Islamic method of Slaughtering animals is better

[quote]
Originally posted by arai:
**
Because, I'm an atheist am I not allowed to possess common logic and sense?

Why simply can't the blood be drained the Islamic way AFTER the animal is dead? Kill it instantly, then do whatever rituals you need have to do. (You also said, to disregard the last rites), therefore the animal doesn't require any sort of prayer or rites before Death, therefore the animal can be killed instantly, and thus whatever ritual is performed to make meat Halal, do so. If Halal is essentially "cleaner" , more "pure" meat, keep doing the way you do it, but just after the animals death.

I don't see why this is hard to understand.

Arai**
[/quote]

Arai-I have nothing against your beliefs.And there might be other ways to kill humanely.One that i can suggest is anaethetise the animal as in surgery by injecting valium i.v.My discussion was explaining the effect of halal way &may i say endorsing the claim that IT IS ALSO humane as it renders UNCONSCIOUS as possibly you can by cutting circulation in secs.I DON"T CLAIM THAT IT IS THE ONLY HUMANE way only it is halal & humane!Here unconsciousness & drain is done very superficial nick in skin as carotid artery is just under the skin in the neck,it numbs & drains all the blood you want to easily rather most effeciantly being near heart pump,lowered center of gravity in supine position .

Hk,i don't know if mad cow disease is prevented by zabiha procedure ,but in islam if consumption of animal product by cow is barred,as the above post stress,then HALAL meat is better to prevent mad cow disease.

Pristine -you are right ,i don't think we have to justify our practiceses as being scientifically superior ,but only when the choice is obvious we may point that out.


Pristine, amazing you have learned the word adios. Can you quote something from quran about slaughtering the animals?

Thanks for re-affirming my point!!

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

Im not going to argue about this any further…cuz those who choose not to believe will come up with endless excuses. So there!

[This message has been edited by hk (edited November 03, 2000).]

I didn't ask for a quote from Pristine. Is there anything in Quran about slaughtering of animals? I'm looking for a quote from Quran and not made up religion of convenience by varius unauthentic sources.

You don’t like adios, then I will use something else for you.

Re: Quote… What sort of quote are you looking for? Quran does not give step-by-step instructions on how to slaughter. For this we look at how the messanger of God (SAWW) carried it out. For references on whether eating meats is allowed, check out the following link, and then cross check the quranic references to figure out what they mean: [http://www.islam-qa.com/QA/5|Jurisprudence_and_Islamic_Rulings(Fiqh)/At’imah_(_Food_&_Nourishment_)/Permissibility_of_eating_meat_slaughtered_by_Christians_and_Jews.14091997. 103.sh](http://www.islam-qa.com/QA/5|Jurisprudence_and_Islamic_Rulings(Fiqh)/At’imah_(_Food_&_Nourishment_)/Permissibility_of_eating_meat_slaughtered_by_Christians_and_Jews.14091997.1 03.sh) tml

However, no one is compelling you to eat meats. If you wish to eat vegetables and fruits, it is fine. Just don’t assume that what is allowed in Islam, will become disallowed because someone doesn’t like it.

Bye!


Don’t Blame me…
C’est La Vie

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by Pristine (edited November 04, 2000).]

Pristine: you are right, there's nothing in Quran about slaughtering of animals. I have several other references but I'll not post them here. In my humble opinion, Quran is the only authentic word of God and the rest is all made up to justify certain ways of life.
PS: There's nothing in Bible and Torah either about slaughtering of animals.

[This message has been edited by amy (edited November 04, 2000).]

Amy, while it is true that the the Qu'ran is the only authentic word of Allah swt we have with us today. We also have the sunnah...the example--the life...of the Prophet sallallaho alaihe wassalaam to guide us as well.

Did Prophet slaughter any animals?

This is for u Azad Munna…sorry it took me so long to post this

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

Cattle stun gun may heighten “madcow’” risk
By Leila Corcoran, BICNews 25 July 1997

Is it no wonder that animals killed using any method other than cutting the jugular vein (see above article) is forbidden in the Holy Quran? God is the author of the Holy Quran and He knows best what’s good for us!

WASHINGTON (Reuter) - A stun gun used on cattle before slaughter can send brain tissue scattering throughout the animal, which could provide a route for madcow disease to spread to humans, a consumer group said Thursday.

There have been no documented cases of madcow disease, or bovine spongiform encephalopathy (BSE), in the United States, but the consumers group said the use of stun guns posed a potentially deadly risk in Europe.

``These new discoveries mean that some of the steaks and hamburgers Amercans eat today may contain small bits of brain matter,‘’ said David Schardt, nutritionist at the Center for Science in the Public Interest.

``Now, since BSE has not been detected here, there is no known risk at this time. But where BSE does exist in cattle, such meat with specks of brain tissue in it could be a deadly meal,‘’ he said.

In an unusual news conference, the Washington-based consumer watchdog group was joined by meat industry representatives who said they planned to sponsor a study on stunning methods later in the year.

``If a problem is found either with stunning in general or with particular methods or machinery, we will move swiftly to address it,‘’ said Janet Collins, a vice president at the American Meat Institute, an industry trade group.

Brain tissue and spinal cord are the most infectious part of an animal with BSE, which eats deadly holes in an infected animal’s brain. A world panic over beef was triggered after an outbreak of the disease among British herds in the late 1980s.

Scientists remain unsure whether madcow disease can be transmitted to humans, but say they are concerned about an inexplicable rise in the number of cases of Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease, an incurable brain disease in humans.

BSE has never been detected in U.S. cattle herds and federal health officials have erected a series of ``firewalls’’ against it, including banning feeding ruminant by-products – parts of other farm animals – to cattle, a practice believed to have
spread BSE in Britain.

Before cattle are slaughtered, they are stunned with a shot to the head to make them unconscious and to protect workers. Stunning is required by law so the animal feels no pain when it dies.

The Center for Science in the Public Interest said recent research at Texas A&M University and by Canada’s Food Inspection Agency found a method called pneumatic stunning delivered a force so explosive that it splattered brain tissue throughout a cow’s system.

Our research shows that it's possible that microscopic particles of brain matter can be circulated to the lungs, liver and maybe other sites,'' Tam Garland, a research veterinarian at Texas A&M said in CSPI's July newsletter. The implications are frightening.‘’

Some 30 to 40 percent of American cattle are stunned by pneumatic guns, which fire a metal bolt into a cow’s brain followed by a pulverizing burst of 150 pounds of air pressure.

The method is popular at larger U.S. meat plants because it renders cattle insensible longer than other techniques, erasing concerns the animals might revive before they are killed and cause havoc in a long processing line. Pneumatic guns are not used widely abroad.

Meat industry officials said they started considering a study on stunning methods several months ago after learning of the research. They said they planned to tap U.S. and Canadian government officials for advice on how to conduct the study and hoped to have results by the end of the year.

``No one wants the U.S. to remain BSE free more than the nation’s one million beef producers,‘’ said Gary Weber of the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association.

© Copyright 1997, Reuters News Service

Amy, this is too broad a topic for me to discuss so i’m posting this link…hopefully you’ll find it helpful

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif

http://www.themodernreligion.com/index2.html

sorry amy, this link is not working as i thought it would..anyway, once you go on the site, you'll see a list of names on the left...just click on "animals"...that should provide u with adequate info.

Really?

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/rolleyes.gif


Don’t Blame me…
C’est La Vie
:slight_smile:

[quote]
Originally posted by amy:
**Pristine: you are right, there's nothing in Quran about slaughtering of animals. I have several other references but I'll not post them here. In my humble opinion, Quran is the only authentic word of God and the rest is all made up to justify certain ways of life.
PS: There's nothing in Bible and Torah either about slaughtering of animals.

[This message has been edited by amy (edited November 04, 2000).]**
[/quote]

Amy.its not like everything that islam is ,"given" in the koran,& so is true for torah &bible in case of christians &jews.

I hope you know that Islam=koran+hadith+sunnah

Just common sense if every step of zabiha was Given"in the koran there wouldn't be room left in its 30 (parah')for any thing else.Koran is a magnificient book that it hasvery succint messages that take reoeated reading just as any cryptic "code" as u may sayu & even to-day ppl. keep discovering or relating to things that get discovered /invented every day.In that lies the uniqueness &miracle of koran
Coming back from digression(sorry) just as you have text book for oine subject say ,bilogy but you have 100 other sourceses for referenceses tooi,so is hadith &sunnah to koran!

HK,thankyou ,for the areticle.The date is not important because scientific facts is just aas true as it was then(1917)If you see my "GUESS:" was not that far out about the relation of mad cow diseases,& how it might spread.I 'm not out to prove that zabiha is the only & best way but for practical purpose first it is not DETRIMENTAL by any scientific argument,without much expense of guns ,bullets & other tools ,rememberrest of the world is not as privileged s this country,& islam is not only for the priviliged.

This is quote from my previous post -thanx
""Few words about mad cow disease thingy that HK,mentioned,is viral
infection in brain & probably can be spread more if other means of
killing cattle like blowing up the brain by gun ,which is commonly used
in england & in some places here ,might be more contaminating by
directly splashing brain all over .I have to see the article & HK if you
can be so kind to post it here PLZ.
blackzero
Senior Member ""

[quote]
Originally posted by sanam:
** Amy.its not like everything that islam is ,"given" in the koran,& so is true for torah &bible in case of christians &jews.

I hope you know that Islam=koran+hadith+sunnah

Just common sense if every step of zabiha was Given"in the koran there wouldn't be room left in its 30 (parah')for any thing else.Koran is a magnificient book that it hasvery succint messages that take reoeated reading just as any cryptic "code" as u may sayu & even to-day ppl. keep discovering or relating to things that get discovered /invented every day.In that lies the uniqueness &miracle of koran
Coming back from digression(sorry) just as you have text book for oine subject say ,bilogy but you have 100 other sourceses for referenceses tooi,so is hadith &sunnah to koran!

HK,thankyou ,for the areticle.The date is not important because scientific facts is just aas true as it was then(1917)If you see my "GUESS:" was not that far out about the relation of mad cow diseases,& how it might spread.I 'm not out to prove that zabiha is the only & best way but for practical purpose first it is not DETRIMENTAL by any scientific argument,without much expense of guns ,bullets & other tools ,rememberrest of the world is not as privileged s this country,& islam is not only for the priviliged.

This is quote from my previous post -thanx
""Few words about mad cow disease thingy that HK,mentioned,is viral
infection in brain & probably can be spread more if other means of
killing cattle like blowing up the brain by gun ,which is commonly used
in england & in some places here ,might be more contaminating by
directly splashing brain all over .I have to see the article & HK if you
can be so kind to post it here PLZ.
blackzero
Senior Member ""
**
[/quote]

Sorry,HK,I mistook one post of Azad Munna as mine & i'm sorry for taking the credit!!

If it's not mentioned in Quran, it doesn't exist. All the other quotes are creation of human mind from varius parts of the world and are used to justify varius actions in the name of religion.

Amy

**
If it's not mentioned in Quran, it doesn't exist. All the other quotes are creation of human mind from varius parts of the world and are used to justify varius actions in the name of religion.
**

Forgive me for challenging you on this and I don't mean any offence... but that seems to be a very narrow view as well as a very Black & Whiteway of looking at things. If it doesn't exist unless it's mentioned in the Holy Quran, then how do you explain all the Dinosaurs, how about the sharks and the octopus or the countless millions of other species of animals & plants ?. All off which have not been specifically mentioned in the Holy Quran but yet we KNOW they exist.

And if you want to stick to religious topics, then where in the Holy Quran do you find the method for performaing Wuzu or Hajj or Nikkah or how to perform the Hakeekah ceremony when a chid is born ??.

No muslim in his/her right mind would ever deny that the Holy Quran is the true word of Allah Taala. However, in order to fully understand and correctly follow Islam, you need more than just the Holy Quran, and that 'gap' is filled by the Sunnah and Hadith of the Holy Prophet (SAW).


Death is only the Beginning.

[quote]
Originally posted by Arch-Angel:
**Amy

**
If it's not mentioned in Quran, it doesn't exist. All the other quotes are creation of human mind from varius parts of the world and are used to justify varius actions in the name of religion.
**

Forgive me for challenging you on this and I don't mean any offence... but that seems to be a very narrow view as well as a very Black & Whiteway of looking at things. If it doesn't exist unless it's mentioned in the Holy Quran, then how do you explain all the Dinosaurs, how about the sharks and the octopus or the countless millions of other species of animals & plants ?. All off which have not been specifically mentioned in the Holy Quran but yet we KNOW they exist.

And if you want to stick to religious topics, then where in the Holy Quran do you find the method for performaing Wuzu or Hajj or Nikkah or how to perform the Hakeekah ceremony when a chid is born ??.

No muslim in his/her right mind would ever deny that the Holy Quran is the true word of Allah Taala. However, in order to fully understand and correctly follow Islam, you need more than just the Holy Quran, and that 'gap' is filled by the Sunnah and Hadith of the Holy Prophet (SAW).

**
[/quote]

Never mind sunnah and Hadith or what ever that is. it is the sunnah and hadith that has created so many interpretations of a very simple religion. What is wuzu etc and rest of the garbage that you mention. I can go on with this. That's complete nonsense. If you would just follow quran and leave rest of the unauthentic stuff created by clever minds of corrupt, sodomizing, self proclaimed Ulama, your life will be very simple. I think I have made the point.

[quote]
Originally posted by amy:
*If it's not mentioned in Quran, it doesn't exist. All the other quotes are creation of human mind from varius parts of the world and are used to justify varius actions in the name of religion. *
[/quote]

There are non muslims who will tell you Koran is written by mohommed??will you say that too Amy??
------------------------- "What is wuzu etc and rest of the garbage that you mention. I can go on
with this. That's complete nonsense. If you would just follow quran and
leave rest of the unauthentic stuff created by clever minds of corrupt"""

Amy you are putting yourselfin line of fire by calling "garbage"-"Nonsense""unauthentic"

"clever minds of corrupt"

In case you don't know Salman rushdie got million $ oin his head for saying much less offensive words.You are not a baby ,yet ,i know you abcd have had poor religous education,so plz. DON"T talk about area of knowledge you have NO IDEA what we adults are talking about.


If you are derogatory of the rest of the world ,let me tell you ,no religion ever was born in America ,& if by yopur nick i understand you are american Amy ,be aethist ,that will be all american for you .or if yu like become pagan native indian,the aborigines religion.


Amy, you’re being really biased and narrow minded here. Muslims do believe in the Sunnah and Hadith because the Holy Quran TELLS us to follow the example of Prophet Muhammad (saw). And they are AUTHENTIC.. written down by the MOST TRUSTED AND HONOURABLE SOURCES.
And you’re calling wudu “garbage”??? What kind of immature behaviour is that??? You cant expect to have a civilised conversation if you’re going to be offensive. Cleaniliness is one of the most important things in Islam and the Quran reaffirms that fact. Wudu is the key to cleaniliness & hygiene and is required when humans pray to Allah.
I dont know what religious background you’re from but plz stop attacking and making derogatory comments agaisnt Muslims and Islam…because no matter what you think u many know, you’ll never understand anything unless you’re know the ENTIRE picture (and unless you’re an informed Muslim) Tell me, have u READ the WHOLE Quran instead of interpreting our entire religion based on a few quotes you’ve read somewhere??
U cant expect to find out about an entire religion this way…based on a few facts…

http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/hoonh.gif

PS> im assuming you didnt look at the links i provided?

Amy ...
**
Never mind sunnah and Hadith or what ever that is.... What is wuzu etc and rest of the garbage.. that you mention....
**

you don't know what Sunnah and Hadith are and you don't know anything about Wuzu (abloutions),I have encountered non-muslims who have more knowledge and respect of Islam than you have !.

to say that your understanding of Islam is Very Limited would be the under-statement of the century !.

People who claim that Hadith (teachings of the Holy Prophet (SAW)) and Sunnah (Life of the Holy Prophet(SAW)) complicate Islam and make it harder to follow are usually those who don't have the balls to follow Islam the way it should be followed.

I regret lowering the tone of this post.. unfortunately you don't seem to be able to grasp simple concepts such as 'respect' and 'consideration' towards others.


Death is only the Beginning.