Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Indians are right, they never interfere in Pakistani affairs, the countless consulates in Afghanistan are there only to help them construct roads. How can anyone believe otherwise. If Indians say they are only there to construct roads than that is what they are doing. How can they even think of even interfering in their neighbors country.
one thing which real cracks me is that every Indian shouts from rooftops that they couldn't care less about Pakistan, yet the whole nation is possessed with Pakistan and everything Pakistan does.
India is not involved in Baluchistan, yeah right, I also saw pigs fly.
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Musharraf yesterday claimed that ISI propped up Taliban to counter India in Afghanistan, wouldn't India, Afghanistan and US have responded in the same coin? These games of the ISI and who has suffered the most as a result?
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Yes, Indians make sun and moon go around and created the world too. I wonder sometimes if there is anything Indians cannot do.
BTW first thing first, who cares what DG ISPR says, they are a full blown propaganda machine against the state of pakistan and india. They have no credibility left. They hire the services of likes of Zaid hamid to manipulate opinions.
Second he said most of them are pakistanis and next thing he said was all circumstantial. You can blame anyone if you go with your hunch.
Oh, give it a rest.
There are some Pakistanis who reflexively blame India. However, the level of paranoia that Indians have for Pakistan is unmatched. If a firecracker goes off somewhere in India, your media and politicians start blaming Pakistan right away. Also funny how 'evidence' is later recovered that confirms the prophecies of these people. What became of the terror boat?
So let's climb down from the high horse and admit that Indians are a little obsessed with Pakistan. Want to see proof? Look at the comments section of any article in any newspaper that remotely mentions Pakistan.
Pakistan has been much more restrained than india when it comes to blaming the other.
India hasn't lost an inch of territory because of Pakistan. We've lost a part of our country thanks to your direct interference. Funny how that's never part of the calculation.
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
If Indians arent involved, then whats the purpose of India's spy agency ? Do Indians just sit there innocently and take the abuse, while Pakistan is supposedly involved in India? Seems far fetched to believe India isnt involved in some clandestine operations..
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I am for once really glad that General Bajwa has spoken about it openly...as a matter of fact if our army has solid proof of this, they shd present this to the international media. Pakistan govt shd make it an international issue as well. Show the intelligence proofs to ambassadors in Islamabad in private sittings. why have we been shy about this topic for so long especially if we have some sort of proof...so i am glad that general bajwa has openly taken a position on this issue
we shd make so much noise about it just like Indians do on their side. because if we decided to keep quiet then everyone will think that we have no serious case.
on the other hand, General Musharraf admitted that when he was in power, Pakistan sought to undermine the government of former Afghan president Hamid Karzai and for that Pakistani spies in the Inter-Services Intelligence directorate (ISI) cultivated the Taliban after 2001 because Karzai’s government was dominated by non-Pashtuns, the country’s largest ethnic group, and officials who were thought to favour India....
now why would you say such things to the international press...it will hurt us. can you imagine a usa or indian general saying these things in an interview to guardian...
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
But some how Pakistan can operate in Afghanistan without a problem?
Not without problems, but Pakistan has pashtoons, mullahs with jihadi islam etc it has used and abused for decades to operate in Afghanistan.
As is very obvious to even the intentionally blind, today there are some very serious problems because of this "operation". And they just wont go away.
besides, a simple search on youtube will show you plenty of videos of pakistani taliban (punjabis, no less) captured by nato and afghan forces. has there been even one indian captured in balochistan?
At best, India can bankroll these militants. But there is no need when they are bankrolled by rich god-fearing muslims' charity money. On that note, is this "charity/terrorist" organization jamaat ud dawa banned yet in Pak? India cant do the kind of harm Pakistan does to itself day in day out.
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Even if Indians are funding terrorist groups who is joining them and taking money to protect torture dungeons beneath bazaar shops in miramshah and other such places in north and south waziristan? It's pakistanis. They know other pakistanis are being kidnapped and ransomed and they help. Unless the people in FATA and waziristan areas don't consider themselves Pakistani and don't recognize international borders
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Even if Indians are funding terrorist groups who is joining them and taking money to protect torture dungeons beneath bazaar shops in miramshah and other such places in north and south waziristan? It's pakistanis. They know other pakistanis are being kidnapped and ransomed and they help. Unless the people in FATA and waziristan areas don't consider themselves Pakistani and don't recognize international borders
fair point..and it is not fata and waziristan based problem only. we have punjabi taliban as well. We all know that throughout punjab, there are elements who sympathize with these taliban, help them to hide, provide them with shelter, food and other related logistic facilities . Pakistani govt has failed to take any concrete action against these elements. i mean lala masjid is a classic case. Plus salma tasser murder case aka mumtaz qadri is another classic example
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
These Kaoboys of India’s RAW agency have been busy!
When Indira Gandhi took over as Prime Minister of India in the late 60s, among her basic priorities was to undo the division of India that created a new State – Pakistan, which was highly irritating the Indian leaders since its birth.
In that particular era, all of India’s intelligence related matters, both internal and external, were managed by only one intelligence agency of the country and that was the Intelligence Bureau (IB).
The Daily Mail’s research indicates that when Mrs. Gandhi assumed the charge of the Prime Minister’s Office (PMO) at New Delhi, she ordered the IB to prepare comprehensive plans to destabilize Pakistan and to transform it into a failed State and to negate the 2-Nation Theory which was the foundation of the creation of Pakistan.
The Daily Mail’s research indicates that in 1968, the then head of IB’s External Division Wing and the founder of Directorate General of Security, commonly known as DG(S) in India, was Rameshwar Nath Kao, a confidante of Indira Gandhi and her late father, as he was cleared of falling to any honey trap because of being Gay, who presented a very comprehensive plan to fulfill Indira Gandhi’s wishes regarding Pakistan.
This 240-page plan, which is still known as The “ Kao Plan “ in India’s clandestine community, had three different operations to destabilize Pakistan.
The Kao Plan, which is described as a three-pronged strategy by the Indian officials, had three different operations to eliminate Pakistan. The first, known as Kao’s Bangla Plan(KBP) was chalked out tostart an insurgency movement in East Pakistan and transform the Eastern part of Pakistan into a new State. The 2nd plan, known as Kao’s Balochistan Plan (KBP-II) was architected to create a similar scenario in Pakistan’s Balochistan province, while the 3rd one was related to organizing a separation movement in the then North Western Frontier Province(NWFP) and now Khyber Pakhtun Khowah to establish an independent State there and this one is known as the Kao’s Pakhtoonistan Plan (KPP).
Indira Gandhi, the research indicates, went through Rameshwar Nath Kao’s plans comprehensively. She held a detailed meeting with Kao and discussed his plans in great detail. After the meeting, Prime Minister Indira Gandhi reached to the conclusion that Kao plans were quite comprehensive and had all the potential of earning far reaching results. However, she was concerned with the limited capabilities of the country’s top intelligence agency (the Intelligence Bureau). After detailed deliberations with Kao and her other close associates, Mrs. Gandhi felt that the IB was not at all capable of executing the Kao plans. According to some Indian media persons, who were close to the developments at the PMO in late 60s, Indira Gandhi finally decided that since IB did not posses enough capabilities to run the foreign missions and the related the Kao plans, there was an urgent need for India to have a separate, more powerful and more resourceful intelligence Agency to execute extremely high profile projects like the Kao Plans. According to these journalists, Indira Gandhi while contemplating formation a brand new intelligence mechanism for execution of Kao plans regarding Pakistan, was also eyeing situation viz a viz China.
The Daily Mail’s investigations indicate that after all the discussions and deliberations, it was decided to start a new Intelligence agency but to keep its profile as a research body and not as spy agency for the outside world. This agency was given the title of Research and Analysis Wing, commonly know as RAW. RAW was finally formed on 21 st September, 1968 under the Cabinet Division and Mr. Rameshwar Nath Kao was declared as its first Chief. Even though the Prime minister approved all three of the Kao plans regarding Pakistan, she directed Kao to go step by step instead of executing all at once as it would add more creditability to the operations. She also advised him to start with East Pakistan plan (KBP) first and to execute the remaining ones in the light of the outcome of the first plan.
The research reveals that soon after the formation of RAW, Rameshwar Nath Kao’s first priority was to gather a team of top professionals at the higher level of the agency. For this purpose, he brought in many ‘like-minded officers from the Intelligence Bureau and from the Indian Police Service (IPS) cadre. According to certain media reports, the top wing of RAW in it its early days was comprising of all the well trusted guys of Koa, as majority of them were known gay individuals and were commonly called the Kaoboys of RAW, not only within the agency but also in the media across India and amongst those officials who were not inducted in RAW by Kao, despite being highly capable. Such officials were the main sources of such leaks to the media and also to the young RAW officers.
These Kaoboys were initially given the task of enhancing the capabilities of the agency to the maximum for running the covert operations while a special wing was formed to launch the KBP in East Pakistan. The details of Kao’s Bengla Plan would be discussed at another stage though; the research reveals that RAW launched the Bengla plan soon after its inception. It is worth mentioning here that soon after the inception of RAW, Kao also formed a high profile Monitoring Division, comprising of the retired and serving officers from the Indian army’s corps of Signals.
The basic features of Kao plan were to launch a Psychological Warfare operations in East Pakistan; to communicate with East Pakistani politicians, mainly those belonging to Awami League; to induct many East Pakistani civil servants working in East and West Pakistan and also in Pakistani embassies across the world; to launch extensive media campaign against Pakistan army’s actions in East Pakistan and to project a highly exaggerated picture of plight of the people of East Pakistan in the world media and to organize moots and conferences across the world to highlight the sham miseries of the people of East Pakistan; to establish a sense of deprivation amongst the general public in East Pakistan; to create a feeling of hatred between the people of East Pakistan and West Pakistan through social circles etc. …
…
According to some senior International journalists as well as certain security experts and former intelligence official, RAW and specially its Kaoboys were never actually waiting for a formal nod from PMO and they in fact had already started working on Kao Balochistan Plan (KBP-II). RAW had already started contacting Baloch leaders through social activities in foreign countries and a PSYWAR was launched amongst the Baluch people with a crystal clear reference to what happened in East Pakistan and how India helped East Pakistanis to have a separate and independent country. In the meantime RAW also sought agency-to-agency help from its counterpars in former Soviet Union and KGB replied in a positive manner to help RAW implement its Kao plan for Balochistan.
Soon after entering into the Balochistan game, Kao and his team realized that the things in Balochistan were not as easy as those in East Pakistan. They discovered that they did not
have the advantage of having a road link in Balochistan as they had in East Pakistan and secondly the disadvantage was that Pakistani army had total control of Balochistan and a
very strong road link to any part of Balochistan, something that it lacked in case of East Pakistan. The only encouraging point for RAW while starting the Balochistan game was that here they did not have to launch and fund the movement at the grassroots level like in case of the East Pakistan.
In fact in Balochistan, they just needed to lure a handful of Baloch tribal leaders, specially young ones who were very much attracted towards fun life of West, and rest was to be done by these tribal leaders. After making this assessment, RAW decided to go-ahead with the KPB-II. However it got a shock from KGB when KGB expressed its inability to provide any strategic or tactical help for Balochistan plan due to KGB’s lack of resources to carry out any deep sea covert operation in the hot waters of Indian Ocean and the Arabian sea however it promised every help and support for the cause in any other shape, at a later stage. Some experts say that KGB’s abrupt nod for joining RAW in Balochistan game could also be seen in the backdrop of cold war era rivalry between CIA and KGB as KGB was constantly looking to hit CIA hard anywhere in the world at first available opportunity during that era and since KGB knew that CIA would feel deeply hurt by its joint operation with RAW in Balochistan and so it offered all its help and support, even without approval from the higher level of the Soviet government.
The irony of this situation is that today CIA itself is fully embedded with RAW in the Balochistan game.
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I think he was in a very wrong profession. He should have been a CNN reporter.He seems to have shared sensitive information with the entire world like he would discuss things with his closest family in his drawing room.
on the other hand, General Musharraf admitted that when he was in power, Pakistan sought to undermine the government of former Afghan president Hamid Karzai and for that Pakistani spies in the Inter-Services Intelligence directorate (ISI) cultivated the Taliban after 2001 because Karzai’s government was dominated by non-Pashtuns, the country’s largest ethnic group, and officials who were thought to favour India....
now why would you say such things to the international press...it will hurt us. can you imagine a usa or indian general saying these things in an interview to guardian...
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I dont know the nature of support India could give to Baloch nationalists or anyone else… but they do have the capacity for involvement.
Afghans generally hate Pakistan. Sad fact. Making India’s job of subterfuge far easier then Pakistan’s. India certainly has long standing relations with former “Northern Alliance” members, as it an open secret that India supported them during their conflict with the Taliban in the 90’s.
Pashtuns as well, view Pakistan with suspicion now for obvious reasons.
The other group of people that India is supposedly assisting, Baloch dissidents, also hate Pakistan and have no qualms about dealing with India in order to further their cause and undermine Pakistan. What the nature of that support is, I dont know, but to rule it out is premature.
Lastly, it just makes sense (not that im wholly convinced its the truth) for India to be involved in some way in such activities. Destabilizing Pakistan, without making it collapse completely, diverts the attention of Pakistanis from Kashmir, and any other place they may be involved.
So while im not convinced of indian involvement, I dont think it can be ruled out. I think its a bit naive of you to assume India has no part in what goes on in Pakistan. Really, you should demand RAW be disbanded if indeed it is sitting around twiddling thumbs while Pakistan’s ISI is running circles around you.
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I agree with most of that, pal. If India could, it would - except that even today, it is way easier for an Indian spy to work undetected in Punjab or Sindh or Karachi when compared to working in Balochistan or with the taliban or the truly unsaveable sectarian killer organizations. But these are the things India gets blamed for when the root cause is obvious to anyone who wishes to see it. India can't even get the Jiye Sindh movement to take off despite a shared border, easy boat crossings, widespread discontentment, etc what can it do in Balochistan?
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I think its quite naive of you to remain ‘uncertain’ that India has a major part in what goes on in Pakistan.
You draw your conclusions based on ONE spy that was caught and media reported. Seriously? Do you really believe indian sponsored media will report about every single indian spy caught (or hidden)?
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
Im sure a very well informed, clever and careful virtual spy… err… person like you does know that Karachi and Gawader (Balouchistan) have shores on the same sea (Map for clueless Pakistanis: https://hinduterrorisminpakistan.files.wordpress.com/2009/11/pakistan-map4.jpg ) and usually people travel to Baloushistan via Karachi while most Pakistanis dont even know that india is controlling Balouchistan affairs through Karachi.
Furthermore, plenty of printed hate material spread by india among the locals of Balouchistan over the years which gave birth to the indian sponsored separatist movements in Balouchistan. All that was done using Karachi as the medium (major indian control there in Sindh) and offcourse the shared sea with Gawader (Balcoushistan).
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
some funny stuff there, you are a real comedienne. so easy to fool these dumb balochis, eh?
Why didnt India just target karachi via karachi, and Sindh via well.. Sindh, and Punjab via Punjab. So much simpler. Or wait, is it because Punjabis are so hard to fool?
Re: Indian hand behind terrorism in Balochistan and FATA?
I think its a quite naive of you to remain 'uncertain' that India has a major part in what goes on in Pakistan.
You draw your conclusions based on ONE spy that was caught and media reported. Seriously? Do you really believe indian sponsored media will report about every single indian spy caught (or hidden)?
Cant definitively believe anything without conclusive evidence. I just wanted to point out that its not unlikely...
some funny stuff there, you are a real comedienne. so easy to fool these dumb balochis, eh?
