Isa (AS), Quran and his second coming:

[Sa1eem]

Re: Isa (AS), Quran and his second coming:

@Mr.Popat

Quran is the final word of Allah for a reason. All the previous important eras have been written in Quran and said by Allah as a warning for us to not repeat their footstep who went astray. Just saying Allah can do what he wills is not evidence enough of what you believe in. No one denies Allah’s powers , but simply leaving it all to Allah to do everything is a very weak argument that you can bring forward. Allah has certain sunnah of His that he himself does not break. He is pure from all imperfections. When Allah says He will not do a certain thing, then no matter if hes a messenger of allah or not, He simply will not do it.. Allah says.. ‘you will not see any alteration in his ways’

Allah has set laws and runs the universe according to those laws, anyhow, your claim that Allah is bounded by his laws, by interpreting statement ‘You will not see any change in Allah’s ways (17:77)’ is completely wrong, as that statement only refers to general rules but not rules for specific occasions. Allah is neither bounded by laws he made nor is he obliged to follow those laws. That is why we see many miracles mentioned in Quran, and whenever miracle happens natural laws get violated. It means, if one takes ayah 17:77 literally for everything then the ayah becomes contradictory to many ayahs of Quran that talks about miracles [from stick of Musa (AS) to birth of Isa (AS)].

You’re pretty much following what I’m following. Except you assume fatwa of kufr will be charged and we’re living with the fatwa of kufr. But should the followers of Messiah worry about what majority of Muslims believe in ? nope.

It is a very dangerous charge not on Isa(as) but allah almighty to say that His mission was incomplete. No prophet was sent to humankind without any mission. Allah give them enough life for their mission to complete. You cannot show from anywhere if nauzubillah his mission went incomplete. His birth was a test to humankind, and his prophethood was a test to people. Prophethood is always a test for people..only pious people from heart accept prophets.

What serious charge? I believe that Isa (AS) mission in his first coming was incomplete (as planned by Allah), that would get completed on his second coming (as planned by Allah). Anyhow, if you think Isa (AS) completed his mission, then can you please write down the mission of Isa (AS) in his first coming, and how it got completed?

It is the prophets that bring shariat. Yes i believe Jesus(as) would need to learn Islam , Quran and the shariat. He was before Islam. Islam was after him. He is not given the knowledge of Islam. He will need to learn it. If he learns from Allah, then your belief that there is no form of revelation after Muhammad PBUH is contradictory.

Islam and laws of Islam belongs to Allah, and not to any prophet (AS). Humans (in spiritual form) were told everything about laws when Allah told to Adam (AS) at the time of his creation. Prophets are reminders of laws, and not giver of laws. All Prophets have knowledge of Islam from Allah and their knowledge is not time dependent. Well, that is my belief.

Just look at prayer of Ibrahim (AS) to see that what prophets bring, it is not theirs but whatever they brings belongs to Allah.

2:129 … Our Lord! and raise up in them an Apostle from among them who shall recite to them Thy communications and teach them the Book and the wisdom, and purify them; surely Thou art the Mighty, the Wise.

Clearly shows what Prophets do? They recite to people communications of Allah. So, it means, what prophets give to people do not belongs to them, but belongs to Allah.

As for Isa (AS) learning Quran: … Read the ayah:

5:110 … Ith qala Allahu yaAAeesa ibna maryama othkur niAAmatee AAalaykawaAAala walidatika ith ayyadtuka biroohialqudusi tukallimu annasa fee almahdi wakahlan wa-ith **AAallamtuka alkitaba wal hikma ta wat tawrata wal-injeela **wa-ithtakhluqu mina atteeni kahay-ati attayribi-ithnee fatanfukhu feeha fatakoonu tayranbi-ithnee watubri-o al-akmaha wal-abrasabi-ithnee wa-ith tukhriju almawta bi-ithneewa-ith kafaftu banee isra-eela AAanka ithji/tahum bilbayyinati faqala allatheenakafaroo minhum in hatha illa sihrun mubeen

Allah will say to Isa (AS): … I taught thee ‘The Kitab-ul-Hikmah’, and ‘The Tawrah’ and the ‘The Ingeel’.

Note: In Quran, Allah referred to Quran as ‘Kitab-ul-Hikmah’.

Above ayah shows that Allah not only taught Isa (AS) ‘Torah’ and ‘Injeel’ but also ‘Kitab-ul-Hikmah’.

Isa (as) was, is and will always remain a prophet wheresoever he may be. There are fatawas of your scholars saying that whoever says Jesus upon his second coming is not a prophet is indeed a kafir. Yes, to adjust ur belief of khatm e nabuwat, you have to also fit ur belief of Jesus (as) alive.. so thats twisting facts right there.

Takfeeri scholars are kharjees. So, who cares about those who would go to hell?

Anyhow, no one is denying that Isa (AS) in essence would be Prophet always. Isa (AS) would not be Prophet in his second coming, not because in essence he is not prophet, but because he would not declare himself Prophet.

As for me twisting facts, I believe I am not, rather I believe I am writing everything straight and clear.

Prophet Isa(as) is sent to bani israel. Thats how Allah address him in Quran. To believe that Isa(as) would do things not even Muhammad PBUH could do is just a good imagination. Jesus(as) cannot be a prophet or even an ordinary human in Muhammadi shariyah.

Isa(as) is and will remain a prophet sent to bani israel. Quran is unchangeable till qayamah. Upon his second coming, the verses that call him prophet sent to bani israel wont be taken out ..nauzubillah.

Why Isa (AS) could not be a Muslim, a follower of Prophet (SAW)? Any reason or it is your imagination?

Allah called him Prophet of Bani-Israel as he was prophet of Bani-Israel. Allah did not call him Prophet of ummat-e-Muhammad (SAW) because he would not be Prophet in his second appearance. So what troubles you, and why?

wrong example. Just because a science teacher sat in a math class would not make him give up his teaching degree. He is good in science and the other person is good in maths.. students can ask him any question in regards to science.. he can learn maths too.. no problem.. but he’ll still be a teacher of different subject.. same with Jesus.. He is a teacher for Bible, not Quran.

No, I do not think my example was wrong. Maybe you misunderstood me. Anyhow, let me give you another example that may be easy for you to understand.

Let say ‘A’ was teacher of maths. After retirement he joined computer class as student. So, in computer class, ‘A’ would be student and not teacher. In similar way:

Isa (AS) was Prophet of Bani-Israel. After finishing his job as prophet of Bani-Israel, Isa (AS) would appear as Ummati of Rasul-Allah (SAW). So, amongst Ummat-e-Rasul (SAW), Isa (AS) would be ummati and not Prophet.