"Islam is a perfect religion"

Society Religion & Philosophy
41

Peace Light Bearer

As I said in my first statement, the religion is perfect, I say this out of belief rather than proof, but I have plenty of evidence to suggest that my belief is true. What you are taking for religion is not the religion but how it is being implemented. The shortfalls you see you attribute to the religion rather than to the people.

In order to take this dicussion further we need to define the criteria for a perfect religion. So what is it?

Let me come up with a five point list and if you agree with the points then we can move forwards.

Criterion 1:
A religion will not be perfect if it does not promote the strict position of Monotheism

Criterion 2:
A religion will not be perfect if it fails to promote justice

Criterion 3:
A religion will not be perfect if it does not warn of the harms nor promote the benefits

Criterion 4:
A religion will not be perfect if it does not deal with both the rational and irrational aspects of life

Criterion 5:
A religion will not be perfect if it does not encourage human harmony or fails to do so based on inherent problems in doctrine that disallow that harmony to proliferate.

These are just 5 things that can used against any religion, some may pass, some may pass with flying colours. When I said BEST system I failed to understand your rather cynical perspective of the disabled analogy. In reality many systems WORK but some work better than others.

In order to determine an imperfect religion you will need to find a criterion that when observed falsifies the claim. Endless evidence will never prove Islam as perfect, but just one falsity based on an agreed criterion can deem it imperfect. So either you pick up the above 5 criteria and show how either:

a) Any system is better than Islam in those points or
b) That Islam does not meet them

Or you provide another criterion for the falsification test and after we accept it then you can go about showing how Islam falls short of it. This should be an acceptable scenario for your purposes, otherwise I can say nothing except that you will be as you were in the beginning of this discussion .... i.e. none the wiser, and myself too.

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dont get offended but Islam is not for me. Lots of restrictions and rules.
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  • what kind of restrictions?

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How it will be for my own good. It will be good for the whole society .
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  • society? what society? society is considered stabilized when things are normal, and not extreme...but the problem is no one is happy, whether we take an example of rich or poor everyone is dissatisfied...y cuz they all are running being materialistic life style, and they also consider religion one of those entities.

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ya but the divine power is one. So no matter whom you pray to you are ultimately reaching God.So noone will get offended even if i come to mosque and pray but your god will be angry if you come to temple and pray.

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what do you mean by whom?

tomorrow if some guppy do u a favor you, r u gonna consider him/her your god/goddess?

to me theological notions of your religion are restrict....app loug k to khudoon k naam he khatum nahi hotay...Do you even know how many gods exist? and what is the point to have so many?

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I dont think So. killing animals on eid...I dont think it takes care of every living and non living thing. Have you seen youtube videos where they are slaughtering camels in some arab country. Its so gruesome.

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it is :)

if you knew about Food Chain and how in ecosystem everything remains normal and balances cuz of this then you would have had never asked me this.

e.g. collapse of several civilizations and one of them was Easter Island: palm trees would also have been a valuable food source, since its Chilean relative yields edible nuts as well as sap from which Chileans make sugar, syrup, honey, and wine> they used every wood-palm on the Island to transfer huge monumental stone Idols> no tree left> effected the weather and turned it into cool, wet, windy winters kind of> animals started to die, and only small insects left> so from first order consumer to predator everything of food chain was effected

however, researchers strongly believe that society of easter island must have been highly organized and its resources were scattered across the island.

.....but still they collapsed :)

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

I think it is wrong to compare one religion with other. All religions are only as good as how much the followers believe in it and so any comparison between them is simpl a comparison between how much 'blind' faith the followers of each are able to rationalize.

Why Islam, even the people at branch davidian claimed theirs is the perfect religion.

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Peace Get smart

First of all there is everything to show for in comparing like for like, especially for religion. This is because when one religion is being shown for it's weaknesses then it becomes a moral obligation to provide the alternative so people do not end up without religion rejecting all on account of their own religion being shown to have shortfalls.

Secondly your claim "all religions are only as good as how much the followers believe in it" is again countered by the argument, "do not judge a religion by it's adherents", but more accurately the way a religion promotes itself but at the same time maintains a distance to allow people to choose it is another example of a superior religion. So though it is not THE characteristic of religion it can only be argued that level of adherents are but only ONE indicator of it.

Thirdly, by falsely concluding religion to be just a collection of adherents you then go on to falsely conclude that all adherent are engaged in blind faith. All this needs substantiation. It may have sounded pragmatic to say these things, but substantiation is required.

The Books you read again & again
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Secondly your claim "all religions are only as good as how much the followers believe in it" is again countered by the argument, "do not judge a religion by it's adherents", but more accurately the way a religion promotes itself but at the same time maintains a distance to allow people to choose it is another example of a superior religion. So though it is not THE characteristic of religion it can only be argued that level of adherents are but only ONE indicator of it.

[/quote]

its a screwed logic... if the majority of people living in a country donnot follow their own constitution then the state is considered a failed and disfunctional state even though the constitution may be superior than the others.

why not apply the same logic here???

the society we live in is a state in minniature...

iam sure there are many good things in ur book but where is it practised in the true letter and spirit of the book??

in which country is it practised ??

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

It seems like some people here are saying that Islam by itself is great but its imperfections are because of the fault of its adherents.

That to me sounds like "the computer system works but all the problems are because the darned users don't know how to use it"

I think a religion, like a comptuer system, should have a easy to use interface for people. Not having that is a bigger imperfection than even lack of functional and moral depth

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Peace bro, sorry for late response.

The religion is not perfect if it is not implement to the letter. Where is it implemented in the world. Nobody has to convince anyone if it is so good. I look at the religion from it adherents because they give the best example of what they follow.

As you have said some systems may work better than others, you may say that Islam is a better religion but not the best.

Regarding your 5 points, I agree that can be a good start of a good discussion.

Lets discuss criretria 1: Why do you think only monotheism will work why not other systems?

regards

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*"Islam is a perfect religion" *

I think it only takes a small amount of intelligence and objectivity to realize that no religion is perfect - one only has to look at the state of the people today - centuries after these religions were created.

As in the case of all religions, one needs to qualify this question - the Islam supposedly revealed by God, or the Islam as man has interpreted this supposed revelation.

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

Anything becomes imperfect as soon as man is introduced into it

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for the first time someone says that quran does not require interpretation......

51

Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

Whe a Muslim kid is taught at Madrisa that....

That There is no God other that Allah.
That Islam is the only religion of Allah.
And he goes thru many narrations against unbeleivers; non-Muslims.

Can this kid when grown up recognize and respect other religious communities?

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

^Yes he can because Islam recognizes all the Prophets, and teaches to be gentle in delivering the message. Islam's core principles are based on the kindness, offering of peace, and showing the right path. It's just a message. While warning of the wrath of God, and with that warning the people that there is a day of Judgement. Whether they pay heed or not, is between them and Allah/God/Creator.

It is unfortunate though that some of the teachers that these kids are supervised by are themselves taught rigid attitude, which results in the students learning the harsh tone. That is not the way of Islam.

If one is to look at what Islam is all about, Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) is the perfect example. He (pbuh) lived Islam.

-HUMSAFAR-
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I do not know if Prophet Muhammad is a perfect example....

I am talking about the systematic Islam.

A kid who spends some of his fine years in Madrisa while spending time in a so-called learning (not studing) of Quran. All pictures we have seen of such madrisas....one thing is common that these kids rotate their heads to and fro....(a psychologist can explain you how does it reflect on mind, or how the same tactics are utilised in sects)....and I do not think that these kids understand much apart from the easiest portion....that there is no God other than Allah, and Islam is the only religion of Allah,...and that un-beleivers (non-Muslims) are destined to hell.

What venom actually penetrates into the kids'mind. It is not a joke.

Off course, a result is there that Muslim communities have never lived peacefully with other communities.

I cannot understand what you really mean by 'a perfect religion'!

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

^ This (what Teggy said) is true. What happens is over generations the rigidity becomes worse and worse and at some point ceases to be recognized as a rigid extreme. The students start thinking of the rigid stance as the norm and become exteremists in their thinking - whether they then become violent or not in that cause depends upon other factors.

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

I will also say this - religion while all pervading is supposed to be a mild influence and not a controlling factor. When that changes to become primary driver and combined with the rigidity of concepts that some people take away, then we see the recipe for disaster.

the only antidote is to give a lot more publicity in Pakistan to the way Jinnah dealt with religion

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Re: "Islam is a perfect religion"

^ Brother Quaid-e-Azam was not a prophet. So let us follow the religion the way our prophet (saw) taught us rather than any leader, because only prophets CAN'T make errors in preaching and practicing religion.

If you are a Muslim than Islam does not believe in religion being mild influence but a "Complete way of life".

I agree that rigidity of concepts leads to disasters but the ways of prophet (Saw) are the most flexible and practical ways a human can ever think of, not even our respectable Jinnah could think even 1% of that.

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lol...get your facts rite! pfffffffffffft salafi's just consider it a book? now im thinking do you even understand salaf? haha

yes ofcourse why bother to convert people to islam when they do good deeds no matter what they follow.... but then whats the extent? ..for what is a good or righteous deed for hindus maybe shirk in Islam....i.e idol worship same applys to many other religons.

wa'salaam

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its simple muslims are not perfect BUT Islam definatley is!

Islam is a perfect way of life only if we follow it...in moderation not extremism,
what venom actually penerates in the childs mind? if understanding that Allah is one and only is venom then maybe you need to revise your sources, then the venom that penetrates in the mind of every child of Isreal must be alot worser rite? watching their role models rape and muder soo very often isnt queit a positive impact.
so dont even bother goin to the children, madrassa's provide children with basic knowledge of the religon(islam) the book, the prophets etc...not jumping from Allah is one to all non-muslims will go to hell,..
your leap reminds me of the ignorant one who use the verses of quran out of context.

p.s maybe you missed out the few thousands of children that memorize the whole quran in young ages:) and I can tell you from what i have seen them children are so proud of themselve and they hold their heads up high

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A book with holy words in it. Their emphasis is on the meaning and words not the paper quality. I can only hope you understand what I meant.


The extent can be infinite. If Allah wanted them to be muslims they would have been born in a muslim family. Or do you claim to know better than Allah? Thats where Allah wanted them and thats where they are.


Only saying its perfect is not enough. Give me examples why? Claiming is very simple, I say Jarjarbing is the best, so bloody what? The idea is to prove it.

Alhamdulilah, the world do not end at the end of my nose.

wasalam

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This one sentence is an answer itself if Islam is a perfect religion.\/\/\/

Jews have the same madrisa type setup, synagogue, for their kids. And the Jews community has always given a good fight to Islam through out history for the same reasons.

You can convince a Hindu for the discrepancies of Hindu religion, but you cannot convince an RSS oriented Hindu (especially if he has attended RSS drills since childhood).

I do not say that all Muslims who have attended madrisas at their childhood become militants, but I can challange that all (Islamic) militants have spent their childhood at madrisas.

So, you have to decide whose Islam is perfect…moderates’ or terrorists’!

And can you explain what are the duties of a Muslim, (moderate or no moderate), as per the aspects of dar-ul-Islam vs dar-ul-herb?