is humanity different than religious piety?
is it?
discuss, please only those who are going to share valid and serious talking points.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
humanity is usually empathy trigered
piety is inspired by religious beliefs
but religious beliefs may contradict with humanity
the most striking example is the intolerance of other faiths and practices that religious people have, that is opposite of humanity beliefs of tolerance and freedom
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
^ very nicely darya ko kozay mein band kar diya.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Humanity is everything religions r nothing. Relgions cant be matched with humanity coz Religions r against humanity. 
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
IN RELIGION service to god is greater , than anything else ......
OUTSIDE RELIGION service to humanity is greater , than anything else .....
Then again, humans are for real and god only exists in the faith of religious people....
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
The biggest Difference is that with Religious piety you will in all probability find discrimination amongst people.
In humanity - no discrimination.
Therefore, I have more respect for humanity than religious piety.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
i agree with everyone - parisinoor, hollow man and light bearer& aly-sam, thanks for your comments and perspective on religion and its conflict with humanity, but, i would like to say that being honestly religious, ‘in the right way’, (for the argument’s sake), like islam is, ( as it truly is), should make the doubts impossible to come in the mind that piety is in contradiction with humanity.
humans are given the ability to protect as they make use of the bounties of God given resources on earth. all life forms are to be respected by us unless we have our own survival at stake. so all things being equal, ideally, we ought not to be instinctual but the total opposite in nature as it is our selves being wired as humane creatures.
i think it is an honor all of humanity itself, that before being pious as religious, humans acknowledge that they have to be 'humane'
comparison with other species will show this clearly, we have speech ability thru which we communicate our thoughts, and feelings
& we are capable of expressed emotions.
to being religious, it means that humans have a guideline, of either divine or self-constructed ethics, or rules, within which we experiment with the ideals of human behavioral sophistication & transparent motives.
how ever, in the real world, today, neither humanity, nor religion for the most part, is as effective as it should have been.
there has to be a revival, of the spirit of being self- accountability.
to me, only in this way, individuals are groups, whether humane and religious or simply truly religious, will be humble and practically humane , adequately to qualify the true character of being homo-sapiens, which is supposed to be the better of all species,
in terms of its ability to think and reason, & to differentiate between rights & wrongs.
does this make sense? <!--[if !supportEmptyParas]--> <!--[endif]-->
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
I agree with Dushwari here -and disagree with others-
if religion is practised in the right way then it is greater than humanity. Because religion -practiced in the right way- not only encompasses humanity, but is extended beyond humanity.
The examples brought forward in this thread arguing against religion are flawed in that they compare the (wrong) practice of religion with the concept of humanity. You should either compare the concepts of both, or the practice of both. If you do the latter, you will find that religion is often practiced in the wrong way (e.g. extremism, intolerance), but humanity is very scarce as well.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
You guys are right about religions generally having contradiction with humanity.
But there is one religion that I know which does not contradict with humanity at all, that is Islam.
Islam does not only prohibit assaulting non-Muslims who do not wrong us, but also urges us to treat them well and be just when dealing with them. Thus, it is prohibited to attack their places of worship. This is based on the fact that assaulting such places is considered to be an act of injustice, which neither Allah nor His Messenger accept. Freedom of religion and belief is a right which Islam guarantees, Allah Almighty says, There is no compulsion in religion] (Al-Baqarah 2:256).
Islam guarantees the fundamental rights of the individual and does not permit anyone to tamper with them.
In Islam, all men are equal, regardless of color, language, race, or nationality. It addresses itself to the conscience of humanity and banishes all false barriers of race, status, and wealth. There can be no denying the fact that such barriers have always existed and continue to exist today in the so-called enlightened age. Islam removes all of these impediments and proclaims the ideal of the whole of humanity being one family of God.
OUTSIDE RELIGION service to humanity is greater , than anything else .....
Then again, humans are for real and god only exists in the faith of religious people....
What you have just said is like saying "I dont know Islam"
Even in a human welfare organisation we have a position of the president. What's the good reason for that?
I see that your problem is with service to God.
But atheism is not the topic today.
Therefore, I have more respect for humanity than religious piety.
Islam is international in its outlook and approach and does not admit barriers and distinctions based on color, clan, blood, or territory, as was the case before the advent of the Prophet Muhammad S.A.W.
Unfortunately, these prejudices remain rampant in different forms even in this modern age. Islam wants to unite the entire human race under one banner. To a world torn by national rivalries and feuds, it presents a message of life and hope and of a glorious future.
If there is any Muslim by birth in earlier posts of this thread trying to be extraordinary humanitarian, I'd suggest him to go to his mother and ask her about Islam if she hasnt told him already.
Only Islam makes you a good humanitarian.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Only Islam makes you a good humanitarian.
Theoretically, I agree with you. There should not be any discrimanation in Islam. However,, practially having recived life experience with the represantatives of Islam ie Muslims (not all of course but enough to make me say this) there is no adherence to that requirement of non-discrimination. Even I face discrimination against my children...very sad state of affairs. I prefer to deal with a humanitarian than a religious person...any day.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
in life experiences case, like aly-sam said, i agree. only i know, as a sunni, how much the shia-sunni divide hurts me.
one of my best friends is from shia faith.
also, prejudice does not suit Muslims.
we need to transcend that mental attitude of being the better ones.
because when you are humane, you are according your self a place of humility, compassion and self less regard for others around yourself.
and vow to never hurt anyone's sentiments, to get a kick out of...
]still, i feel that even though it might be hard in your case, with life experiences, to feel that so called 'religious' people discriminate,
keep the hope that there are among us, those who will also step forward and denounce such contradiction in the hakook-al-ibaad across various back grounds, and across ages.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
How much really do our clergymen preach about Haqooqul Ibad, very little. You can hear from them all the dfferences among different sects and about Masail-salaatozakaat but very little about HaqooqulIbad. May be they are do not understand sociology. Same goes with shias, ur shia friend may utter all the filth he knows on another human and it will be termed by his fellows as being "bcoz of the love of Ali"
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
To err is human
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
also, prejudice does not suit Muslims. we need to transcend that mental attitude of being the better ones.
because when you are humane, you are according your self a place of humility, compassion and self less regard for others around yourself. and vow to never hurt anyone's sentiments, to get a kick out of...
]still, i feel that even though it might be hard in your case, with life experiences, to feel that so called 'religious' people discriminate,
keep the hope that there are among us, those who will also step forward and denounce such contradiction in the hakook-al-ibaad across various back grounds, and across ages.
You started for theory but now you seem to be picking on its practise.
By the way, is it the religion that you have problems with or the religious people?
I know many so called 'humanitarians' who discriminate. I have experienced very corrupt humanitarians in many NGOs and Welfare Trusts.
Do you know why is that so? Because neither members of an NGO nor followers of a religion come from another world.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Ihtesham,
theory and practice in inquiry goes hand in hand. one without the other, is shallow.
to frame the logic of this query, i would offer the meaning of the word 'piety', which is --> 'devoutness' to the fulfillment of natural requirements for obligations.
yes, i think that the religion will be/can be one with humanity & piety, but the followers of the religion may not be 'humane' and/or 'pious', given the unpredictability of human nature or environmental limitations.
NGOs, welfare trusts, just like any where else, will have their own agendas. they are good Samaritans maybe, but they the instance of the discriminating ones are obviously hypocrites. the real good is done, when no one else knows but the doer and the begetter of the deed's effects.
& that is why i strongly say that self-accountability is the primal factor in making someone honest with both the religious piety as well as enable the individual or collective society into doing good deeds, with a selfless cause for improving the human condition, & the environmental condition for all life forms.
i always use this example that yes, it takes one to get one, in many situations -but in real life interactions, one does not have to be good or bad, to happen good or bad to them, all the time, good happens to some bad people and bad happens to many good people.
if we believe that such a fate has to be a pre-ordained bigger picture, then God still gave us ability of will-power, so that we may see the differenced between right and wrong, after making sense of who is who and what is what...so that is a plus and a positive thing against worldly odds, if you will.
rest is a draw of the luck or a drawback, each time human beings fail at piety & that is what we need to address.
dushi
[quote=Ihtesham]
You started for theory but now you seem to be picking on its practise.
By the way, is it the religion that you have problems with or the religious people?
I know many so called 'humanitarians' who discriminate. I have experienced very corrupt humanitarians in many NGOs and Welfare Trusts.
Do you know why is that so? Because neither members of an NGO nor followers of a religion come from another world.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Bismillah ir-Rahman ir-Rahim
I wrote such a long post and lost it when i was pasting it because i accidently pressed copy rather than paste over previous text, and i didnt save the post i wrote out in word. Drat!!! O well let me write something brief. Without Islam there is no Humanity. If you look at the world, people who are most committing crimes are ones who are athiest. Religion (especially islam) hits the headlines alot though for reasons i am sure many here understand. Put it this way, I like money! So whats stopping me from robbing a bank? I might get shot! But who cares? No punishment for me if i die! This is the type of mentality non thinking individual would have! The ones who lie to themselves to make themselves feel better that there is no need to worry about the afterlife. Islam is the true faith and humanity cannot be separated from this religion. It was a gift to us from lord Almighty and we must obey our creator. If a muslim commits a crime it would either be out of ignorance (ignoring the faith), lack of understanding (not learned in faith) or revenge (low patience and wanting to get back at people who are oppressing them, in an unorthodox manner). If people believe in humanity so much, why are they intolerant against peoples faiths? Afterall humanity includes everyone doesnt it?
My faith is further reinforced by the Holy Quraan and Hadith Subhan'ALLAH.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Yes I know what is piety I'm not retarded.
Thank you anyway.
And I have already mentioned that how both of them are equal but you are too confused to be specific about your opinion and keep it short and simple. Just see below :)
cheers
yes, i think that the religion will be/can be one with humanity & piety, but the followers of the religion may not be 'humane' and/or 'pious', given the unpredictability human nature or environmental limitations.
NGOs, welfare trusts, just like any where else, will have their own agenda. they are good Samaritans maybe, but they the instance of the discriminating ones are obviously hypocrites. the real good is done, when no one else knows but the doer and the begetter of the deed's effects.
& that is why i strongly say that self-accountability is the primal factor in making someone honest with both the religious piety as well as enable the individual or collective society into doing good deeds, with a selfless cause for improving the human condition, & the environmental condition for all life forms.
i always use this example that yes, it takes one to get one, in many situations -but in real life interactions, one does not have to be good or bad, to happen good or bad to them, all the time, good happens to some bad people and bad happens to many good people.
if we believe that such a fate has to be a pre-ordained bigger picture, then God still gave us ability of will-power, so that we may see the differenced between right and wrong, after making sense of who is who and what is what...so that is a plus and a positive thing against worldly odds, if you will
rest is a draw of the luck or a drawback, each time that piety human beings fail piety . & that is what we need to address.
dushi
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
Islam does not only prohibit assaulting non-Muslims who do not wrong us, but also urges us to treat them well and be just when dealing with them. Thus, it is prohibited to attack their places of worship. This is based on the fact that assaulting such places is considered to be an act of injustice, which neither Allah nor His Messenger accept. Freedom of religion and belief is a right which Islam guarantees, Allah Almighty says, There is no compulsion in religion] (Al-Baqarah 2:256).
Islam guarantees the fundamental rights of the individual and does not permit anyone to tamper with them. In Islam, all men are equal, regardless of color, language, race, or nationality. It addresses itself to the conscience of humanity and banishes all false barriers of race, status, and wealth. There can be no denying the fact that such barriers have always existed and continue to exist today in the so-called enlightened age. Islam removes all of these impediments and proclaims the ideal of the whole of humanity being one family of God.
Only Islam makes you a good humanitarian.
Kindly tell which country this system is working perfectly and everything is hunky dorey, As someone has said in this thread having a theory without practice is not practical.
Why do you think Buddhism cannot makes you a good humanatarian? Buddhism may not be a good religion to run the country as Islam is but Buddhists are more humane then us. Go figure.
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
^one can turn it around and ask you to name a country in which humanity is working perfectly fine?
This discussion is actually going nowhere: everyone is comparing the theoretical framework of the theory he/she supports with the practical frailties of the theory he/she is against: then of course the theoretical framework -whichever it is- 'wins'
Re: is humanity different than religious piety?
^But humanity is not claiming to be perfect or devine which religion clearly states about itself.