Is Prophet (PBUH) A Man Like Us? by Peer Saqib Shaami Sahib
Discuss anything you want on the topic
Some very fine lines on what is permissible and what is not, what is Mustahab and what is not
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
According to the fatwa of Peer Meher Ali Shah Rehmatullah Alaih the minimum a Muslim can equate the Bashirat of The Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam is as Khairul Bashar. Meaning it is not permissible to go around calling The Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam as just bashar, Naudhubillah
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
what does this mean " the minimum a Muslim can equate the.....as Khairul Bashar. "
What to go around calling, other than 'bashar' ??
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
what does this mean " the minimum a Muslim can equate the.....as Khairul Bashar. "
Yes, Always more then just Bashar, Khairul Bashar is the minimum given By Peer Meher Ali Shah
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What to go around calling, other than 'bashar' ??
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Yes, to call The Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam as just Bashar is KUFR in some cases
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
Then say what?
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِّثْلُكُمْ يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ أَنَّمَا إِلَـٰهُكُمْ إِلَـٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۖ فَمَن كَانَ يَرْجُو لِقَاءَ رَبِّهِ فَلْيَعْمَلْ عَمَلًا صَالِحًا وَلَا يُشْرِكْ بِعِبَادَةِ رَبِّهِ أَحَدًا ﴿١١٠﴾
Say, "I am only a man like you, to whom has been revealed that your god is one God. So whoever would hope for the meeting with his Lord - let him do righteous work and not associate in the worship of his Lord anyone." (110)
surah kahf
this is what Allah saying in Quran..
may Allah guide all of us and protect us Ameen
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
According to the fatwa of Peer Meher Ali Shah Rehmatullah Alaih the minimum a Muslim can equate the Bashirat of The Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam is as Khairul Bashar. Meaning it is not permissible to go around calling The Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam as just bashar, Naudhubillah
Would you mind stating your point of view in clear words. Please add a few more lines
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
The holy Quran is witness to this fact that only Men have come as messengers of Allah for the guidance of mankind. So messengers/prophets were raised from among the people they were meant to guide. They were born and lead life as humans do. They ate, drunk slept, got married, had kids, grew older and passed away as humans. but they certainly were the best among their people and the holy prophet (pbuh) is rightly called "Khair-ul-bashar" i.e., the best among humans and whenever obeying Allah is mentioned, obeying the messenger (pbuh) is also mentioned. So What really is the issue?
There were people who raised the status of their prophet and made him God or son of God perhaps in reverence or to find an excuse to not follow the example of their prophet especially his high morals. Please don't get angry. I am just trying to figure out as what is the thinking behind this debate?
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
^ The crux of this issue the way I see it is ... In order to restore Islam in the hearts of Muslims the key is to restore the correct view and perception of RasoolAllah (SAW) ...
A modern fitnah has had us diminish the importance and love we ought to show him(SAW) ...
Shirk is the accusation levelled at people for showing respect to RasoolAllah (SAW) and the counter argument presented here is the accusations are baseless ...
I am with kchughtai on this. Prophet was a human; he had humanly needs; he had wives; he used to get hungry and go to sleep and bathroom. He was the best human, but he was the human indeed.
If you treat him like above humans, then following sunnah becomes meaningless. How can us humans act like someone who was not a human.
Pardon me for being blunt, but putting prophet on a high unattainable pedestal is a saazish of keeping Muslims away from sunnah.
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
قُلْ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ مِّثْلُكُمْ يُوحَىٰ إِلَيَّ أَنَّمَا إِلَـٰهُكُمْ إِلَـٰهٌ وَاحِدٌ ۖ فَمَن كَانَ يَرْجُو لِقَاءَ رَبِّهِ فَلْيَعْمَلْ عَمَلًا صَالِحًا وَلَا يُشْرِكْ بِعِبَادَةِ رَبِّهِ أَحَدًا ﴿١١٠﴾
Say, "I am only a man like you, to whom has been revealed that your god is one God. So whoever would hope for the meeting with his Lord - let him do righteous work and not associate in the worship of his Lord anyone." (110)
surah kahf
this is what Allah saying in Quran..
may Allah guide all of us and protect us Ameen
Ameen to your dua
The verse says
Qul [say to the disbelievers, munafiqs] I am a Man of Flesh like you [a Creation,, and can be seen, not a God, nor an Angel]. Has been revealed to me that your God is One God
And Verse 6 of Surah Ha mim Sajda (41)
[HMSajdah 41:6] Proclaim (O dear Prophet Mohammed - peace and blessings be upon him), “Physically I am a human like you - I receive the divine revelation that your God is only One God, therefore be upright towards Him and seek forgiveness from Him”; and woe is to the polytheists. -
Proclaim/Say to the Disbelievers! That I am Physically a human (Bashar, skin, visible) like you (like you of what we share, like visible and have skin (not same Quality of skin mind you))
You did not say much from yourself so I have no concise point to explore with you but both the above are Quls to the **Disbelievers
**The Muslim prospective is a little different
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
Then say what?
Say Khairul Khalq Say Khairul Bashar
Say RasoolAllah, say Nabi Allah, Say HabibAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam
Would you mind stating your point of view in clear words. Please add a few more lines
The point was limited to what you saw, it was concise and clear
You can hold me to those words
Say if what i said is really not clear to you due to a culture shock, or other reason then what I said was - It is impermissible to call the Prophet Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam as just Bashar
I will have a look at your other post later, we will talk In Sha Allah
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
The holy Quran is witness to this fact that only Men have come as messengers of Allah for the guidance of mankind.
Prophets and Angels Salam Alaih have come as Messengers, Those who refer to Prophets Salam Alaih as just Bashars have been Disbelievers
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So messengers/prophets were raised from among the people they were meant to guide.
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Well you can say that, unless your intention is to belittle, but Prophets Salam Alaih are also Sent. Certainly RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam was a Prophet when Adam Salam Alaih was between Ruh and Jism
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They were born and lead life as humans do.
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They were on a Mission, but they took part in Human life - yes
Not All our Prophets were born in the normal manner, nor were their life confined to normal human life
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They ate, drunk slept, got married, had kids, grew older and passed away as humans.
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reference to Prophets as just Bashar is from the Sunnah of shaitan and then the human disbelievers
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but they certainly were the best among their people and the holy prophet (pbuh) is rightly called "Khair-ul-bashar" i.e., the best among humans and whenever obeying Allah is mentioned, obeying the messenger (pbuh) is also mentioned.
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The Prophets Salam Alaih are better then their people, The Awliya are best among their people but All Awliya put together are not comparable to One Prophet
As for RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam we have some clues about Him, as opposed to Allah Subhanhu wa Ta'ala about whom I have very little with the promise that i lack the comprehension in any case, but we have not been able to comprehend the exact make-up of RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alihi wa Sallam. It is certainly greater then what you think (Although it is Creation, It - The Reality- is greater in Brilliance then comprehension allows)
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So What really is the issue?
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Its purely a matter between those who claim to be upon Islam, and especially those who claim to be upon the Sunnah
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There were people who raised the status of their prophet and made him God or son of God perhaps in reverence or to find an excuse to not follow the example of their prophet especially his high morals.
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In Muslims seeing the virtues of Creation only alludes to How Great Allah Subhanahu wa Ta'ala is. Allah The One is above what you may associate with him by looking at the virtues of His Creation
Allah The One Himself named us from his own name Al-Mu'min. Belief in One God, without shirk Al-Akbar, is something that has been given to this Ummah
This is given to us if we take on board the virtues that may have led others to associate partners with Allah The Only One, if we do it without accepting those virtues of creation then that can be disbelief, or a weak belief. Ahlus Sunnah are Solid in their Belief and upon the religion that there is no God but One God
Allah Subhanhu wa Ta'ala gives to whom He pleases without Measure
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Please don't get angry. I am just trying to figure out as what is the thinking behind this debate?
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It is not just about debating, but it is a wonderful Aqeedah issue and if denied it is a potential Kufr issue that people should be aware of. I will stand up to Ahul bidah but that is of secondary importance, my main aim is to show the Light of Traditional Genuine Islam.
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
^ What exactly is in your opinion correct view of the holy prophet (pbuh). state it clearly before issuing takfiri fatwas and state the basis of your belief
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
Brother **vroom ** :salam2:
You posed this question
Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
The Blessed Quran answers:
Say: "I am but a man like yourselves, (but) the inspiration has come to me, that your Allah is one Allah: whoever expects to meet his Lord, let him work righteousness, and, in the worship of his Lord, admit no one as partner. [18:110]
Say: “I am but a man like you: It is revealed to me by Inspiration, that your Allah is one Allah: so stand true to Him, and ask for His Forgiveness.” And woe to those who join gods with Allah, - [41:6]
To believe that the Blessed Prophet (peace and blessings be upon be upon him) ‘something’ more than Bashar (Human - Man) is challenging the Words of Allah Almighty
Of course we must love the Blessed Prophet (peace be upon him) him greatly, more than anything and everything in this world, more than oneself and our parents. Hence, we should send blessings on him and praise him as much as we can. This is what Allah Almighty has commanded us to do.
Allah and His angels send blessings on the Prophet: O you that believe! Send your blessings on him, and salute him with all respect. (33:56)
And show reverence to him that he deserves as the best and the most beloved to Allah Almighty from His Creation.
We must acknowledge that he is our master, our leader, most beloved to us, our hope for intercession on the Day of Judgement.
He is the best example to be followed for our salvation in the hereafter and successful life in this world.
Certainly you have in the Messenger of Allah an excellent exemplar for him who hopes in Allah and the latter day and remembers Allah much. [33:21]
Having said the above, we must also heed the words of the Blessed Prophet (peace be upon him)
“Beware of exaggeration. Your predecessors perished on account of their exaggeration.” Musnad Imam Ahmad
On the authority of Hz. Umar ibn al-Khattab (Allah be pleased with him) that he heard the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) say: Do not exaggerate in praising me as the Christians praised the son of Mary, for I am only a Slave. So, call me the Slave of Allah and His Messenger. (Sahih al-Bukhari, no: 3261)
When some people said to Allah’s Messenger (Peace and blessings be upon him): “O Messenger of Allah, you are the best and the son of the best among us, and our master and the son of our master.” He (Peace and blessings be upon him) addressed him saying: “O people! Make your requests straightforward and let not Shaytaan lure you saying the wrong things. I am only the slave of Allah, and His Messenger. I do not like you to elevate me above my rank in which Allah, the Exalted, has praised me.” Musnad Ahmad and an-Nasa’ee.
May Allah guide all of us and protect us Ameen
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
**
25:8) And they say, ‘What is the matter with this Messenger that he eats food, and walks in the streets? Why has not an angel been sent down to him that he might be a warner with him?**
People always had their own cooked up ideas about prophets/messengers and they tried to judge the prophets based on their own perceptions. How could a person that eats food and walks in the streets can be a messenger of Allah? They wanted to have something fantastic. Sometimes, they asked the prophet to go to heavens before their eyes and bring a book from there and sometimes they asked for Allah to appear before them so that they could believe. We all know the response to such demands...
Now for some of those who believed, the same mindset was not completely gone and they attributed fantastic tales and attributes to their prophets.
Having said that, there are also people who belittle the importance of prophets by saying that they were mere vessels through whom we got message of Allah.
Both views of "Afrat and Tafreet" are not right. The holy prophet (pbuh) the messenger of the final testament from Allah. With his advent, ONLY his message and his example is the source of guidance for all mankind and till the end of times. As per Quran, he is the "siraj-e-munir" of guidance.
33:47) And as a Summoner unto Allah by His command, and as a Lamp that gives *bright *light.
but still he was a human as per the holy Quran and he was flesh and bones like us but certainly not an ordinary person. A person following whom can raise your status before Allah cannot be just a person.
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
^ The crux of this issue the way I see it is ... In order to restore Islam in the hearts of Muslims the key is to restore the correct view and perception of RasoolAllah (SAW) ...
A modern fitnah has had us diminish the importance and love we ought to show him(SAW) ...
Shirk is the accusation leveled at people for showing respect to RasoolAllah (SAW) and the counter argument presented here is the accusations are baseless ...
I have not accused those who show love to the holy prophet as doing shirk. Your accusation is not true. I gave example of others who in reverence or otherwise have raised the status of their prophets and made them more than humans sometimes attributed divinity to them.
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
I am with kchughtai on this. Prophet was a human; he had humanly needs; he had wives; he used to get hungry and go to sleep and bathroom. He was the best human, but he was the human indeed.
If you treat him like above humans, then following sunnah becomes meaningless. How can us humans act like someone who was not a human.
Pardon me for being blunt, but putting prophet on a high unattainable pedestal is a saazish of keeping Muslims away from sunnah.
Peace bro TLK
It has become my belief that RasoolAllah (SAW) was sent to us as a Mercy from Allah (SWT). This does not mean he (SAW) was not human. This "he was not human" line - is not what anyone is saying, but rather is the accusation on those who give him (SAW) high acclaim. His (SAW) Sunnah is different from what the Sahabah used to do ... He (SAW) was allowed more wives, his (SAW) thighs were not part of his (SAW)'s satr, his (SAW) saliva was cleansing, his (SAW)'s sweat was perfumed, for him (SAW) 6 prayers were mandatory, and his (SAW)'s prayer was different - It is a requisite for Muslims to love RasoolAllah (SAW) more than anyone else, but where he (SAW) himself used to love, and loves, the Ummah more than himself (SAW).
We should follow the example of the followers of RasoolAllah (SAW) ... see how they (RA) treated him (SAW) - so the alleged conflict of following him (SAW) is not really there. There are aspects of imitation in his (SAW)'s life and there are aspects of awe and humility that we were never meant to attempt to replicate.
And if you want evidence of this I can oblige - but I'm sure you have heard the arguments before and perhaps seen the evidence too.
Re: Is RasoolAllah Sallallahu Alaihi wa Alehi wa Sallam A Man like Us?
I have not accused those who show love to the holy prophet as doing shirk. Your accusation is not true. I gave example of others who in reverence or otherwise have raised the status of their prophets and made them more than humans sometimes attributed divinity to them.
Neither have I accused thou of such accusation ... I was talking about the OP's purpose - but note what may appear like divinity to you - is merely adoration to others. You need to define very clearly by what you mean to be Divine attributes. I believe it is our business to understand our aqeedah deeply ... and this is a conversation worth having.