dude its simple if she had zina.. she should get the punishment for zina but if she is pregnant because someone raped her.. its not her fault .. and killing her in that case is not justified by islam and if someone accuses her for zina just to defend family honor is wrong.. and therefore killing her is not justified in islam.. unless one is a lost soul like you and want to use it as his excuse he is just using islam as an excuse to justify a deed which by no means fits the definition of islam.. how hard it is to get in your lost head buddy… you don’t have an argument man… let me rephrase it for you…By no means you can use the punishment for zina to apply on a girl who got raped or was flirting with someone but didnot have any zina or any sort… this is just insane of you… first of all those kinda practices have been practiced before islam… when there was no presctibed punishment for zina..secondly the same punishment of zina is for man and woman and have nothing to do with honary killing above.. the fact that you are using honary killing which have been carried on b4 islam and use it as an excuse to do any sort of honary killing just shows your ignorance on the subject or your lost effort to mudsling a religon without any proper arguments to back it up.. else you would have guts to justify how a girl getting raped or flirting with a guy fits the definition of zina.. YOU DON’T HAVE A POINT MR… unless you want everyone to play dumb and believe with close eyes whatever dumb things you have to say.
Everytime, he alludes to a rape victim...I am not talking about this case. Most honor killings happened because the girl elopes, or gets pregnant, or is suspicious of have sex raltionships
Go and read by above post Mr… the question is answered already.. unless you want us to believe its not when it is… but I still want to answer the following question…
How does the punishment of zina applies to the punishment of lady who got raped or flirted with someeone.. on what context the same punishment should apply as you are trying to protray…???
Now don’t make more fool out of yourself by saying you didn’t ask a question…
Boy you are one lost soul… how hard is it to comprehend the following worlds…
** she should get the punishment for zina but if she is pregnant because someone raped her.. its not her fault .. and killing her in that case is not justified by islam and if someone accuses her for zina just to defend family honor is wrong.. and therefore killing her is not justified in islam.. unless one is a lost soul like you and want to use it as his excuse he is just using islam as an excuse to justify a deed which by no means fits the definition of islam.. how hard it is to get in your lost head buddy…**
You would have saved us both the trouble had you read it before… than go out there making a fool out of yourself… by asking stuff that has already being answered.
Dude I think one of the brothers above mentioned it .... but I haven't read any ayats of Quran to know it for a fact.. I ain't no scholar buddy... but whatever the punishment of zina is doesn't apply to honary killings its meant for men and women both .. honary killings are practiced in illiterate socieities and are not justified in islam..... tell me aren't they being pracitced in illiterate socieites of india where there are hindu majorities......... your argument don't fit the context of the whole thread.... go and read the first post on it.. and if you could also answer the questions that if you had an answer to it....
How does the punishment of zina applies to the punishment of lady who got raped or flirted with someeone.. on what context the same punishment should apply as you are trying to protray....??????
Dude, what kind of muslim u r? You dont know a simple answer to a simple question !!??
And I am speicifically talking about punishment for zina. Not rape, etc. Most honor killings happen to elope ccouples and ppl suspicious comiitting indifelity. If u have any data to the contrary, i would like to see that
And I’ll answer the same what I said earlier too one of your dumb comments…
Quote:
Originally Posted by lostsoul
Hey, dude from Texas
Maybe u woke up yesterday morning, and read up somewhere that ppl with ur name r called muslims. And all of a sudden u r looking for some guy who can teach u islam. Well, guess what, unluckuy day…I am not available.
Read Quran, and Hadiths…so many resources on net, and even here on GS, these topics have been debated over and over again.
Lol dude you make it sound like the whole foundation of islam is set up the ideology of punishment of Zina… one shouldn’t be a muslims if one don’t know anything about it… its Gunah-e-Kabeera and I should refrain form it… thats enough for me to know… there are other pilllars of islam which I need to know to be a muslims… thinks like kalma, namaaz, roza, hajj… how ignorant you are… I asked you for a reference and you doubting on me being a muslims go and read the shariah what i needs to be a muslims.. before you go on your motto of accusing others…Boy you are one lost soul…
And I would love to see what data you have.. and also if you could point out whats the data of other countries like India…and places where there is less muslim majority…??? and also what to you should be the right punishment of zina… and also the other people who kills women who got raped are caught flirting with others… what religon to they use to justify this illiterate act of theirs???
Also, incase you are lost what the thread was about… go and read the first post to refresh your mind…
LOL A nice way to twist arguments when you have no answers.. I am not comparing either.. all I am trying to see as you might protray such practice comes from islam I wanted to SEE if its also done in other religon AND IF SO ARE THEY INFLUNCED FORM ISLAM TOO… now if you are man enough how about answering the following questions… rather than cooking up dumb excuses since you failed to defend your dumb logic
You said the following earlier
And following is the question I asked And I would love to see what data you have.. and also if you could point out whats the data of other countries like India…and places where there is less muslim majority…??? and also what to you should be the right punishment of zina… and also the other people who kills women who got raped are caught flirting with others… what religon to they use to justify this illiterate act of theirs???
So dude can you back up your data its authenticity where it comes from.. atleat I mean thats where your so called judgement comes from.. BUT IT SEEMS LIKE SOMEONE IS NOT MAN ENOUGH TO PROVIDE REFERENCES TO HIS WORDS AND IS NOW ACTING LIKE A CRY BABY BY COMING UP EXCUSES..OH YOU POOR LOST SOUL..
YOUR ABOVE ARGUMENT SHOWS YOUR IGNORANCE AND LAME EXCUSES WHEN YOU FAIL TO JUSTIFY YOURSELF
P.S. No where did in my earlier post I mentioned hindu and you started accusing me for it.. hmm how defensive… Is that what you are here for… come up with lame accusations and dumb logics and swet on it so much to try to making something outta nothing to create hindu/muslim rifts… hmm the thing of heart finally came on your tounge… hmmm I wonder where does that mentality comes from???
You don't need to swet anymore trying to come up with lame excuses and logics and references to your data (which you haven't been able to provide). Your true face have been unveiled in previous thread.... it explains why you have been playing so ignorant and trying so hard to make a point when you didn't have one to start with...... We have seen your true colors so there is no need to waste both of ours time
Lost soul is saying, if a person can be punished for adultery, then don’t those who practice honor killings do it out of religion as well? The logic here is: “The punishment for adultery is murder, so I am allowed to kill my daughter/sister/wife for having premarital/extramarital sex.”
Texan Dude is saying, one cannot use “Zina” laws and punishment to justify killing/punishing rape victims, acid attacks or women whose reputations are ruined, and whoever does is wrong.
Okay so why are there 60+ replies on this? U guys r saying the same thing over and over..
^ the answer Sara is simple..the two groups in this argument have very different perception on the reason for honour killings..one wants to prove religion and specifically Islam is the core cause of all killings, the other wishes to disprove that..by saying the core issue is one of tribal norms ..even if both agree that honour killings are wrong neither agrees on the cause..
I won't have been emphasizing the same things again and again.. had lost soul won't have kept going in circles asking same questions when he wasn't even able to defend his own words... or answer my questions... he just had a lame argument to begin with.. honary killings had been carried on before islam.. but he wants to pick islam to carry some anti islam motto... eventhough its also exist in non muslim societies and it all boils down to illiteracy...
the intensions in his sake or agument was clear in his last soul where he accused me for some hindu / muslim thing... thing which I didn't mention about to start with.
Any society sets the tone, when it says any person committing adultery should be stoned to death. With different interpretation u can then go ahead and apply the same sentence to rape victims and other unfortuante ppl.
Texan dude sounds like Honor killings only happen to rape victims. This is propaganda and lie. Most killings happened to elope couples and consesual sex partners.
Is honor killing only in Islamic socities? NO. Is honor killings only due to religion? NO. It is a mixture of religion and traditions both.
What about punishment for murtid (one who leaves Islam)?? Is it traditional? Or is it religous? Many ppl have been murdered in Pakistan because they were though to have desecrated Quran or prophets. Why is that?
No dude… thats where you go wrong… buddy… getting raped is not the same as commiting adultery.. and therefore one would have to be either illiterate or be a lost soul like yourself to apply the same punishment… that would be just playing ignorant… buddy… you are abusing religon for teachings it didn’t even have to preach… I mean one has to be real ignorant to fit the punishment of someone comitting adultery to someone getting raped.. buddy here is a hint for you go to www.dictionary.com nad check out the meanings for both.. that might help your lost soul see some light…
Whats next are you gonna say… the killings in india when ppl marry from different casts also come from islam…???
The context you are saying is similar of saying.. if someone hits your car in an accident or by purpose.. you should be fine for getting hit also … eventhough you were a victim not an oppressor… I mean i would have to be real illiterate or lost soul to believe your twisted and lame argument.. And if you don’t think it doesn’t meet the context or same fine or punishment shouldn’t be applies based on your logic of what you said above i would love to hear as to why… it will help us know as to exactly how much of a lost soul you really are… Please don’t ignore this one as you have been ignoring my previous questions.
What religon does your lost soul use to justify these honary killings before islam…
I have asked not once but several times if you give reference to this data you’ve been bragging about for so long… ???
