Isa (AS), Quran and his second coming:

[Sa1eem]

Re: Isa (AS), Quran and his second coming:

@kchughtai

Yes, I believe that Isa(as) was put on the cross but miraculously saved from death by Allah and this concept is not against Quran at all.
In the verse 4:157 ‘salab’ means death due to crucifixion and not just putting someone on the cross. I will quote other instances of the use of this word from the Quran shortly but for a sec consider this very verse. There is lot of information that this verse provides.

1. It was made so appear to them: Now the ‘it’ could pertain to the very event planned to kill Jesus(as) or to the person od Jesus(as). In both cases, it does make sense. a) Jews were not able to kill Jesus but it so appeared/seemed that they had killed him. b) Jews weren’t able kill Jesus(as) but Jesus(as) appeared/seemed [dead] so to them There is no mention/room for another person or another person being given the look of Jesus(as). It is a total conjecture and probably based in the rejected version of bible and not in Quran.
2. Who are the people who differ. Here Jews and christians are referred. These two groups differ with the verdict of Quran (, in the status of Jesus and in events after the crucifixion) and both believe that Jesus(as) was killed on the cross. Both follow this conjecture that Jews killed Jesus but still they are not sure of it.

Now other instance of the use of ‘salab’

**5:33) **The reward of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger and strive to create disorder in the land is only this that they be slain or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off on alternate sides, or they be expelled from the land. That shall be a disgrace for them in this world, and in the Hereafter they shall have a great punishment;

Note that both ‘qatal’ and ‘salab’ has been used in a single verse and here ‘salab’ signifies death through crucifixion and not just placing the convict on the stake.

There are other instances but I think this should suffice.

I thank Psyah for clarifying the ayahs 4:157 and 4:159 using Arabic grammar. Anyhow, here is something I would like to add, without going into Arabic or grammar.

4:157. That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah.;- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
4:158. Nay, Allah raised him up unto Himself; and Allah is Exalted in Power, Wise;-
4:159. And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;-

Ayah 4:157 … Allah says … ‘they killed him not, nor crucified him’.

Crucifixion was a method of killing by ‘putting a person on cross’ and those crucified ‘usually’ used to get killed. But that does not mean all who were crucified got killed. So, when Allah says that ‘they did not crucify Isa (AS)’ it means ‘Isa (AS) was not put on cross’.

Actually, statement in ayah 4:157 ‘wama qataloohu wama salaboohu’ (they did not killed him and they did not crucified him) negates any impression where ‘crucified him’ can be taken as ‘killed him’ and validates the impression that ‘crucified him’ means to ‘put him on cross’. This is because, before mentioning ‘crucified him’ Allah mentions ‘killed him’.

For instance, when person have choice and takes ‘crucified him’ in ayah synonyms with ‘killed him’ or synonyms with ‘put him on cross’, then obvious choice has to be ‘put him on cross’ else sentence would become ridiculous and illogical. For instance, choice is between:

‘They killed him not nor killed him’
And
‘They killed him not nor put him on cross’

Those who want to believe that ‘crucified’ in ayah means ‘killed’ and not ‘put on cross’ then they have to ask themselves why Allah mentioned that ‘they did not killed Isa (AS)’ before mentioning that ‘they did not crucified Isa (AS)’.

Only justification could have been if there was a method shown in ayah for killing Isa (AS) other than crucifixion, but it is not. For instance, ‘they killed him not by sword nor crucified him’. But when ayah says that ‘they killed him not nor crucified him’ then there is no choice other than to take ‘crucified him’ as ‘put him on cross’.

Thus, ayah 4:157 clearly negates any belief that Isa (AS) was crucified (put on cross), regardless of he got killed or not.

@kchughtai

We believe the translation of 4:159 goes like this
“And there is none among the People of the Book but (continue to) believe in it before his death; and on the Day of
Resurrection, he(Jesus(as)) shall be a witness against them”

Now the two key parts where we differ are

1. his death - It pertains to each one of the people of the book. Another reading of ‘Mautihi’ is ‘Mautihim’
2. ‘bihi’ on it - Please refer to the verse i.e., 4:158. same thing has been highligted over here. the people of the book
   will keep believing in the false belief that Jesus(as) was killed by the Jews although this is based on a conjecture. They
   will face the truth on the Judgment day when Jesus(as) would be witness against them. Jesus(as) would be witness on them on
   the judgment day for their false belief that jesus(as) died the death of an accursed one and their rejection of the truth
   (Jews) and their swaying away from the origional teachings (Christians)
   Saying that people of the book must believe in Jesus before his death is quite ridiculous idea. When Islam has come and
   believing in prophet Muhammad(pbuh) ensures that one believes in all the prophets then why highlighting specifically Jesus
   to believe in. Moreover, it has no connection to the context as highlighted above.

According to you … Ayah 4:159 should mean:
(QT) 4:159: And there is none amongst the People of the Book but (continue to) believe in it before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;-

Instead of what Muslims translate and understand, that is:

(MT) 4:159: And there is none of the People of the Book but must believe in him before his death; and on the Day of Judgment he will be a witness against them;-

Again, whoever twisted the translation (QT) you posted, they should have realised that what they translated is impossibility as it is verifiable lie. Due to their twist in translation, difference becomes:

(QT): All people of the book must believe on (X) before they die.
[Where X = Isa (AS) died on cross]
(MT): All people of the book must believe on Isa (AS) before Isa (AS) dies.

Just think:
QT translation: All people of the book must believe on (X) before they die. [Where X = Isa (AS) died on cross]

Such translation means ‘all people of the book’ since day one and is time independent. That means all (each and every individual soul) who is/was ‘people of the book’ (Christians and Jews) since crucifixion event referring to Isa (AS), must believe that Isa (AS) died on cross.

That is verifiable lie, as it condemns each and every Jew and Christian of believing that Isa (AS) died on cross. But that is untrue, as there were/are many Jews and Christians since time of ‘crucifixion event’ who believe that Isa (AS) did not die on cross. Obviously, Christians who were close to Isa (AS) and ‘Allah’ could not have believed such. Similarly Jews who may have accepted Isa (AS) as Prophet when Isa (AS) was present could not have believed such. Actually, if one reads Christianity, even today there is doubt on Isa (AS) dying on cross, as there are many Christians who do not believe such and question death on cross, claiming that Isa (AS) was taken off the cross alive.

Further, even Quran (4:157) confirms that many amongst them (Christians and Jews) differ in believing on Killing of Isa (AS) on cross, and thus are in doubt (4:157 … and those who differ therein are full of doubts), and whoever has doubt cannot be included amongst those whose believe is that Isa (AS) was killed on cross.

So, saying that ‘all people of the book must believe on Isa (AS) getting killed on cross before they die is lie… hence translation ‘QT’ is twisted and incorrect.

On the other hand MT translation: All people of the book must believe on Isa (AS) before Isa (AS) dies.

Has no lie (verifiable or unverifiable), as it talks of future event and ‘people of book’ are also limited, as they are all those ‘people of book’ who would be present at time of Isa (AS) death.

One can say that ayah 4:157 (MT translation) is a prediction of future event that has not happened yet … and it would get fulfilled when ‘all people of the book, including Jews and Christians, would believe on Isa (AS) before Isa (AS) would die (in his second appearance).