…Barelvis and Deobandis in simple terms to an outsider with some understanding of Islam?
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
Barelvis: influenced a lot by Sufism and Shiaism - visit graves of saints to ask for their help and guidance
Deobandis: influenced a lot by Wahabism:approach Allah directly and abhor visiting the graves.
They both follow fiqh of Imam Abu Hanifah - May Allah have mercy on him and reward him.
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
Barelviis: belong to the school Abu Hanifa, place greater emphasis on Prophet Muhammed’s (PBUH) teachings, his companions and enlightened Muslim scholars. Major difference emanates from allegorical interpertation of Quranic verses compared to literal understanding by other school of thoughts. Roots of Barelvi are usually found in urban areas whereas that of deobandi (wahabi) are rooted in tribal customs and interpertations. Classified as tradionalist by many authors. Barelvi school of thought is heavily influenced by Sufi school of thought which has its roots in Al Basri, in the sixth and seventh century.
Deobandi: This school of thought follows Abu Hanifa and some are ardent followers of Imam Hambal. Generally termed as fundamentalists by modern day authors, this sect places emphasis on literal translations of the Quran as defined by tribal Arab traditions. Considered to be an offshoot of the Kharaji’s which emerged in the time of fourth Caliph, they owe their theoretical understandings on the works of Ibn Taymmimia and Ibn Wahab. Salafi, Wahabi, Deobandi are all nearly the same with slight variation but have one thing in common and that is their hatred of Barelvi or Sufi form of Islamic teachings.
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^ FArtguru —Deobandis do not oppose sufiism–they oppose shirk ..they impurities that are present in brelvi sufism–
Deobandis are not an offshot of kharajis—they are strict opposer of kharajis—they are just a strict inerpretation os islam and have their chain of hadeeth and fiqah back to imam abu hanifa…and sufi chain upto HAdrat ali 
please do your research before posting–
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
Bihari, first of all shirk you talk about shows your indoctrinated based information. Subject of this thread is to show the difference between Barelvi & Deobandi school of thoughts. I can also quote examples which clealry demonstrates the shirk of deobandi’s and wahabi’s but that that is not what is required here.
Secondly, do you even know the meaning of shirk? Before making such accusations for any sect requires complete understanding of their faith, Iam afraid your clear prejuidice shows your ignorance of barelvi teachings.
“Deobandis are not an offshot of kharajis—they are strict opposer of kharajis—they are just a strict inerpretation os islam” - Thats exactly what the kharajis said when they declared all other muslims (Hazrat Ali and others) as Mushriqeen.
Whenever you want to discuss the shirk of wahabi’s and deobandi’s open a separate thread…and do your homework next time before posting:)
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Thanks guys..I heard there was a theological dispute over the essence of the Holy Quran as well? any ideas about that?
Also could someone explain in strict definitions who are kharijis..and do they exist now?
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
When the Ummayads demanded justice for Hazrat usman’s death, then emerged a split within the new Muslim community i.e., between the Ummayads and the Hashemits (Hazrat Ali’s clan). Since the Ummayads thought Hazrat Ali was unable to dispense justice, there was a war which was eventually ended by a truce. When Hazrat Ali entered into a truce with Ameer Mahwiya, there was a segment of his supporters who opposed any kind of truce and used Quranic literature to support their thesis to continue war. When Hazrat Ali refused to comply, this group rebelled and declared all other muslims to be heretics cause they compromised on Quranic text. In tradition of the Arab tribes of that time, this group was separated from rest of the Muslim community or ostracized in today’s language or Kharij. Even though this group had declared all other muslims to be heretics, Hazrat Ali at no time or other muslim scholars have never declared them to be heretics or mushriq, but simply Khwareej or Kharaji’s.
Ibn Azraq or the Azraqite was one of the tribes which professed to be the true muslims and all other’s to be mushriqeen, thus they had lost all rights and privelages as muslims (according to Azraqite). History books have varied opinions about this group, but generally they were considered to be dictated by tribal customs and lived a strict penal code of life. According to Azraqite, any muslim who does not comply with their view can be killed, his family slaughtered or taken as slaves. They were known to carry out raids against other muslim communities and had gained a nefarious reputation of being extremely rigid and brutal.
Azraqite’s were defeated in battle around 695 AD. Since then this sect has dispersed into the deserts and mostly found refuge in Nejd area. Due to persecution by their enemies, this group adapted its ways and is considered to be the root cause of today’s extreme version of Islam as projected by some very well knownn entities.
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^ Very interesting guru..thanks for the explanation..
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Yes and they also dispersed to Deoband…what kind of hoky poky conspiracy stuff is this…I am surprised you did not make the Huns, Barbarians, Mongols, Assassins (wait those would be your real heroes) and other deviant savages, the founders of the Deobandi school of thought…Good cut and paste and flawed hypothesis job though…
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
A very flawed and ill-researched article.
Please read the following hadith from Sahih Muslim and read the lines highlighted for you.
Zaid b. Wahb Jahani reported and he was among the squadron which wall under the command of Ali (Allah be pleased with him) and which set out (to curb the activities) of the Khwarij. 'Ali (Allah be pleased with him) said: 0 people, I heard the Messeinger of Allah (may peace be upon him) say: There would arise from my Ummah a people who would recite the Qur’an, and your recital would seem insignificant as compared with their recital, your prayer as compared with their prayer, arid your fast,as compared with their fast.
They would recite the Qur’an thinking that it sup- ports them, whereas it is an evidence against them. Their prayer does not get beyond their collar bone; they would swerve through Islam just as the arrow passes through the prey. If the squadron which is to encounter them were to know (what great boon) has been assured to them by their Apostle (may peace be upon him) they would completely rely upon this deed (alone and cease to do other good deeds), and their (that of the Khwarij) distinctive mark is that there would be (among them) a person whose wrist would be without the arm, and the end of his wrist would be fleshy like the nipple of the breast on which there would be white hair.
You would be marching towards Muawiya and the people of Syria and you would leave them behind among your children and your property (to do harm). By Allah, I believe that these are the people (against whom you have been commanded to fight and get reward) for they have shed forbidden blood, and raided the animals of the people. So go forth in the name of Allah (to fight against them). Salama b. Kuhail mentioned that Zaid b. Wahb made me alight at every stage, till we crossed a bridge.
'Abdullah b. Wahb al-Rasibi was at the head of the Khwarij when we encountered them. He ('Abdullah) said to his army: Throw the spears and draw out your swords from their sheaths, for I fear that they would attack you as they attacked you on the day of Harura. They went back and threw their spears and drew out their swords, and people fought against them with spears and they were killed one after another. Only two persons were killed among the people (among the army led by Hadrat 'Ali) on that day. 'Ali (Allah be pleased with him) said: Find out from among them (the dead bodies of the Khwarij) (the maimed). They searched but did not find him. 'Ali (Allah be pleased with him) then, himself stood up and (walked) till he came to the people who had been killed one after another. He ('Ali) said: Search them to the last, and then ('Ali’s companions) found him (the dead body of the maimed) near the earth.
He (Hadrat 'Ali) then pronounced Allah-O-Akbar (Allah is the Greatest) and then said, Allah told the Truth and His Messenger (may peace be upon him) conveyed it. Then there stood before him 'Abida Salmani who said: Commander of the Believers, by Allah, besides Whom there is no god but He, (tell me) whether you heard this hadith from the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him). He said: Yes, by Allah, besides Whom there is no god but He. He asked him to take an oath thrice and he took the oath. - Saheeh Muslim Book 5, Number 2333:
You can access the above hadith from the following link. Better read the chapter 44 and chapter 45. I have given you the headings of the chapters for your interest.
http://www.muslimaccess.com/sunnah/hadeeth/muslim/005.html
Chapter 44: THE KHWARIJ AND THEIR CHARACTERISTICS
Chapter 45: EXHORTATION TO KILL THE KHWARIJ
In fact Hazrat Ali (ra) did fight them and slaughtered around 4000 of them!
Some more reading for you; to get the facts right. Read the chapter headed The Battle of Nahrawan at the link below:
http://www.witness-pioneer.org/vil/Articles/companion/69_ali_bin_talib.htm
The present day Ibadi sect based in State of Oman are direct descendents of Khwarij but have evolved a lot since their early days.
Barelivis vrs Deobandi Beliefs see the following:
For the Barelvis, (who are mostly from the Pakistan province of Punjab) the holy Prophet is a superhuman figure whose presence is all around us at all times; he is hazir, present; he is not bashar, material or flesh, but nur, light. The Deobandis, who also revere the Prophet, argue he was the insan-i-kamil, the perfect person, but still only a man, a mortal. Barelvis emphasise a love of Muhammad, a semi-divine figure with unique foreknowledge. The Deobandis reject this idea of Muhammad, emphasising Islam as a personal rather than a social religion.
The Barelvis follow many Sufi practices, including use of music (Qawwali) and intercession by their teacher.
A key difference between Barelvi and Deobandi that Barelvi’s believe in intercession between humans and Divine Grace. This consists of the intervention of an ascending, linked and unbroken chain of holy personages, pirs, reaching ultimately to Prophet Mohammad, who intercede on their behalf with Allah. It is a more superstitious - but also a more tolerant - tradition of Indian Islam. Their critics claim that Barelvis are guilty of committing innovation (Bid’at) and therefore, they are deviated from the true path - the path of Sunnah. -
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/intro/islam-barelvi.htm
Re: How do you explain the difference between..
CheGuvera, instead of trying to hide behind your ignorance it would be much much better if you allowed truth to trickle down into your senses. What is quoted is well known histroical fact, well documented and accepted by all schools of thoughts. Now you may disagree with the conclusion but fact remains that the Kharaji’s did exist and have left a extremely negative impact on our history.
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How did you come to the conclusion that I said or implied Hazrat Ali never declared war on Khaaraji’s? Absolutely incorrect assumption. PLease read my piece again, Iam simply stating historical facts which took place at that time. Ofcourse Hazrat Ali declared war on the Kharaji’s it is well known fact, but did he declare them heretics or mushriqeen? That is the question which you have not been able to answer. If you still think Iam wrong, please do let me know I certainly would appreciate your input in this matter.
As for Barelvi’s being predominantly in Punjab, you need to get your geography book out. Barelvi school was established in Barreli, UP India. It still is the predominant school of thought in India, Pakistani Punjab and Sindh. Barelvi influences can also be found in Frontier (declining) and Baluchistan.
Iam in agreement with your explanation and differentitation between the two schools of thoughts. Thanks.
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Barelvi's are pretty dumb and really weird, they so freak me out. I don't belong to any sect but Deobandi's are a bit better.
About 2-3 generations ago most my people were Barelvi's but thanks to the Tableeghi Jamaat (missionary branch of Deobandiyyat) and much to the dismay of Halwa-Khor Barelvi Molvi's they've come a tad bit closer to the striaght way and we no longer have Mullah only langars and send food for the Molvi's whole tribe for like 40 days after somebody dies.
One thing that's still done is hold fairs in the memory of some local saints and fireworks and celebrate on the last day of Baarah-Wafaat (Astaghferullah!).
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deoband is not a sect...it founders like moulana qasim or maulana mehmood hasan or maulana ashraf ali thanvi did not call deoband "Any sect" or blah balh..it was founded to make struggle against britishers...deobandis r known as GOOD PEOPLE bea of their non sectarian atitude...
farguru,barelvis r in majority in india??...HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA...think again...i have been in india twice and been to m any cities but i i did not find any barelvi wht so eva....it was all "true muslims"....
punjab is a place of bidah and where bidah exists,barelvis will be there and barelvis number is decreasing...barelvi number is already very low in balochistan and NWFP...and it is decreasing rapidly...
tabligh jamaat has become the biggest muslim organisation which have the largest following of muslims in the world working in more then 125 countries...
abt deoband being impressed by ibn tamiyya? lol...i wonder wh ur sources of information???......for barelvis ibn tamiyyah is worst then shaitaan and they called as kafir..but deobandis inspite of diff of opinion,considered as great islamic scholar...many times deobandis have been termed as wahabies beac they dont support bidahs on mazaars or new innovations
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abt any1 knows history,then he must remember tht mirza ahmed qadiyani was rasied by britishers to support them and called jahad haram....ahmed raza khan barelvi was the another 1 who was raised by britishers to worked against revolutionary deoband madarasas and he also said tht "jahad should not be done against britishers"...he was fully supported by britishers to divide muslims...and he created new believes which did not exist in 1300 years....huh
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and now barelvis r getting funds from directly from america ;)
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Did it ever occur to you that you might be a muslim today because your ancestors were converted by a particular Sufi tradition? Relax, not all barelvi’s are halwa eating telli tubbies, check out Maulvi Diesel & Co (Deoband) for size and stature. Tableeghi Jamaat has done some terrfic work, but they are not associated with any sect or belief other than the propagation of Islam, so leave them out of it. 
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Seems you have only heard their (Ashraf Thanvi etc) names in your weekly sermons and never got around to read their works. Had you, Iam sure you would have thought differently.
Non-Sectarian attitude, dude what have you been smokin? Just check out the SSP, Jaish ect etc They qualify as non-sectarian for you? Get a reality check…
Well for your trips to India, thats just one opinion…Iam not going to challenge you on your assessment, but looking at the attendance of Mazaars of Aulia’s your assessment seems off by 150million…
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God, dont you guys ever give up churning out all those lies and propaganda? Shame on you, you talk about Islam, yet never bother to check the veracity of your opinions.
Ahmed R Khan Barelvi belonged to a respectable Sufi family and was raised according to the rich heritage of traditional Islam. Maulana Maududi (Wahab) and Maulana Madni (Deoband) were scholars in their own rights, we dont go around spreading lies about them. Even though it is a known fact that both of these gentleman openly sided with Hindu dominated Congress and were critical of Jinnah’s idea of Pakistan to the extent that they even termed it Kafiristan…So who would be considered a hindu agent? Those who supported congress or Muslim League?
And he created beliefs that did not exist 1300 years ago? Here again you show your ignorance and jaundiced knowledge of Islamic history. Hasan Al Basri was the first Sufi scholar in its true spirit, that was the sixth century in Medina. One has to be a moron not to understand the roots of Barelvi school of thought and pass judgement on issue which he/she has no knowledge…
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Look whose talking? Its a known fact that the Jamaat e Islami has been on the US payroll from the fifties when the war against communism was being waged. JI was openly supported by Yahya Khan in 1970 elections and the relationship worked both ways. It was the Ibn Wahab and Saud Ibn Abdul Aziz who conspired and plotted against the Ottomans in collusion with the British. It was Saud Abdul Aziz who was on their pay check. During the so called Afghan Jihad, US and Petro Dollars were freely distributed to the Deoband school’s and the result like you have correctly stated is a steady decline in Barelvi influence in Frontier and Baluchistan.
Today, in Pakistan out of the thousands of Madaaris all over the country 65% are run by Deobandi’s while the remaining 35% is distributed to Barelvi and Shia teachings. And you think that was the ratio before the Afghan war? Go check again, ratio was the opposite. Thanks to Saudi petro dollars and Uncle Sam’s blessing this has changed for the worst. And you say that barelvi’s are getting money from the US? Who created Osam bin Laden? Was it the barelvi’s or Uncle Sam and the House of Wahab? Who did your El Presidento Busho bomb recently? A deobandi/Wahabi country responsible for 9/11 or a moderate muslim state run by secularist government (Iraq)? Is it a coincidence that Uncle Sam has always supported the Wahab school of thought since 1947 when Saud and Roosevelt signed an agreement of mutual understanding and defence.
Your insinuations are classic shallow propaganda with no understanding of the basic principles and rich traditions of Islam.