How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

And every one is clear

People’s freedom cannot be violated in name of national security: CJ

****Posted: **13:15 PST - Friday, April 11, 2014 | Comment **
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ISLAMABAD: Chief Justice Tassaduq Hussain Jillani said usurping the freedom of people could not be allowed in the war against terrorism on the pretext of national security and preservation of democracy. Addressing a full court reference in honour of Justice Khilji Arif, Chief Justice Jillani said human rights could not be ignored at any …
Imran Khan says martial law will destroy Pakistan

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LAHORE: Pakistan Tehreek-e-Insaf (PTI) Chairman, Imran Khan has said that martial law would be destructive for Pakistan. “Impose martial law if you want destruction in Pakistan,” the cricket star turned politician said, adding that …more…

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Aitzaz vows support to PM against anti-democracy plots

](http://www.samaa.tv/pakistan/11-Apr-2014/aitzaz-vows-support-to-pm-against-anti-democracy-plots)

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif


What makes you say that? Are you saying he said that during Mush times?

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Yes , I could not see that but the speech often posted at internet and shown in media is of Mush era

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Courts gave their verdict

It is very sad that Baluchs are thinking like this , They might be right because our our establishment is considering it a matter of their dignity that a killer , traitor ,their ex-chief is being tried in court .

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نہیں لگتا کہ پرویز مشرف کو ان کے کئے کی سزا ملے گی، اختر مینگل
www.express.pk

بلوچستان کے مسئلے پر بااختیار لوگوں سے مذاکرات ہو سکتے ہیں لیکن ایلچیوں سے نہیں، سربراہ بلوچستان نیشنل پارٹی](http://www.express.pk/story/245024/)

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Musharraf case se "qanoon" ki bala-dasti saabit nahi howi, balkay qanoon ke khilona honay ka saboot mil gaya. Nawaz Sharif ko Asghar Khan case mai khulee chhoot konsa qanoon hay?

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

^^^ You are right. In Musharraf case, (this illegal) government is making joke of country, constitution, law and justice ... and judges are doing the same.

Actually to upheld constitution, one have to bring in legal government in power, a government that is made up of people who legally contested election (fulfilling all articles of constitution for contesting election, including article 62 and 63 ... as only these people can contest election) ... and then legal government impartially appoint judges who are on merit, and make sure using judge-accountability team to see that they give their judgments impartially and are not corrupt.

In present situation, it is right of armed forces to kick people out who are occupying their government political posts illegally ... and these people include Prime Minister, Chief Ministers, and most Ministers (as they are not even illegible to contest election). Actually to kick these thugs out of power is duty on armed forces toward Pakistani nation.

It is also duty of armed forces to step in if they see injustice is getting done towards any member of their institution who acted in good faith to get rid of corrupts illegally occupying or ever illegally occupied government. Armed forces should also act if illegal governments try to harm them as institution or any general individually, unjustly and beyond constitution (For instance, Prime Minister or any Minister ... do not have right to sack or make an army chief resign, without going through due procedure ... if they would do it than it would be unjust and beyond constitution).

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

^^^

Sa1eem bhai... don't you even see the amazingly twisted logic in your own posts?

A government full of elected people who fulfill criteria of 62 and 63 is legal government. Today's government is therefore, illegal.

Solution: A government taken by force at gun-point.

And you have the guts to still call the present government 'illegally occupied' as if the pesha-war qatil conquering Pakistan time and again did it legally.

Sad sad sad state of affairs.

Garmi hoti ja rahee hai. Sa1eem bhai, aaj thanda ho jai?

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

If Prime Minister is head of a household, then the army chief is the guard appointed to defend the house. The guard can be hired, fired or replaced at will of the head of household.

If the guard has problems with illegal hiring or firing, he should go to the courts to get justice and not come into the house taking it over at gun point.

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Kakabali bahi aap kuch sonchain, baat samajh aa jayea gee.

First thing you should know is to learn difference between state, government, employees of state and duty of state employees towards state (not government). Governments and state employees are both servants of state (and people). Their duty is to serve the state honestly and in best interest of state (not themselves).

An illegal government is an illegal government, and there should be no two opinions about that. A government that came to power using illegal means is illegal, even if they get elected. It is just like, a medical doctor getting job in hospital as doctor is still not in job if his degree is fake and should be considered as occupying the job illegally.

Armed forces of a country are servants of the state, not servant of government. Armed forces should be always loyal to state and people of state, not government. Their duty is to serve the state, and saveguard the state from all threats and anything illegal … and that anything illegal includes illegal governments.

When armed forces act to save state from illegal or criminal governments, you cannot say that they took the control of government at gun-point, because they only fulfilled their duty towards state and people of state. Actually, to act in circumstances where government is harming state (country or interest of people in country), is duty of army chief.

State functionaries, like police, judiciary, bureaucracy or armed forces, they can only do a thing illegal if they misuse their powers and act to benefit themselves (took bribe, did nepotism, misused power to benefit themselves or someone they know, etc), not if their action is to benefit state or safeguard state from criminals, illegal employees (employees who did not fulfilled the requirement of job), and illegal occupants in governments (something normally do not happen in proper democracy, but in Pakistan it is happening as routine).

Who gave you this ‘BS idea’ that Prime Minister is head of a household and army chief is guard to defend the house?

Prime Minister is just a Servant or temporary employee of ‘State and people of state’ chosen by people of state to look after affairs of state for a limited period of time, usually 5 years (and that also, only if that person qualify for the job … for instance, fulfill all constitutional requirements to apply for job… that is to run in election).

Army Chief on the other hand is permanent employee of state whom state select to do job efficiently, effectively and authoritatively whole their career life. They have much bigger duty ‘towards state and people of state’ to look after the benefit, security, and running of the state than temporary employee (like Prime Minister).

Anyone who thinks that army chief or armed forces are guards of house, they are out of their mind. This is only true in Kingdoms, where King is owner of a country, country is house of King, people are slaves (also called subjects) of King, and state employees are actually personal employees of King with duty to serve King only and obey King's command, as in Kingdoms they are not employee of ‘state and people’ having duty only to state and people.

[Fact is that, it is duty of army chief to act if need be. For instance, chief or armed forces is such a powerful post that even in Kingdoms, where Chief of armed forces is personal servant of King, chief of armed forces act and depose King if he thinks that King is harming the country beyond certain limit].

When a country is not a kingdom, leave army chief, even ordinary policeman can arrest Prime Minister and imprison Prime Minister, if policeman thinks Prime Minister has broken law, doing something illegal, harming state, is threat to state, or got elected using illegal means (was not illegible to contest election, got elected using bribes, cheating, or rigging election).

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Chalo ji Qisa hi khatam , (this illegal) government .
Bari bat hay sir , Aik Qatil , Ghaddar , Zalim dictator ki aisi support
Allah khush rakhay .

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

^^^ I always like to say truth, and would not like to sell myself and my conscious to lowly people who lie, cheat, and are corrupt to core. I know, you support Mr Bhutto who was Treacherous, Liar, Selfish, Self-centered, Ghaddar, Zalim and Qatil ... but I would not support such person ever.

You might consider persons you know are matric fail as medical doctors if they illegally got jobs as medical doctors in hospital using fake degrees or bribe, but I do not. I would always call such people employed in hospital as doctors, as illegally doctors.

Same way, you may consider known liars, cheats and corrupts as parliamentarians just because they bribed their way illegally to fulfil constitutional clause ‘62 and 63’ requirement to contest election when they do not qualify to even contest election, leave becoming parliamentarians and forming government. I would always call such people elected as parliamentarians and forming government in state (Pakistan) as illegal parliamentarians who formed illegal government.

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Kuchh jan bhi letay kabhi
Kirdar aur 62 , 63
What about Altaf and Mush , Do they qualify ?

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Khawaja Asif may lose defence portfolio

He was a makeshift defence minister to shield Nawaz Sharif from appearing before the SC. He has conveyed message of his boss as to who is the boss out there. So it’s fine if he has to go.

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

We have had these discussions several times. Not going to repeat.

If you think the current government is illegal, a martial law would be 100 times illegal.

In principle, I would agree with you. We need authoritarian rule in the country which can try to clean up the filthy mess we have in every institution. The only difference is that you expect Pakistan army to do that. Experience has shown that military has never even attempted that. The only people they have 'punished' is either through fake cases or extra-judicial killings. Both have hurt and divided Pakistan much more than what politicians have done so far. I have no positive expectations from our colonial style military mindset. Sorry.

In addition to that, most of the prominent politicians we have or had even in PPP have been nurtured by the military. If the kids are like that, imagine how filthy the mother would be?

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

To cure democracy is to have more democracy. Simple as that. The founding father of this great nation envisioned a stable and successful democratic state and Pakistanis will achieve that. Democracy is indeed flourishing in Pakistan. In regards to idolising of Army, it was Jinnah who famously called Army the servants and guards of the nation who do not make national policies. So I don't know what basis one expects people of Pakistan to yearn for a military dictator. Thank you very much we are not Egypt!

Thankfully, there is no appetite in Pakistan for a military take over, as 33 years of on/off army rule has clearly proved without any reasonable doubt that Generals with absolute power are just as corrupt, incompetent and opportunistic as politicians. It's height of immaturity and delusion to keep romanticing about a imagery future run by army rule when thirty three years of their past record is absolutely vile. You only wish people wouldn't take any learning lessons from that. Before anyone lets out a loud squeak, yes indeed it was an army general who brought the NRO. So much for army man caring about Pakistan, corruption, loot and plunder.

There will be a day when people of Pakistan will openly question, disclose and condemn the corruption, loot, plunder, nepotism, discrimination within the armed forces.

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Golden words .

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Some 'B' grade politicians are posing themselves as spokesman of army , this is more bad for the dignity of army
Army should ask them to not to do so .
Some of them are 'Sheeda Tully' , Ahmad Raza Qasoori , Altaf and Ch Shujjaat , Now Container wala Kazbi is also ready to try this .

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Mubarik hooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

پاکستانی فوج قومی اثاثہ ہے، خواجہ آصف](http://urdu.dawn.com/news/1004185/khawaja-asif-takes-u-turn-calls-pakistan-army-an-asset)وزیر دفاع نے گزشتہ بیان پر اپنی غلطی تسلیم کرتے ہوئے واضح کیا کہ مضبوط اور قابل احترام فوج قوم کا اثاثہ ہے۔
Khawaja Asif takes U-turn, calls Pakistan Army an assetAnother U-Turn but now from a PML N minister

Phatoo , Tatoos and our intermediate pass intellectuals

Khan phans gia Pakistan .

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

Tau kya aap chahte hein k martial law lagey !!!

Re: How to preserve Dignity - For Raheel Sharif

When our people live somewhere else , They abide rules and law
But when the come back home , they feel free …
Our army was a very loyal army when they were British India army
After 47 , They feel free
فوج کا احترام کرتا ہوں ماضی کی تقریردکھا کر غلط تاثرپیدا کیا جارہا ہے، وزیردفاع](فوج کا احترام کرتا ہوں ماضی کی تقریردکھا کر غلط تاثرپیدا کیا جارہا ہے وزیردفاع - ایکسپریس اردو)