bloodshed.
And fight them until there is no more Fitnah and the religion (worship) will all be for Allâh Alone, then certainly, Allâh is All-Seer of what they do. (Al-Anfal 8:39)
fight against those who (1) believe not in Allâh, (2) nor in the Last Day, (3) nor forbid that which has been forbidden by Allâh and His Messenger (4) and those who acknowledge not the religion of truth (i.e. Islâm) among the people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians), until they pay the Jizyah] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. (At-Tawbah 9:29)
And fight them until there is no more Fitnah (disbelief and worshipping of others along with Allâh) and (all and every kind of) worship is for Allâh (Alone). But if they cease, let there be no transgression except against Az-Zâlimûn (the polytheists, and wrong-doers, etc.) (Al-Baqarah 2:193)
so it is clear that we are told to make the deen (way of life) under islamic jurisprudence, and yes la ikraha fid deen is in quran, meaning no one is forced to become muslim. but the govt. is supposed to be of islam so the message of islam is delivered unabriged and uncut to every one under the jurisprudence of islamic govt.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
This is what I remember of the verse posted by Sharaabi when reading translation/tafasir: Allah swt wants us to spread Islam (not necessarily conquer geographic areas) and if anyone oppresses in you doing that (causing fitnah) then you fight them back till they accept their defeat.
Also one of the verses (I’m forgetting which one) applies to the war-time - when you are in war, or war is imposed on you- then you present them with Allah’s message and if they don’t accept it nor back away then you fight them till subdued then Allah’s message will prevail.
Re: Islamic state and tolerance...
ThandyMazaq...
thanks for your earlier point...
naturally there is a difference becuase we are implementing Allahs deen which is a mercy on mankind rather than a flawed system devised by man...
Captain1...
The Khalifah is gone...but that is implementation of Allahs rule so dont dismiss it because Allah sent his rules to be implemented...
And bro...verses from the Quran and history show that Muslims took over lands unprovoked...its not really a debate...Only those stupid 'scholars for dollars' start bringing up nonsense about jihad of nafs and other bull****...
generally its consensus that Muslims attacked lands that refused to become part of the Islamic state...becuase we have to implement Allahs Deen...
And Stu...
ill say it again...bro...empires rise and fall...and the west is at its most powerful but eventualy it will fall...
I agree with you when you say the West is inflitrating the Muslim lands ideologically...that is precisely what you should be doing...spread your Deen and convert those who profess another ideology into following your own...
But unlike the commis Muslims arent actually adopting your ideology rather they are fighting against it...Your rulers in the Middle East are getting quite uneasy and the disaster of Iraq certainly was a long way away from winning the hearts and minds of people...
Leadership is ideological leadership...and you are a long way away from that and the only set of people standing against your end of history is the Muslims and the Islamic ideology...its the only threat that you have...
Re: Islamic state and tolerance…
The bold sentences are exactly opposite of each other and mutually exclusive.
Either they are sincere in winning the minds and hearts or they are taking people out who do not agree!
Which one is it?
I think we know the answer.