Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
^ I am not talking about militancy here. I am talking about blantant disregard for laws of a country. Be it Pakistan. Be it India. Be it USA. This position is consistent. Those who break the law should be punished. The most cost-effective punishment, in my opinion, is to put them back from where they came from. But government should not assume a duty to provide them free food and residence for the rest of their lives.
US is one of the few countries in the world which provides automatic citizenship to any child who is born on US soil. India doesn't have it (to the best of my knowledge). Nor does Pakistan or UK or many other countries I know. So just because an illegal alien gave birth to a child in India does not give the child or the illegal alien parent any additional rights. So thats a non-argument.
^ I am not talking about militancy here. I am talking about blantant disregard for laws of a country. Be it Pakistan. Be it India. Be it USA. This position is consistent. Those who break the law should be punished.
And what disregard of law you are talking about here? And in regards to you not talking of miltancy, this is what these poor people are blamed of.
Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
In case you completely missed it, I am talking about immigration laws. You can't just walk into a country by jumping the fence, and claim that since you are already here so you have all the rights of a citizen too.
In case you completely missed it, I am talking about immigration laws. You can't just walk into a country by jumping the fence, and claim that since you are already here so you have all the rights of a citizen too.
Ok , so you cannot have rights of a citizen but can you have basic human rights, and we are talking about prisons without trials here.
Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
Again, since seems like you missed it as well, so let me say again that in my personal opinion such prisons are a bad idea. These illegal aliens should be sent back where they came from. More appropriate, naturally cheaper and much more humane.
Again, since seems like you missed it as well, so let me say again that in my personal opinion such prisons are a bad idea. These illegal aliens should be sent back where they came from. More appropriate, naturally cheaper and much more humane.
Again i did not miss anything at all, the problem is that you are equating and generalising an immigration problem in any country in the world to this particular situation, which does not hold the ground in this case. They had a bomb and they started confiscating B'Deshi's that have been living in there for decades and in thousands and that too like animals.
Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
Problem is that if someone has broken a law, then they are deemed to be risky enough to break more laws. Anyone who is in a place illegally should realize that if push comes to shove, with all things being equal, that illegal person will be under more scrutiny and suspicion than those who are there legally. So while it will be silly to deem any illegal immigrant to automatically be a jihadist militant, its a risk they take.
Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
^We are talking about sub-continent here and not some developed country where there might be a proper definition of "legality" or "alien", here people cross borders everyday and daily lives and livelihoods are entangled to each other at extremes. It is a simple blame game, where Indian authorities are becoming a part of basic human rights abuse and are minusculing the situation by threatening and humiliating a whole minority community .
^We are talking about sub-continent here and not some developed country where there might be a proper definition of "legality" or "alien", here people cross borders everyday and daily lives and livelihoods are entangled to each other at extremes. It is a simple blame game, where Indian authorities are becoming a part of basic human rights abuse and are minusculing the situation by threatening and humiliating a whole minority community .
I know we all love to blame India for its human rights abuses, but every country in the world (including Pakistan, India and others) has a right to enforce its border security.
If the situation were reversed and Indians were roaming around in Pakistan illegally, no one on this forum will be condoning that and we'll be all after government of Pakistan to enforce border security. Lets not be intellectually dishonest in our argument here just because of our inherent bias.
I know we all love to blame India for its human rights abuses, but every country in the world (including Pakistan, India and others) has a right to enforce its border security.
If the situation were reversed and Indians were roaming around in Pakistan illegally, no one on this forum will be condoning that and we'll be all after government of Pakistan to enforce border security. Lets not be intellectually dishonest in our argument here just because of our inherent bias.
It is not a question of conflict between Pakistan and India and some "inherent bias". We are talking about poor human lives here, who are treated like worthless beings.
These "poor human lives" made a conscious decision some time ago to break a law. Like all of life's decisions, this one also has some consequences.
Whatever,besides it's never thoroughly a conscious decision anywhere in the world for any migrant worker to move their families. It all depends upon where you get your livelihoods..... And this is not "some consequences" you are talking about ,Indian authorities are putting them in Jails without any trials and for no good reasons. About 70-80% of domestic servants in Karachi in 80's used to be B'Deshi's ....I have heard their sorry stories and their sacrifices to support their families ...Almost all of them were illegal. What gives me or you the right to control their lives?? If you want to stop them coming into Pakistan or India then ask B'Desh to harden their borders or security. If you want to send them back ....then too ,the proper way is to organize some commitee or agency or take help from UNHCR for financial assistance so that they can easily be repatriated with their kins in B'Desh. Putting in prisons or like your suggestion of rounding them up and forcibly herding them back is cruel and doesn't follow the basic human laws.
Re: India suggests 'Guantanamo type camp for illegal Bangladeshis’
Rounding them up and herding them back is probably more humane than anything else you can come up with (short of legalizing them and condoning their unlawful behavior). Its certainly more humane then putting them in jails indefinitely without trial. Some parts of India may be booming, but not every illegal immigrant ends up in Juhu beach in Mumbai. There is abject poverty in many parts of India and as such illegal immigrants further strain the limited resources. Same is true for many parts of Pakistan.
Heck, California is arguably the 5th richest state in the world, but many here are still deeply resentful about the financial impact of illegal immigrants from Mexico.
I do understand from your post that the issue in India may not be a simple money issue, but more about internal security and law-and-order. I do agree that an illegal immigrant is not automatically a terrorist. This is a flawed approach and is ignoring the real problem. At the same time, you can't ignore that these illegal immigrants have put themselves in a gravely difficult position. When times are volatile they will be the first group to come under the microscope.
What gives me or you the right to control their lives?? If you want to stop them coming into Pakistan or India then ask B'Desh to harden their borders or security.
Well, neither of us are controlling their lives or want to. What we are doing is just sharing our opinions. Different as they may be. We don't have a right to control their lives, but if they chose to live in a country, the government of that country has a right to enforce its laws.
And to expect Bangladesh to enforce border security it actually a very funny proposition. If people were sneaking into Bangladesh than it will be a Bangladeshi problem. The recepient of illegal immigrants has to improve its border security, not the other way round. Its not a Bangladeshi problem. Its an Indian problem. The right course of action was for India to have stricter border security to prevent illegals from coming over (just like Pakistan should theoretically have better border security with Afghanistan or US should have bettter border security from Mexico). Now that these guys are already in India, its still an Indian problem and not a B'desh problem. Ofcourse, if India decides to send them back to their motherland, it will become a B'desh problem to repatriate them. They may chose to get help from UN agencies as you suggested.
Well, neither of us are controlling their lives or want to. What we are doing is just sharing our opinions. Different as they may be. We don't have a right to control their lives, but if they chose to live in a country, the government of that country has a right to enforce its laws..
So India in enforcing it's laws in prisoning them without any trials??....
and "me and you" is examplry here.
And to expect Bangladesh to enforce border security it actually a very funny proposition. If people were sneaking into Bangladesh than it will be a Bangladeshi problem. The recepient of illegal immigrants has to improve its border security, not the other way round. Its not a Bangladeshi problem. Its an Indian problem. The right course of action was for India to have stricter border security to prevent illegals from coming over (just like Pakistan should theoretically have better border security with Afghanistan or US should have bettter border security from Mexico). Now that these guys are already in India, its still an Indian problem and not a B'desh problem. Ofcourse, if India decides to send them back to their motherland, it will become a B'desh problem to repatriate them. They may chose to get help from UN agencies as you suggested.
Well , you mentioned US/Mexico ,US has asked Mexico multiple time to tighten it's borders so their shouldn't be much northward movement. Anyways i do not want to continue on comparing apples and oranges here and i don't think it's a funny proposition. Repatriation is the the process of return, and that i said can be assisted with financial support etc , how can BD repatriate it's people that are still in India?Now It becomes the responsibilty of indian govt(who is supposedly a champion of democracy) to act in a reasonable way in this case, as it is mindless to put innocent people in Jails for no good reason and it is against their basic human rights too. I also think that it is not a very sane idea to forcibly round them up and huddled them back. Your way of dealing with human lives might be completely different and vice versa, but everyone is allowed to have their own opinion, and you have already expressed yourself well and i got the idea, so it is sensible not to prolong this discussion any more.