Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
money, aid that was to flow in
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
islamic revivalism was started and halted many times, no surely if you look at the rate of growth of it, and had to plot it as a graph , from 1800s or so it was a very flat graph, the exponential growth of it has been in the last few decades.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it’s headed.
Konichiwa Billy The most definitive study on the growth of madrassahs in Pakistan and how it’s changed the cultural mood has been by Tariq Rahman.
Here is a link http://www.himalmag.com/2004/february/essay.htm
X coms analysis is very accurate..the level of polarization in Pakistan during this government within Pakistan has increased considerably.
In a more international context, I find the “Islamic revivalism” concept one that is often misudnerstood..it was not the salafi movement per se which created this extremist brand of Islam..it was the way secular governments reacted against Islamic movements.
In a broader sense the Islamic revivalism has spread beyond what people imagined. There is a far greater sense of sense of Muslimness now then there ever was before..
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
^ True, it definitely is not an entirely bad thing, but increasingly people are being further segregated - following various sects, sheikhs, imams ... I think our generation (those in our 20s) will face real internal social obstacles and hurdles. Never did I think I'd be arguing with fellow Muslims about which sheikhs are right, why wahabiism isnt such a bad thing etc.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
Cat-woman,
this is a very good call, to a really important topic. thanks. below is what I've to offer.
well, look around us - any Muslim country - is simple left to the devices of its looter - and insider tyrants. the average Saudi. Arab, Pakistani, Irani, Jordanian is too busy wanting and struggling to have a living standard that is decent, in their respective countries. Muslim brotherhood is essential to maintain a sense of unity in within the Muslims. it does not have to occur like an exclusionary campaign on the part of the Muslims, ignoring the rest of the world and faiths of the people who are not Muslims. the current misconceptions about Islamic ethos have to be cleared by no one else, but us Muslims and Musalimahs.
sometimes, people need to just wait - killing is happening in Muslim parts often world, people are calling Muslims names and being perpetually anti-Islam. why? there MUST be something that Muslims have done wrong, due to which they are perceived as bad. when these things will happen, all the rest will fall in place - dealings, businesses, legal matters, social contracts of inter personal relations, at all levels and most importantly, if the next generation is created, it will be much more secure, stable , grounded and confident in its religiosity and its intelligence. again, identity as a Muslim will only benefit, if we are good to every body genuinely. the moment we feel exclusionary, and self-righteous in an arrogant way, we would have lost it, already.
here, we must also make sue that we do not come in a race with others to do more worse, than others, for what ever reason. the discipline that our code of living according to our faith’s principles is taught to us, we have only good things to do. whereas, if u look around, Muslim countries, their govts., their nations, are all getting soaked into all ills in the world on a population level.
there are turns to the cycle of change, and change never come fast - it always comes slowly. we only need to make sure that we are prepared. we have to encompass all pressing issues, and not get confused between ideologies of origins versus ideologies with which we grew up - meaning, if we need to read Quran and see what Allah tells us to do, we have to do it ourselves, we ought not listen to wrong self serving interpretations by people, who screw God‘s word. we need to be good human beings to nature, to fellow humans and to ourselves.
if someone does wrong to us, we need not do any wrong back. we need to be transparent to ourselves and to every body else. & then there are important things to look for, like self-accountability, unity among Muslims, a purpose in life, to live like a good servant to Allah, as we believe in its almightiness. none of the living has seen heaven or hell, so we do not know what happens to the souls, but we do know what happens to the living on earth - if they do bad, they get bad, if they do good, eventually they will get good.
perhaps, then a revival in Islam and in Muslims will come. still, everyone is responsible for her/his own deeds. each home and each nation in Muslim countries need to embrace what is ours, only then the revival of Islam can be predicted to head in a good direction.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
The fragmentation is inevitable billy, mind you we have to thank the US for that as well, the destruction of secular regimes like Nassers and Saddam have created a vacuum for Islamists to occupy.
Pakistan is a bit different, because the Islamist parties had no sense of indiogenous ownership, they were and have been patronised by the government..once the government abandoned its support for them and confronted them..they became far more organised and more dangerous than previously.
Karen armstrong wrote an article about Qutb and the qutbis awhile back i think i posted it in religion ..
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
cat-woman:
[quote]
that the revival of a fervent, more stringent and politicised Islam, began in the early '70s with the PLO, the Muslim Brotherhood and Hamas, with the intifadah being one of the early causes.
[/quote]
PLO can not be included in a list of Islamic political organizations, because PLO was founded based on Palestinian nationhood. PLO has had not much to do with Islam.
We also see Hamas mentioned here. But as far as I know, Hamas was founded very recently, probably 10-15 years ago, and not in 70s.
Intifadah was/is the result of secular PLO's failure to achieve anything for Palestinians. Again it is also a comparatively recent phenomenon. It was started in late 80s, not in early 70s.
Except for Muslim Brotherhood, all other organizations mentioned have nothing to do with fervent politicized Islam of 70s.
By the way, Muslim Brotherhood of Egypt is a lot older than early 70s.
In short, above quotation is clearly based on misinformation.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
They say this has been going on from the time of the fall of the Ottoman empire and the formation of the modern borders of the Islamic world...
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it’s headed.
Actually, your information is way off - these organisations did have their roots even earlier than the 70s. Hamas was formed later, but was an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood. The MB had been around since the 1920s, and Sheikh Yassin was part of the military wing, and he formed it, therefore it was a breakoff from the MB, and formed in the 80s. You cant say the 70s didnt play a role in the politicisation of Islam in the ME.
Also, the PLO began its terrorist activities in the 70s - Munich Olympics. - After the camp david accords, war broke out again, Israel invaded Lebanon. In the same period, that is the 70s - French Airbus was hijacked by Palestinians.
From what others have said, it all started before the 70s, but the main cause which was the liberation of Palestine, became the prime focus of islamic organisations in the middle east during that period. Noone can deny that.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
Obviously, you seem to be the victim of Zionist propaganda. So quick to declare PLO a terrorist organization based on one incident, yet completely overlooking their just cause of liberation of their people and territories. If there is a party who has committed most massacres in this conflict then it is the Fascist Apartheid Regime of Zion.
Anyway, defending PLO or condemning Israel is not the purpose of this thread. You should have kept your OWN topic in mind before naming PLO. Your thread's topic is about Islamic Revivalism, and everyone knows that PLO's philosophy is anything BUT based on Islam.
About Hamas, well, what I indicated was that you mentioned Islamic organizations of 1970's, and in that list you include not just PLO (wow) but also Hamas and Muslim Brotherhood. But NONE of these organizations have their roots in 1970s. That's the point.
Muslim Brotherhood has been around since early 1900s, while Hamas may be the offshoot of any organization, but Hamas did not appear until 1980s. Hence there was not point mentioning Hamas when talking about 1970s.
It seems to me that you are putting together every organization that you hate for some reason, whether related to your own topic or not.
While Zionist terrorism against Palestinians did promote Islamic resistance organizations, the terrorism against Muslims is not the only cause of Islamic revival ideas. Muslim Brotherhood started way before the Apartheid Regime of Zion. Allama Iqbal was yearning for a Muslim Renaissance in 1920s and 1930s. Same with Maulana Maududi's ideology of Jamat e Islami, and Jamaluddin Afghani's attempts to unite Muslims of the world.
These efforts were the result of realization of Muslims everywhere that they have lost the honorable and powerful place they had enjoyed up until a few centuries ago.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
cat-woman:
[quote]
This trend as we can see today, spread across the world so fast, affecting Muslims from all backgrounds, and possibly a cause in the rise of Wahabiism?
[/quote]
Let me give my honest perspective. The purpose is not to negate cat-woman or anyone else.
While some Wahhabi/Salafi ideas are what fan suicide bombings against civilians (I know many will disagree with that), the rise of Wahhabism has more to do with Saudi petro-money. Saudis built mosques in many developing/poor Islamic countries, used the time of Hajj to globalize their ideas by giving free booklets to pilgrims, and financially supported their followers everywhere in the world. Thus Saudi ideas were more "in" among Muslims.
So Islamic revivalism or attempts of Islamic Renaissance had started long before Saudi or Wahhabi ideals entered among Muslims. The peculiar Wahhabi teachings of sacrifice in the form of suicides etc. against any perceived enemy (inc. Muslims), only changed the direction this Renaissance would have followed in the absence of it.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
PA ..while I am no fan of the salafi movement in its modern form ..i think it has been misrepresented..the movement was used as an outlet for the people by the ouse of Saud and was depoliticised in a way similar to the tabligh movement. Both the Deobandi and salafi movements or sects have had virulently violent offshoots which are inherently political. In a british context we often see how salafis clash with the political Islamists like the HT etc..
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
Geez, when did I indicate I hated any organisation - just trying to garner different perspectives. I'll read the rest of your banter later.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
While I realize this topic is largely subjective, alot of people have been pm'ing me to share my thoughts on this topic.
Islamic revivalism, or what some people have erroneously called 'politicized' or 'fervent' Islam, began after the onslaught of European colonialism had been subdued under the feet of mighty Muslim freedom fighters such as Muhammed Ali Jinnah. Before I write about that we should consider the history prior to the eviction of imperial armies from muslim lands. The European coloniasts had, through their vicous and barbaric actions, discontinued Muslim sovereignty over their own lands, and in some cases, such as Israel and India, gave the Muslim land to non-muslims, jews and hindus respectively. Although, to be fair, the clever and devious jewish and hindu enemies of Islam, the one true righteous faith, also contributed to the dissolution of Muslim powers such as Islamic Spain, the Mughal Empire and finally the Ottoman empire. These empires, which would later be recognized for their perfect utilization of the islamic system of government, which is clearly outlined in the koran and sunnah, under which minorities(even pagan idolating hindus were given rights in the mughal empire), women and the poor were protected and lived prosperous lives, were destroyed by imperialistic ambitiions. The muslims, dazzled and perplexed by their unjust treatment at the cold unislamic hands of the infidels, were forced to adopt European ways of governing, even when Europeans and Hindus were adopting islamic values such as giving women rights(divorce and not burning them to please a monkey god etc.), not idol worshipping and not being evil. During this process many important muslim thinkers began to realize we were being duped into following decadent man made laws when we had a system of governance crafted by the almighty himself. These included notable shakers of history such as Sir Syed Ahmed Khan, Jinnah, Ibn Saud, Hassan al-Banna and many others who began to reiterate:
Islam isn't a religion but a complete way of life, which has its own political system, human rights, jurisprudence and social norms all which were superior to the man made systems of the jews, christians and pagan idolating hindus.
This is where the 20th century islamic revivalism finds its roots.
Throughout the past 150 years, maybe more, we are witnessing the revival of islamic practices and ambitions which were suppresed under the colonial boot of the fascist christian, jewish and pagan agenda. We are witnessing the same zeal, the same confidence, the same conviction, in muslim youth that was present when the original muslims, unhindered by fears of being outpowered militarily, poured out of arabia and subdued roman, persian, babylonian, egyptian, indian and pheonecian empires. We are finally seeing a return to the ambition that drives islam, global domination, the desire to convert the entire globe to the one true faith so that we can be rid of injustice. We are witnessing the implementation of flawless islamic values in muslim countries, which uphold the decency of Allah and his prophets, outlines the role of minorities, and respects women in the same manner as they were treated during the times of Muhammed(pbuh), while they shed the man made political systems which are known to be corrupted. This is where islamic revivalism is headed.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
Thanks for that informative piece SyedAbdullah. I find it a bit contradictory however, that you describe Christian and Jewish expansionism as fascist, but the practises of certain Muslim nations and organisations as a riddance to injustice - "We are finally seeing a return to the ambition that drives islam, global domination, the desire to convert the entire globe to the one true faith so that we can be rid of injustice. " Quite ironic really.
And I really don't think the Mughal empire was as glorious as you make it out to be.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
I also think we need to compare and contrast the 'revivalism' of past centuries versus this and even of the last few decades.
the goals, leaders, motivations, approach are all different. are they not?
surely one can not compare iqbal or jamaluddin afghani & others with zawahiri or omar bakri, or taqiuddin nabhani etc.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
The revival movement is a very broad (if you'll forgive the pun) "church" involving everyone from Maudoodi to Tariq Ramadan..
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
I agree, and there are all diff kinds of ppl involved with their own spin on what revival means to them and how they go about doing it. I just wanted to make sure that we keep that in perspective.
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
.
[QUOTE]
Before I write about that we should consider the history prior to the eviction of imperial armies from muslim lands. The European coloniasts had, through their vicous and barbaric actions, discontinued Muslim sovereignty over their own lands, and in some cases, such as Israel and India, gave the Muslim land to non-muslims, jews and hindus respectively
[/QUOTE]
this part I agree with
.
[QUOTE]
Although, to be fair, the clever and devious jewish and hindu enemies of Islam, the one true righteous faith, also contributed to the dissolution of Muslim powers such as Islamic Spain, the Mughal Empire and finally the Ottoman empire.
[/QUOTE]
lol...they contributed to the "greatness" of these empires buddy
jewish and hindu artisans, administrators and soldiers as well
what this did however was to stifle the spirit of islam from these societies
[QUOTE]
These empires, which would later be recognized for their perfect utilization of the islamic system of government, which is clearly outlined in the koran and sunnah,
[/QUOTE]
l.....so essentialy these empires were following the same principles as followed in the times of the Prophet(pbuh) and the pious caliphs??
[QUOTE]
important muslim thinkers began to realize we were being duped into following decadent man made laws when we had a system of governance crafted by the almighty himself. These included notable shakers of history such as Sir Syed Ahmed Khan, Jinnah, Ibn Saud, Hassan al-Banna and many others who began to reiterate:
[/QUOTE]
all these thinkers offered very different solutions, you cannot group them togather in one category
.
[QUOTE]
We are witnessing the implementation of flawless islamic values in muslim countries, which uphold the decency of Allah and his prophets, outlines the role of minorities, and respects women in the same manner as they were treated during the times of Muhammed(pbuh), while they shed the man made political systems which are known to be corrupted. This is where islamic revivalism is headed.
[/quote]
[/QUOTE]
I wish that was the case...but you are right many people do sincerely work for these goals may Allah give them strenght
Re: Islamic Revivalism - where it began, and where it's headed.
offcourse there was nothing islamic about the mughals and their kind they wasted their energies in fighting each other, adopting pagan customs and diluting the influence of Islam in the society.