Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
thats what I said Altaf facing cases which were created by his political opponents thats why those cases don't have any credibility..
Everyone knows Altaf and his henchmen were responsible behind MANY murders, including that of Hakim Saeed. The other cases against Haqiqi were from 2002-2008 primarily as revenge, or extortion.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
can you explain me please how May 12 massacre justifies Imran leaning towards mqm(h). i think thats what we are discussing in this thread
He was having discussions with the MQM(H) in order to form a strategy against MQM(Altaf League), nothing wrong with that, its not like hes doing what Altaf usually does, i.e. order his party to gun people down.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
He may be sincere but its another policital mistake by him with regards to his own party's existence in Karachi.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Everyone knows Altaf and his henchmen were responsible behind MANY murders, including that of Hakim Saeed. The other cases against Haqiqi were from 2002-2008 primarily as revenge, or extortion.
there are many cases on afaq hussain and amir khan since the time when they were very important part of mqm. are you really really sure there are no cases against mqm(h0 leadership before 2002. everybody who lives in landhi or areas around it knows what is mqm(h) and there modus ope*****.
imran khan cannot assume the role of a judge and start deciding which cases are true and which are false. this is by itself so un-ethical. especially from a man who talks all the time for the supremacy of the court.
anyway what altaf did or didn't is not the topic of this discussion. topic is that this act of imran khan and whether this is based on principals or political gamemanship.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Why are MQM muttehda) supporters so worried about Imran's principles, are you guys actually thinking of voting for him in the next elections?
There is nothing wrong in uniting with your enemy's enemy in politics. MQM has united with PPP, PML[N], PML[Q], and the military whenever its suited them too.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
its the same attitude like if you are not with me then you are against me. you may not believe it but there are people in pakistan who don't agree with altaf hussain as well as imran khan.
using mqm deeds as an excuse clearly shows that both are same and there is no difference between them.
mqm is well established party so they play with major parties like ppp, ml(n), ml(q) and military (yes they are biggest political party in pakistan) while tehreek-e-insaaf being a fringe party can only hob nob with fringe parties like ji, mqm(h), achakzai (remind me what his party name). but what is the difference.
anyway thanks for making it clear that all the big talk of principals and claim of honesty is just rhetoric.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
munda, we all consider MQM haqparast/altaf to be a terrorist party. Altaf guns down, murders and extorts people, and everyone knows that. Now if Imran (who is his staunch critic) contacts and discusses something with a political party who coincidently Altaf bhai dislikes, that doesnt degrade Imran's position one bit as theres nothing wrong with discussions. Infact, it only adds to his commitment of taking out Altaf Bhai. All the power to him. You will also find that apart from the MQMers complaining, his supporters are still behind him.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Aalsi: The only two-faced people are some members of this forum who on one hand encourage dictatorship and on the other hand talk about fairness and morality. So lets not go there because if you throw a rock in the mud, you'll get dirty as well.
What Imran Khan has done, still does, and will continue to do for the country whether politically or socially is more than anyone in the current times could do. He has single-handedly with the help of the people of Pakistan built two of the most efficient institutions with a lot more in the store to come with time. One of them being a cancer hospital at a time when the country lacked them, let alone free treatment for the poor, and secondly a College for the rural folks, again a step in the right direction because we all can agree pakistani public needs education.
So surely, him mediating between political parties is his personality of a humble citizen before corrupt politics at play here. Bravo to him for all he does despite all the negatives people throw at him. Politically he may not have much of a voice or a base to launch from right now but then again, principled people hardly get an easy ticket, struggle always accompanies them.
Atleast he's not unpatriotic and traitor of the country he represents like some other party leaders who sit outside Pakistan in the luxury of their foreign lands, call shots from there, call the formation of Pakistan a mistake, and then turn around and in the same breath claim to be country-loving Pakistani. Now thaaaaaaaat is two-facedness of the highest degree. :)
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Spock bhai, I don't know what you mean by "we all". If you mean you and the little group of Imran worshippers, I agree with you but if you mean all people of pakistan then sorry you need to prove your credentials for representing them.
So you have every right to agree to what you think is right but please give the same right to other people.
I can't understand this attitude that when somebody criticize imran, his admirers jumps up and say people from other parties or political affiliations have no right to critizcize him but they keep criticizing every other person left and right without changing there political affiliation. Don't you think this is double standard.
If he wants to take altaf hussian, i have no problem with that. i can see that this is becoming personal between him and altaf. lets see how it ends. you and me both are here. but whatever the result my concern is will that brings any improvement or not, in my and my fellow pakistani's life.
i don't want all the power to any individual. you can call me one of those people who hate personality cults. i want all the power to institutions and institutions are created on principals and rules, not on personal whims.
you are right, i can see most of imran's supporters behind him. same way most of ppp supporters supports ppp, although imran called bb queen of corruption. Nawaz sharif supporter supports him all the way although imran once called him king of corruption. even mqm's supporters supporting mqm. all political parties have its supporters and they keep supporting it, nothing wrong in it.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Why are MQM muttehda) supporters so worried about Imran's principles, are you guys actually thinking of voting for him in the next elections?
There is nothing wrong in uniting with your enemy's enemy in politics. MQM has united with PPP, PML[N], PML[Q], and the military whenever its suited them too.
well said
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
Some people really need to put aside their hammer of terming other people as MQM supporter here!
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
^ What else are we supposed to call them, if all their posts on this boards are just rebuttals to accusations about Altaf/MQM being terrorists or Imran Khan bashing?
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
you see that alone betrays your seemingly ingrained need to reduce every discussion to calling people something.
every vote I ever cast in Pakistan has been to PTI, by the way. so not only is your characterization of anyone who criticizes Imran as an MQMer a lame debating tactic, it is also very ironic for me. Normally I let such absurd mischaracterizations lie, which is why I never correct people when they allege stuff about me.
Altaf guns down, murders and extorts people, and everyone knows that. Now if Imran (who is his staunch critic) contacts and discusses something with a political party who coincidently Altaf bhai dislikes, that doesnt degrade Imran's position one bit as theres nothing wrong with discussions.
Afaq's party also guns down, murders, and extorts people, and everyone knows that. It is a splinter of some of the top commanders of MQM, for gods sake.
[quote]
Infact, it only adds to his commitment of taking out Altaf Bhai. All the power to him. You will also find that apart from the MQMers complaining, his supporters are still behind him.
[/quote]
While he was adopting legal approaches, I was behind him. Not when he is going a route that in the best case (i.e. if he is successful in somehow making MQM H a viable force again) will not harm MQM at all, but make life miserable for karachiites in general who get in the crossfire.
In any case there is very little his gambit will achieve besides earning the negative association with MQM(H).
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
you are not a mod here anymore, so you cant issue no warnings if it stings you 
? I really dont believe you when you said every vote you cast is for Imran Khan. Furthermore, I dont recall asking you who you voted for, or implying that you vote for MQM. I was merely replying to mostar’s remark, about the person who is new on the forum and all his posts are either rebuttals to things about MQM or about Imran.
Yeah its only Altafs party that sticks to principals and fair politics Why dont you list down the recent activities of the MQM-H over the last 5 years, atleast nothing comes to my mind. Were they behind the May 12th incident, because it certainly cant be MQM-Altaf, as they are too peaceful for that.
Inshallah, MQM H will become a viable force and counter the MQM in a peaceful way. If you guys are quick to praise MQM-altaf having discussions with musharraf, zardari, nawaz benazir, and are full of praise about it becoming a peaceful allies, but their enemies dare not have discussions with anyone.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
aw, one would think you’d be over the warning or two i gave by now.
i’m sure you dont care whether I did, but to claim Im lying furthers your blinkered worldview where everyone is either an imran groupie or an altaf one.
Here is what I am responding to: *Why are MQM muttehda) supporters so worried about Imran’s principles, are you guys actually thinking of voting for him in the next elections? *
Once again, the false choice between Altaf being god and Imran being a deity.
Their heyday was in the 90s, since then they’ve been on the run. Here you go, a profile on MQM (H): http://www.satp.org/satporgtp/countries/pakistan/terroristoutfits/MQM_H.htm
Just in case you worry that this site is part of the vast MQM conspiracy heres what they say about MQM: Muttahida Quomi Mahaz ,Terrorist Group of Pakistan
Find a single instance where I did anything of the sort.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
what the hell does that mean? what moral grounds do you have for opposing "fascism" when you support others of the same ilk?
btw Fascist has a very specific meaning, and hateful as you may find MQM, it is as meaningful to call them fascist as it is to call me dutch.
If MQM is not fascist then there is no fascist in the world.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
sahab fascist means something quite specific. they may be criminals/thugs/terrorists but to be fascist you usually need to:
a) Believe that individual freedoms are an anathema to social/national interests
b) Believe in nationalized industry (this is an important factor, since fascism originated from the extreme ultra-right)
c) Believe in a heirarchical organization of society and industry
.. in addition to a dictatorial political organization and an emphasis on race/nationality/ethnicity. Whereas the latter two apply to MQM, the former three dont.
It is as meaningless to call MQM fascists as it is to use the term “islamofascism”. Just because you dont like someone doesnt mean you can call them a fascist, it doesnt make sense. In the words of george orwell:
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
haha MQM isnt fascist? SUUURE! 
I specifically asked for haqiqi’s record in the last 5 years, not from 15-20 years ago. Even that is still a dot compared to the dhabba of MQM-Altaf. Back then they were just an off shoot from a renegade fascist party. Lets compare that to MQM-altaf’s record for the last 5 years.
‘I dont support MQM but they aren’t fascists, and Imran Khan has no principles’… pffft.
Its just funny how a 5-10 min meeting b/w him and the MQM-Haqiqi is causing so much khaarish, and based on this, I hope Imran Khan has longer and more meetings with them in future. Btw, is he allowed to goto Karachi now?
Mashallah, long live the unprecedented reconciliation.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
read above. there are conditions for fascism, including nationalized corporations. you're free to call them anything else though, so long as it is accurate.
Re: Imran mediating between Haqiqi factions.
This is what webster shows:
**
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.**
I think you are right, the word fascism should be replaced by MQM, as the above fits perfectly as to how the MQM is governed