Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

I totally agree ... whenever you read the ta'reef of books written by scholars they never say "I send salutations on RasoolAllah (SAW) the Bashr" - it sounds like such a deflated statement although it is truth. What we fail to realise is that Islam is also about adab ... and if we were smart we can acquire that adab from the writings of scholars.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Important note:

The term Bashr - can mean human especially when in the form al-bashru - but when written in indefinite form and regardless of this it has a much wider general meaning.

If you study the lexicon above the uses of the language show that the completer meaning of bashr is to have "apparency or physical form and to have a transient nature - i.e. that one is changing, growing hair, exposing skin, ageing, etc … bashr is an attributed of created living entities … and to say “I am bashr like you” is to say “I am unlike Divine just like you are unlike Divine” - which is not really a comparison between RasoolAllah (SAW) and the receiver of those words … It is common ground - finding a way to present commonality is what the gist of this is instruction is about … it is not about equating a similitude between RasoolAllah (SAW) and the opposite … however since the Qur’an is also a guidance for the whole of mankind it is applicable and permissible for others (like the dai’) to use the same method of engagement.

Yes he was/is (topic for another day) an ordinary man. At the same time he best of all creation. Allah Swt himself puts RasoolAllah on that pedestal.
Like brother Psyah said, follow the example of the Sahabah. They thought of him as a man but then would try to be to the first to get the water from the Prophet's Saw ablutions? Why? Did they know something that we don't?

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

^ JazakAllahukhair Sidi STONECOLD

It is part of iman that the best of people are the prophets (AS), then the Sahabah (RA), then the awliya (RA) from the ta'biyeen and then the awliya (RA) of the rest of time according to their degrees. The best of the prophets is RasoolAllah (SAW) - how we can cut through this and assume we can "be like" him (SAW) is amazing misunderstanding.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

wa alaikum Salam
You are the first of the people arguing against who has wrote salawat

But my title was not actually a question i was posing, it was something for the reader to reflect upon

No its not It’s challenging your incorrect reading of the verses

Both them verses are referred to the Disbelievers, and its only disbelievers that play upon the Human form of Prophets

The Qul to Believers is I AM NOT Like you, and We can not be Like Him

Btw The Ahlus Sunnah viewpoint is that to deny the Human form of RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam is kufr, However RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam should not be referred to as just Human, and if reference to His Human form is done incorrectly then that is also Kufr

These latter warnings are not required from you to Ahlus Sunnah because we have a fully compliant Tradition and Religion. Compliant with both the virtues and the prohibitions

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

[QUOTE]

Yes he was/is (topic for another day) an ordinary man. At the same time he best of all creation. Allah Swt himself puts RasoolAllah on that pedestal.
Like brother Psyah said, follow the example of the Sahabah. They thought of him as a man but then would try to be to the first to get the water from the Prophet's Saw ablutions? Why? Did they know something that we don't?

[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE]

It is part of iman that the best of people are the prophets (AS), then the Sahabah (RA), then the awliya (RA) from the ta'biyeen and then the awliya (RA) of the rest of time according to their degrees. The best of the prophets is RasoolAllah (SAW) - how we can cut through this and assume we can "be like" him (SAW) is amazing misunderstanding.

[/QUOTE]

I think all here are saying the same thing in their own way. No one is equating himself with the holy prophet (pbuh). This is a gross misconception.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Yes, the holy prophet (pbuh) is best of all creation. My understanding of the example you have quoted is that companions of the prophet (pbuh) truly valued his being that was indeed a blessing.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

What does 'abdu hu wa rasoolu' mean?

and the attribute 'other than bashar' , what was/is that? If you say Noor, then which Noor you talk about?

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Your first sentence is impermissible and incorrect

It means Best of Creation, and a Light

The servant (down, down the line) of This Abduhu wa Rasuluh Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam is given this: When I love him I am his hearing with which he hears, his seeing with which he sees, his hand with which he strikes and his foot with which he walks.
Hadith Qudsi Al-Bukhari

[quote]
and the attribute 'other than bashar' , what was/is that? If you say Noor, then which Noor you talk about?
[/quote]

The Noor that is undeniable from the Islamic texts

and it is with him throughout His Life

PS We are here to earn good deeds, send Peace And Blessings upon the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam. This has been notice-ably missing from you

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Why the hell do you keep talking vague?

Which noor are you talking about?

Is it the noor with which stars are made?

The noor which was pumped into the souls of all mankind

or the noor whcih is attribute of Allah?

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

'Abdu hu wa Rasoolu hu

means

His Bondsman and His Messenger

why?

The light issue should not be a problem in this day and age ... Light is from the creation ... Light is also Bashr ... Because it changes form has a start and is transient ... But of course it is the most excellent and piercing of transient forms.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Let me be a little blunt here.

Is the prophet SAW made of same noor that is used to describe Allah? Yes or No.

Is there anything else in the universe made of this same noor? Yes or No.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Peace pwner

You risk so much to ask your questions in such a manner, please be careful!

The light here is not Al-Nur ... Who is not Bashr ... Al-Nur is Allah (SWT) ... RasoolAllah (SAW) is Muneer.

his (SAW) light is a reflected light ... Allah (SWT) is The Light Source ... Never waning, all pervading ...

it is wrong to say any of Allah (SWT)'s Attributes are in any way transient ... Nothing is made from His Attributes ... And neither is He a constituent mixture of Things ... He is One and each Attribute is a Name of Him, they are not a part of Him and Oneness does not have parts or subdivisions.

We hold theology/aqeedah dear to our hearts ... Otherwise we could not approach with this love and remain correct.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

I apologise for bothering you and the vroom guy.

Too bad i thought you people would be able to answer questions directly , without going on tangents and relying on 'mystic' language. Too bad. You can go ahead and fatwa kufr on anyone who dares to ask a question.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Brother** vroom** :salam:

I beg your pardon, I don’t follow what you are trying say, please re-phrase. Thanks

Well, accept my apologies, I saw a question mark end of the post title and the sub-title and took it as a question.

**

**

That’s true that both verses are addressing the disbelievers of Makkah Al Mukarramah.

The disbelievers of Makkah being very haughty and full of self-importance always derided the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessing be upon him). They used to taunt him for claiming to be a Messenger from Allah Almighty by saying: “You are just one of us, why does not Allah come Himself or send us angels as messengers directly to us”?

So the versed quoted before and below are confirming to the disbelievers that Allah Almighty has sent a Human (Bashar) just like them – or from them – as a messenger. And this will be a trial for them.

And We have not sent before you any messengers but they most surely ate food and went about in the markets; and We have made some of you a trial for others; will you bear patiently? And your Lord is ever Seeing. [25:20]

And those who do not hope for Our meeting, say: Why have not angels been sent down upon us, or (why) do we not see our Lord? Now certainly they are too proud of themselves and have revolted in great revolt.** 25:21]**

Note: “but they most surely ate food and went about in the markets” in the above verse Allah Almighty confirms the Humanness of the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessing be upon him). Same words are used elsewhere addressing the Christians to confirm the humanness of Hz, Isa Ibn Maryum (as) and his blessed mother (ra),

Refer the verses quoted below:

And nothing prevented people from believing when the guidance came to them except that they said: What! has Allah raised up a mortal to be a messenger? [17:94]

Say: Had there been in the earth angels walking about as settlers, We would certainly have sent down to them from the heaven an angel as a messenger. [17:95]

See again that disbelievers objected to a mortal (Human being just like them) being sent as a messenger!

In the very verse Allah Almighty says that if angles were residing on the Earth – He would have sent an angel to them.

A Human being as a messenger to Human beings and an angel as a messenger to angels (if they needed one).

Like to the like.

“Imam Ibn Katheer (rahimahullah) writes in the Tafseer of the verse (17): 94-95, 'Allah says pointing out His Kindness and Mercy towards His servants, that He sends to them Messengers of their own kind so that they will understand what he says and will be able to speak to him directly. If He were to send to humanity a Messenger from among the angels, they would not be able to deal with him face to face and learn from him, as Allah says, ‘Indeed, Allah conferred a great favour on the believers when He sent among them a Messenger (Muhammad) from among themselves.’ [Soorah aal-Imran (3): 164] Allah says here, 'Say, ‘If there were on the earth, angels walking about in peace and security,’ just as you do, ‘We should certainly have sent down for them from the heaven an angel as a Messenger,’ meaning ‘one of their own kind. But as you are human, We have sent to you Messengers from yourselves, as a kindness and a mercy.’

*Another wisdom behind the human origin of the Messengers is that all the Messengers had the same attributes as the other human beings to whom they were sent, including physical bodies which needed food, drink and rest. They had experiences similar to that of other human beings; they enjoyed health and suffered from sickness, they were exposed to trials and tribulations and they also faced death. They had no special divine qualities, power or strength. Thus, they could become a living example of the Deen they were sent with.

This also discards any possibility of anyone arguing that the nature of the Messengers was different from the humans and thus, they could effectively accomplish all the duties of the religion, which are unfeasible for the humans to carry out. Thus, the sending of humans as Messengers is a greater test, it is mentioned in a Qudsi Hadeeth that Allah said, ‘I have only sent you (i.e., Prophet Muhammad sallallahu alahi wa-sallam) in order to test you and to test others by you.’ [Mukhtasar Saheeh Muslim by al-Mundhiri, p.283]*

So, the disbelievers during the time of the Prophet (sallallahu alahi wa-sallam) rejected the message of Allah’s Messenger (sallallahu alahi wa-sallam) because he was a human being from among themselves and their argument was, ‘How could a human being be a Prophet?’ for they had seen and touched the Prophet (sallallahu alahi wa-sallam) and knew that he was flesh and blood. So, they demanded an angel to be sent as a Prophet to them. Thus, asserting that an angel is more suitable for the job of Prophet-hood!!”

Yet another Verse confirming that only a Human can be sent as a messenger to Humans – not angels!

And they say: Why has not an angel been sent down to him? And had We sent down an angel, the matter would have certainly been decided and then they would not have been respited. [6:8]

And if We had made him angel, We would certainly have made him a man, and We would certainly have made confused to them what they make confused. **[6:9]
**

Read up from the following :
Quran Tafsir Ibn Kathir - Only Human Messengers have been Sent

Which verse is that?

Please I request you as a brother in faith (if you accept that) not to limit Ahlul Sunnah Wal Jammah to Barlevi sect – in the other thread you were sticking this label erroneously to the great Imaams (they were far away from what you were sticking on them to be.)

Yes to you, your actions and deeds are far more important than the warnings from the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessing be upon him)

Being Human being like us doesn’t take away the highest Status that he has.

Allah Almighty created Mankind as best of His creation and the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) is the best of Mankind.
He is the most cherished and beloved to Allah Almighty from His Creation.

He is the leader of All the Prophet (peace and blessing be upon them all) and Mankind.

Being a Prophet he is the Purest of the Pure. Noblest of the Noble. He is all Goodness and nothing but Goodness emanates from him.

Allah Almighty has made him infallible and sinless.

He is the best example to be followed – all his actions are Sunnah and very dear to Allah Almighty.

We have to follow his Sunnah and actions fully well knowing that no one can ever reach his status and rank.

The reward lies in trying to and effort put in following his Sunnah.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Well my personal belief is:

The Prophet's Peace and Blessings be upon Him and His Family Nur is the Nur of Allah, with the understanding that it is Nur from Allah, A Pure Nur Created by Allah

It is unobtainable, to the same level, by anyone else as Master of The Messengers Peace and Blessings be upon Him and His Family

Allah Most Merciful guides by Light

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

I'll answer this point whilst I read and understand what you are saying on the topic

Barelvis are undoubtedly from The Jamaah of Ahlus Sunnah. The Most you can say is truth is not with Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah. You only have to look at what you do to the Books of Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jamaah, you take out the 'Barelvi' beliefs in your abridged fabrications. Without admitting the fatwa which would apply to them beliefs from your side. Then you have the cheek to ask Qadianis why they don't make takfir on the Mainstream openly. This is Taqiyyah. I do believe the Najdiyyah movement is Taqiyyah ridden

Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jamaah is the form of Islam which ruled the Hijaz before Wahabis took over, which was around before the Najdiyyah movemnet started and as such we have enjoyed Leadership of this Ummah for a long period of time. We continue to maintain that we are Ahlus Sunnah Wal Jamaah, and there is No Precedent to the Najdi dawa. You are foreigners

Now we have an issue ahead of us, which will further show us who is and who is not Ahlus Sunnah wal Jamaah

I will read and reply to the points you have made on the topic of this thread and we can explore the subject more.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

:salam2: Brother STONECOLD - I agree with you that we have to follow the example of the Sahabah (may Allah Almighty be pleased with them all) They truly loved the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) and proved it so with their deeds and sacrifices.

They not only just thought that he was a man - they KNEW that he was a man - Bashar.

Allah Almighty is witness that the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) gave us complete Islam and held nothing back - same is case about the blessed Sahabah (may Allah Almighty be pleased with them all) - if “they knew something that we don’t” do you think that they held something back?

I am sure you didn’t mean that.

If you refer to earliest sources that you will have no problem believing that the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) was human with all the qualities of Prophet hood included. He was the best Human ever.

All these disputes crept in after the third generationafter the Blessed Prophet’s (peace and blessings be upon him) passing away.

The Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) had warned us that after the third generation many disputes will enter into Islam and that we must stick to what the Quran and Sunnah have to say about matters.

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

Did I not answer your question?

Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?

You say nur of allah and then say nur from allah. Kindly clarify.