How does one know?

Society Religion & Philosophy
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I know in the practice of Islam, there are hadith and sunnah that are followed very strictly and have been incorporated into the religion. Other hadith are just considered examples for pious Muslims to follow.

How does one distinguish which of the the prophet’s actions are:

  • Not necessary or encouraged, but just an example to follow
  • Not necessary, but encouraged
    *]Necessary and integral part of the way the religion is practiced
    Since all 3 variations exist, who decided what category they fall into? Did Muhammad indicate or did those who followed him decide?
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Re: How does one know?

To this day there's no single set of universally agreed criteria amongst all Muslim scholars on this. Everyone will agree at the minimum that everything the Prophet (pbuh) did is an example muslims should follow; discord amongst scholars continues about which actions are mandatory and which are not.

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Re: How does one know?

When you say the words in bold, are you referring to the organized religion called "Islam", specifically Sunniism? If not, please do not generalize.
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Re: How does one know?

^What is Sunniism?

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Re: How does one know?

other sects in islam have their rituals that are handed down from sources other than the quran as well, so if you replace the word sunnah with rituals, it envelopes all, whether its how one prays, matam, koonday whatever.

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Re: How does one know?


What is a hadtih rejecter? The question is rhetorical dear sister...

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Re: How does one know?


No doubt... but my take is that there are no rituals in the System of islam. I do not see it as a religion.

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Re: How does one know?


Yes, I am referring to the practice of the majority who combine Quran, sunnah and hadith as part of their religion.

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Re: How does one know?

so what is a religion and what is a system, name religions and systems to explain. thank u

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Re: How does one know?

well u are wrong here also, no major sects follow quran only..sunnis follow sunah and hadeeth, shias follow their own books and rituals, so do ismailis, and the assorted sects.

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Re: How does one know?

I just wana see the outcome of this thread ..........

and the argument continues ...

ps. I ll reply when there is a some sort of conclusion between youz lot :)

Pak vs WI - 2nd ODI Monday April 25 2011 at Gros Islet, ST LUCIA
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Re: How does one know?


I said "majority", so I do realize that followers of Quran only are a minority.

Yet another thread on whining women
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Re: How does one know?

looooooooooooooooolzzzzzz…ther wont be a conclusion…:rotfl:…

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Re: How does one know?

Peace Seminole

There is one such hadith I remember off hand that states Muhammad (SAW) did not do something on one instance that he regularly did, he was asked why, and he replied so it does not become incumbent on the Ummah (or to that effect).

Generally speaking:

Some hadith are clear instructions "Do this" and refer to ayahs of Qur'an which address people in different categories, Ya' ayuhal Muslimoon, Ya' ayuhal insaan and so on.

Some narrations talk about a regular habit of Muhammad (SAW) such that all who observed it i.e. his companions also did that. These are implied necessary actions.

Then we have later on interpretation of companions and their instructions

Then we have interpretation of scholars and a consensus in them becomes elemental in either belief or practice.

There are some differences and those are what cause the various schools of fiqh.

Some hadith are not actually direct from Muhammad (SAW) but are actually quoting a pious companion in how such and such a situation was understood by them.

There are clear guidances in the hadith and clear instructions also. Otherwise if something is not clear we adopt the advice of the Qur'an and seek out the people of knowledge.

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Re: How does one know?

So it's mostly the historical interpretation that determines what is obligatory, outside of the specific "do this" type narrations that someone quoted Muhammad as saying?

I know that Muslims are very proud and confident that the Quran is the unchanged, unchallenged word of God. So how does one reconcile that truthfulness, that is the basis of Islam, with the somewhat watered down decrees of hadith? Why would God have laid down the final, complete law and until this day there is discord amongst scholars about which actions are mandatory?

Another question is if Muhammad was just a man like the rest of us, made mistakes and committed sins, how could everything he ever said or did be considered the perfect example to follow. If everything God said to him is in the Quran, how did Muhammad know everything he did (that wasn't in the Quran) was THE way to do it according to God?

I ask these questions, not out of disrespect, but because I really cannot grasp the concept as hard I as I try or as much as I read. I have re-read the Quran recently, and I honestly don't understand this interpretation.

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Re: How does one know?

Peace Seminole

Muhammad (SAW) according to our beliefs was sinless, innocent, but was in a position where mistakes had been made now here is the wisdom in such things.

1) By making mistakes Muhammad (SAW) sought forgiveness, that showed us how to seek for forgiveness, if we did not have that example how can it be perfect?

2) By making mistakes Muhammd (SAW) was humble and knew that all Power belongs to Allah (SWT), now if Muhammad (SAW) was faultless then that Attribute would conflict with the Unique qualities of God, thus it would undermine the message of Tawhid.

Also we have been told within hadith who the best people were and who had the best understandings. That led to the development of classification of hadith and tafsir of Qur'an and hadith.

Coming back to the perfect example ... Logically a perfect example for mankind is something that is practical for mankind not idealistic for mankind. Mankind is itself full of faults, so how can someone be a perfect example for a faulty people if that someone is himself a different class of being? He will need to be part of us to be an example for us.

;) Choose A Profession 4 Above Person ;)
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Re: How does one know?

A religion, such as Islam usually encompasses a particular belief geared to a higher force, with sociological and theological elements implemented for pleasing the higher being by showing aligience to it through rites and traditions which may or may not evolve, and in the long run tend to stagnate by creating a division of society into various classes: Elite, Clergy and Masses.

The system of islam is geared towards socialism with a specific methodology general enough to be adapted to all times... the belief in a higher, intangeable and hyper-transcendant being is an integral part of the governance, but there are no rites other than forming a moral society with emphasis on eradication of social divisions (racisim, religious division etc), spreading a specific message to neighbouring communities/species as being the best example, eradication of poverty, and following this general methodology (doing good and encouraging endurance) for all times for continuous growth and improvement to a state where we (humans) as a race are evolved enough to meet our Maker.

Aaj Kiss Baat Par Gussa Aaya ??????
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Re: How does one know?

first prove that Quran , sunnah and hadith do not have same source so not a part of religion

in many places in quran , it is ordered to muslim , follow Muhammad
if you donot act on sunnah /hadees ie you don't like to follow Muhammad that it means you are denying Quran and not following quran

all the scholars of islam have told that who ever say , that i follow quran but not sunnah or hadees is the biggest liar

there can be difference on authenticity of any hadees but it doesn't mean that reject every hadees and sunnah

;) Choose A Profession 4 Above Person ;)
;) Choose A Profession 4 Above Person ;)
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Re: How does one know?


Thank you for the reply.

While "Muhammad was not perfect" does make sense in that he was a* practical* example for mankind, it doesn't make sense if people are to follow everything he did (or reported that he did since hadith are far from being 100% accurate) as the perfect example. Muslims believe the Quran to be perfect, so there are no gray areas. But if you combine that with following the imperfect example of what an imperfect man did, you are no longer following a perfect religion. Particluarly when the Quran's recitation, recording and promise was perfect and hadith was not.

My thought has always been, and why of all the major religions I find Jesus' teachings in the Bible to be my best example to follow as he represented the perfect man. Not that any of us will ever get there, but it is something to strive for. I just can't believe that God's last message to mankind is going to include war, slavery and discrimination built into it (as examples.) Surely God's plan is for us to evolve more than that. I'd like to think it possible. I don't see God laying down the final message when we were soooo far from it in the time and context in which it was revealed.

I don't think it will have a geographical and cultural bias and I don't think it will require scholars to figure it out for us. I don't think it will require us to be so concerned with the history of one group of people from one point in history. I'm not sure if the final message has been delivered, but if it has I don't think any organized religion has interpreted correctly as of yet.

I digress, I apologize, since my question here was how and who determined the parts of Muhammad's life that became an integral, necessary part of the religion. For instance - the 5/prayers a day outlined in Islamic doctrine when the Quran only mentions 3. That is an example of how I see sunnah subjugating the Quran.

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Re: How does one know?


This is not the first time this issue has been raised... it is an old-timer, and it has an answer other than traditional hadith and sunnah. More than 1/3 of the Quran deals with telling the prophet to say something or do or not do something... if anything, that is the example to follow.

Bhai hazraat