Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
ewwww @ holding hands.... who does that? I grew up in Pakistan and never ever did that, not did any of my friends.... maybe when I was like 4 or 5 years old .... never after that.
Living in USA, I love the fact that no-one stares at you or grabs you in bazars and I can go grocery shopping all by myself even at 10 in the night.
I went to a desi concert recently (Atif Aslam's) and the men there were giving the stares ..... Pakistan yaad aa gaya.
wow @ balcony part. and a full burqa? are you serious? i took a whole batallion of white people (my husband and his family) to lahore this past january. we had to be alert and careful just in case. but we did go out EVERYWHERE. my neighbour back home ... it's a paki guy with a german wife and 3 mixed kids. they go about everywhere. a lot of their work is based in the inner city, and they go their a lot. the wife goes there alone. the eldest daughter also goes there alone. and they are pretty comfortable about it as they speak of it. so i dont really know how big an issue it is. it just feels to me when you're so far away from the actually fear, it just comes across as way more harsh. i am more scared of all the crap happening down in lahore now than when i was actually living there.
Yep, Unfortunately if i go on the balcony, People tend to come out their houses and just stare, Some even try talking to me. It freaks me out, and really annoys the crap out of me, I cant even sun bathe. My little cousin used to come out with me and if anyone used to come out, He would tell them where to go bless him. The last time i went i took a gazebo so i could atleast sit outside. I know it sounds extreme and im not even kidding, But its all true. The bazaar business i've been to the bazaar with my head covered yet they wanna stare, without make up looking like a tramp. It's not their fault or mine. Its just what they do. But i hate it when people look at me especially stare i tend to tell them where to go but i cant really do that in Pakistan. However here in UK if someone stares at me i can cuss them however much i like without anything happening. However when i went to Lahore i did wear short sleeves short pants, and i only got a few odd stares. Lahore is amazing for white people, I've been to the wagah border and there was alot of different people from all over. So i felt really relaxed in Lahore, I always do.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad 
happy thread
MB 
its not just you, they stare at all women… since you’re not used to it, you just feel odd I guess and they probably stare more since you’re gori chitti 
PC- you sound like a rebel. rebelling against your culture. not something im criticizing you for, i sometimes find myself wanting to kick myself for being born in a culture where women are putin their place, and theres so many damn restrictions for us, as if the world wasnt already a mans world....
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
Compared to my relatives back home, my life here is much better than what I could ever have there.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
Life is tough back home for people who work themselves.... tauba, I used to work there and it was a horrendous experience.... too much politics, too many uncles taarofying you and mentally undressing you, used to get work dumped on me all the time, no appreciation, late hours (since our boss did late sitting, we had to sit there too even if we had no work) and traffic tau buss.... ppl complain about Washington DC's traffic... take them to Shahra-e-Faisal or I.I. Chundrigar road at commute hours, it was a NIGHTMARE..... 10 miles commute would take 1 hour +...... I'm glad I left all that behind, less stress, less noise, no yucky people staring at you and at least I have more freedom and job satisfaction here.
I can think of one thing right off the top of my head: when i got married, my dad asked my opinion on the guy and what i said was the last word. Anyone i know in my family and inlaws in Pak, that is not the case. Girls are not even asked when finalizing the rishta.
crap... this is same in Pakistan in most of the educated lot.. !
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
Let me break some typical stereotypes about life back home for women for a majority of them i.e life of an average middle class woman in Pakistan.
-The majority does not have a lineup of servants, women of the house still cook, clean etc without having the conveniences of appliances like dishwashers, vacum cleaners etc which cut the work in half here. Not to mention the energy crisis which leaves the masses with no electricity for 8-9 hours a day in 100 degress + heat, which makes even the most mundane task like cooking n cleaning, a nightmare to complete.
If your own parents blessings are with you its easy to do your own thing in the west and live independently and work, make your own rules without considereing a million social taboos that plague women there.
Its easier to get away with rejecting cultural norms/family interferences in the west because the social set-up makes it easier to alienate the meddling family and choose your own social circle withour fearing any backlash. to each his own here, no such luxury back there.
-In order to think and fend for herself in pakistan she has to fight the entire system to force her way in. Whatever little progress we see today in terms of women empowerment i.e having a career outside home and having a life of their own outside family, they have really struggled for it and earned it first hand by first fighting battles on the homefront and then out in the male dominated society.
so in order to make ones own life sound so much more fulfilling as compared to the counterparts back home one does not necessarily has to look down on them to toot our own horn. carry on now, please.
well ive only been to pakistan twice in my life, and i do think there are some big differences between the two. but i want to share my story because i really have lived both of the worlds a pakistani girl in the US could have.
i was born and raised in the US, lived in the south my whole life and basically had 2 completely different experiences
up until freshman year of high school, i lived in the town i was born in, Sylva, a small rural town you guys have probably never heard of, with a 0% muslim/pakistani population and the nearest pakistani family, who's kids i occasionally hung out with was like an hour away. all my friends were white, but i didn't go crazy or anything and i listened to my parents for the most part.
then came my present situation
in the middle of my freshman year of high school, we moved to a different part of the state, which was much bigger, had a MUCH bigger population of pakistanis, meaning a full blown community, and was near my brothers college. i started high school at much bigger, way more diverse place not knowing anyone, but eventually i made a group of friends and stopped freaking out over not being back home in Sylva, this happened over the span of about a month and i realized some changes were being made. my parents were MUCH more strict, in sylva, i could do and i did whatever i wanted, with limits of course, my parents knew and talked to all my friends and their parents, even thought they were white, but in my new town, they only associated with the pakistani community, the main group of pakistani girls, about 10 girls were my new "friends", i didn't really talk to my new group of white friends anymore, since i wasn't allowed to hang out with them outside of school, which ruined the whole thing, so i sucked it up and tried my best with the pakistani girls.
3 words
DRAMA
DRAMA
MORE DRAMA
that described the whole 2 years until my present junior year of high school in which i am no longer friends with these individuals due to this whole issue that happened a few months ago involving a guy we all knew, it really takes a bad situation to bring out the true personality of the people you thought you could trust. anyways lets just say im now trying to get my old group of friends back from freshman year, avoiding all desi parties, which i used to attend every weekend, and wondering what went wrong in my 17 years of life. i agree with that post a few before me. desi girls are wayy to "chalaak"
dramatic, you bet. i went from what is shalwar kameez and bariyani? to whos moms uncles brother did what and wore what do that wedding? and back.
yeah.
i am the true definition of an ABCD american born confused desi.
that is all.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
Here's my opinions:
what's your life like?
At times it gets pretty insane. Busy with work, studying, business, life etc etc.
what do you like to do?
Spend time with loved ones-mum, husband, close friends.
what do you do for fun?
Plenty! I love cooking, gardening, shopping, watching movies, decorating, photography...
where do you hang out?
At home, at friends houses, we often go out for food-do restaurants count?
what kind of friends do you have?
Mainly none-Muslim. That's just because the Muslim girls I went school with I didn't 'gel' with. They were into fashion and so on, I was into getting an education.
how do you celebrate eid?
With family, how else would I spend it?
** do you do any volunteering? **
Yup, with the Prince's Trust.
*how would you compare the little details of your life with your counterparts back home? *
I shouldn't compare as I don't know enough however what I do know is I am much more independent than my married Pakistani counterparts. If I want to go shopping, I do, I do not wait for the blessings of men in the household.
or perhaps when you visited pakistan .. what did you find different that you had to do? something that you liked, something that annoyed you?
Nothing is annoyed me as such, I just find it shocking how reliant on men some people are-even for little things like getting the veg to make a handi when clearly they've been to the bizarre and could pick up some fresh veg whilst they were there!!!
How is your family life different?
I spend more time with my husband then I would have in Pakistan, as a lot of lads spend a *lot *of time out and about with friends.
how are your family rules different?
I discuss things with my family rather than have a dictator in the house who is usually male.
how much freedom do you have to do various things? whats your curfew time?
I have no curfew sweedie-I'm married and of an age where I can make my own decisions. Plus, if you have a car it's much safer so you can travel around late without worrying about freaky people on public transport.
whats special about your life that you would like to share with us today?
Mashallah I live in a country where Muslims have rights, we can build Masjids, we can send children to Madrassahs and we have a right to vote. In my humble opinion we are lucky.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
I cannot stand desi girls who talk about what people wore at what event. How can you even remember crap like that?
There are Pakistani girls who do not behave like such losers.
Problem is that we've allowed these brain dead birds to define our culture while we slide into an online existence of a more normalized community of desis. Like who does that anyway???
Too many fobs running the show. Truly. What a turn off.
... But i hate it when people look at me especially stare i tend to tell them where to go but i cant really do that in Pakistan. However here in UK if someone stares at me i can cuss them however much i like without anything happening. ...
it's interesting how i am the opposite of this ... not like ive been in a situation of being stared at like that out of pakistan ... but in any given situation, i am easier with screaming, cussin, and creating a scene in pakistan, than here now. and i hate to feel this absolulte lack of control, or let's say, loss-of-style .. but i guess that has more to do with where you feel comfortable, where you feel at home.
Life is tough back home for people who work themselves.... tauba, I used to work there and it was a horrendous experience.... too much politics, too many uncles taarofying you and mentally undressing you, used to get work dumped on me all the time, no appreciation, late hours (since our boss did late sitting, we had to sit there too even if we had no work) and traffic tau buss.... ppl complain about Washington DC's traffic... take them to Shahra-e-Faisal or I.I. Chundrigar road at commute hours, it was a NIGHTMARE..... 10 miles commute would take 1 hour +...... I'm glad I left all that behind, less stress, less noise, no yucky people staring at you and at least I have more freedom and job satisfaction here.
-The majority does not have a lineup of servants, women of the house still cook, clean etc without having the conveniences of appliances like dishwashers, vacum cleaners etc which cut the work in half here. Not to mention the energy crisis which leaves the masses with no electricity for 8-9 hours a day in 100 degress + heat, which makes even the most mundane task like cooking n cleaning, a nightmare to complete. -In order to think and fend for herself in pakistan she has to fight the entire system to force her way in. Whatever little progress we see today in terms of women empowerment i.e having a career outside home and having a life of their own outside family, they have really struggled for it and earned it first hand by first fighting battles on the homefront and then out in the male dominated society.
These! It's interesting how some are really making it sound like paki girls back home are lazy and good-for-nothing. Yes there are the sort, just like they are anywhere else in the world (yes iv heard complaints of docile abcd/bbcd women who dont do anything) .. and yes i also admit that there may be more of them in number back home. but there are women really trying to break these boundaries. and it's not just a handful, there are more. just going back to the italicized part of PatriotXs post.
when i moved abroad, i thought life was so bloody easy here. i am not part of any desi community, dont really have friends. but in general. cleaning, cooking, going out. the first few days i was here, i remember how i used to all of a sudden panick at night to iron my clothes ... forgetting that there is no loadshedding here. i only started using the dishwasher this year, but wow!!and washing the clothes!! double wow!
my mother still has the old type. the clothes are washed in the machine, but rinsed by hand in tubs, and then spread to be dried. and the stupid massis is another big issue. sometimes they come, sometimes they go away and dont come back for 2 weeks. also that my mom cooks herself , dad doesnt like it if a maid would cook. in my entire family, the women cook themselves.
the maids are mostly for everyday cleaning, dishwashing and laundry. and when they are not there, then everything has to be done yourself. also the fact that there is a lot more mess made in pakistan. its way more dusty. more pots and pans, as more is cooked at one time. my mother makes handi for not just the five family members, but also the 4 maids we had. and the food was enough for eating 2 times, meanin 18 peoples worth. sometimes she had to also cook food enough to send it to my fathers workplace. and that food was not just for dad, but also for the workers.
and other than keeping eye on maids, cooking, and doing things around the house, she also picked us kids up from school. when in college, i started taking the bus. and 2 years later, i had a car. in the third year i started working part-time. so basically i was away from 8 or 9 in the morning till sometimes 10 in the night.
but the point of this thread was not to attack each others lifestyles, but just to see how it is diferent. life isnt easy back home. it can be very frustrating and cage-like, especially for those who want to do something. life in the west is also not so easy, but for other, different reasons.
exactly what i was thinking. how come the normal ones are only online? almost each one of the posts say how they didnt get along with other paki girls 
Yea - MashAllah I think I was very blessed and still am with the sort of the parents I had. They are very kind hearted and accepting people… but are very true to their own religion and culture … the way they live their lives has been a great example for my siblings and I.
I can understand the frustrations u had about spending time with friends Farrah… my cousins in Pakistan have similar complaints and vent to me often about it. My Khala’s family is really conservative and the girls rarely get to go to friends homes… only for special occassions such as birthdays or a shaadi. My mamu’s family are more open minded on this subject so their kids go to their friends house and have them over more frequently. But its still never as frequent as they wish it was and yea - sleepovers are totally out of the question.
Growing up - as long as my parents knew whose house we were going to be at and talked to their parents before hand (just so that they knew it was ok) … they were not a stickler about how late we were out with them on the weekends. Thinking back we didn’t really have a “curfew time”. We would tell our parents we will be back at a certain time and if it got later than that, we would call (or friends parents would call) to let them know we were having such a good time and be a bit late. Never a big deal at all. I think due to this - none of us ever developed this rebellious streak. And it helps that there is nowhere to go in our “pind” … except for friends homes and there is always parental supervision… so nothing to worry about. My parents lucked out.
We were allowed to go to sleep overs… but even better than going to sleep overs was actually HOSTING the sleepovers!!! My parents awesome open door policy extended to this. It would be so much fun… my mom would take us to the video store so we could rent movies, lend us girls her nailpolish collection so that we could paint each others nails, she would supervise our “baking and cooking” experiments. It was truly wonderful. I luved the sleepovers and had them frequently. All of my friends wanted to come over to my house because my mom made it so much fun!
For educational and job opportunities, it is common here. Just for the hell of it??? Not so much. But I have seen parents here be completely ok for a child go away to college because their child mashAllah is gifted and smart and got accepted to some amazing school. America is known for some amazing schools.. so if you get accepted … why waste away that opportunity? There are some schools in my area… but none of them were that stellar. And because I lived in a pind, they were still pretty far away from us that I would have had to live away from home regardless. So this is obviously something my parents were mentally prepared for when they chose to settle in the middle of nowhere. They had and continue to have no problem with me and my siblings moving away from home and living on our own to pursue our education and then later careers. So I guess the age is 18 since that is when you complete HS and go to College. I’m the eldest and the guinea pig.. so my parents still preferred me to go to school that is driving distance away. Which I did. But with time, they have become more lax about it. I pursued my higher education in another state and am now a plane ride away. My younger brother applied to colleges all over america. My younger sister is exploring her educational options in even OTHER COUNTRIES. lol. My parents raised us right… we know our boundaries… our rights from our wrongs. So they have never been afraid of “outsider influence”. Sure they miss me (and soon others) … but realize that for us to get further in life… we can’t be afraid to take risks.
I met my fiance once I moved away from the state I grew up in and moved to a bigger city So got my doctorate degree AND a significant other… parents couldn’t be happier for me!
So here are some more answers for ya:
what’s your life like?
All of my life its been busy busy busy busy … balancing working + school + family + social life! But now a days its more low key since I am unemployed and officially done with my education. I guess you can say that I am enjoying the more simpler things in life … or atleast trying to!!!
what do you like to do?
I luv exploring the city I live in. Its been 4 years since I moved here but its the first time that I really have some time to really get to know my surroundings. So I am truly enjoying that! I luv to read and have been completely engrossed in a couple of amazing blog novels online that a guppan friend recommended to me! Now a days I am experimenting with new recipes as well and am in the midst of creating my own personal “cook book”. lol I also paint. My paintings decorate my apartment and my parents home. I like to make them to give them as gifts as well…
what do you do for fun?
Shopping! Kinda broke now a days due to the unemployment but I still get a lot of enjoyment from window shopping. Watching movies. Going to restaurants. Spending time with the fiance is the best as well. Getting some quality girl time is important as well with my friends.
where do you hang out?
I luv to host little get togethers at my apartment - gives me an opp to clean, decorate, and cook for my luved ones!, I often hang out at my friends apartments as well. Going out and trying new restaurants is something my fiance and I do - once a week we have a proper “date” night where I get dolled up and we try a new restaurant! Restaurants in general are good hang outs with my friends as well. In the evenings, lounges are good too. There are a lot of nice classy places here where one can go for a night out and enjoy the company of good friends, and order appetizers. The music is good .. no one is dancing… people leave you alone at the table you are at. Its really really nice.
what kind of friends do you have?
Most of my friends are not muslim and of all different backgrounds. They all share similar morals and ambitions as me. People are often shocked that I have friends that are hindu, christian, etc but that they dont drink or have boyfriends etc. ! its like omg! But it goes back to my parents thing that you can find good people with good morals in any culture and background and one shouldn’t immediately judge just based on the color of their skin or religion. My closest friends are all girls - a Lebanese Christian, Greek Orthodox, Kashmiri muslim, Gujurati Hindu, Guyanese Hindu, Irish Catholic, Jordanian Christian, and a Russian Jew. lol. I also made some great guy friends along the way during my educational process. They may not be my “best friends” but are really nice guys who I know I can trust and rely on if I need their help or advice. One of them even got me the job I had last year. 
. And the million dollar question: do my parents know about them??? Yes - they have even met most of them. lol.
how do you celebrate eid?
My parents made it a big deal for us when we were kids (and now a days for my youngest brother since he is still only 10). If Eid came during a school day, we always skipped it that day. Even if their was a test or something. My parents always raised this issue and cleared it with principals before any of us started at a new school. Day started with us getting dressed up in new clothes and going to the Masjid for Eid Namaaz (Masjid was over an hour away.. but this never deterred my parents). The masjid itself was on the top floor of a building and the bottom half was a banquet hall. So Everyone bought a dish and after namaaz there was an extremely yummy brunch. Afterwards, we would go and visit family friends who lived in the area. Then my mom would take us to Toys r us - and let us buy ANY toy we wanted. Our limit was like $150 each. OMG it was the best part of eid… we would spend soooooo much time walking through the aisles and trying to decide which toy to get!!! My mom would then take us to a place called DZ … which is similar to Chuckie Cheese (but better.. i’m sad that place closed and my little bro never experienced it).
My family always tries to attend a formal Eid party that is held a hotel in one of the cities we live by (all of them over an hours drive tho). But it extends eid… makes it special and gives all of us another reason to get decked out. lol.
As we got older, we got eidi instead of toys obvi and sometimes we are not able to make it home for eid because our university exam schedules and such wouldn’t let us.
** do you do any volunteering? **
Yup… its all i do now since I can’t find a job 
**how would you compare the little details of your life with your counterparts back home? **
Just a lot more independence in general in every aspect of my life… .without rebelling and still having the blessings and trust of my parents intact.
Also - this could just be my own parents. But they have really been ok with us kids traveling without them. My sister and I have the freedom to go and visit a friend in another state. We can travel to pakistan by ourselves… travel to England by ourselves. My parents even let my sister go to China because she was chosen to be part of this American medical research group due to her high grades. A girl traveling alone… is a big deal in Pakistan… even if she is traveling overseas.
or perhaps when you visited pakistan .. what did you find different that you had to do? something that you liked, something that annoyed you?
I truly enjoy visiting Pakistan and keeping a link with it. If I didn’t - I wouldn’t go back every two years (always on my own). Its a different way of life and its a different country … so just like how we should respect that when we go on “vacations” in other countries… we should do the same with our own. The only thing I really can’t stand is the staring problem that men have over there. It seriously creeps me out and I am not a fan. Like I just dont understand what issues those idiots have. I mean i’m sure all of them have mothers and sisters and some even have WIVES (i doubt every single fool giving me the eyeball is single) … and they would flip if someone did that to the females in their lives… so why do they do it themselves to others??? Its so freaking frustrating. It’s completely different over there how one can’t really go shopping by themselves as opposed to here. But I understand why its done over there - safety reasons.
How is your family life different?
Loads of time with friends out and about …and grew up in a mixed gender household and environment. I spend lots of quality (read: informal) time with my fiance and his family as well already… which is quite strange by Pakistani standards. Respect for elders is emphasized in our house… but so is respect for youngers.
how are your family rules different?
Everything is discussed and reasoned out…opinions are given and reasonably considered before rules and decisions are made.
how much freedom do you have to do various things? whats your curfew time? All the freedom in the world because I know my own boundaries and know the limits of what I can and can’t do. My parents completely trust me.
whats special about your life that you would like to share with us today?
I guess nothing too special about my life Just happy to be living where I am, having the life that i have, and having the friends and family and worlds best fiance to share all of this with
awww 
i think what’s special about my life right this momemt is how i dont completely fall in the general stereotype of paki girls being the eldest, i’ve struggled a lot and rebelled a lot against my parents to be where and who i am today. but it’s all worthwhile, because it’s easier for my siblings now
sorry mama to be such a trouble
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad happy thread
^ Us eldest children often have to be the guinea pigs for our parents… the trials and experiences of it all makes life easier for younger siblings. They should be appreciating our efforts!!!
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad happy thread
^ very true … we should have a day when our siblings should spend their entire time praising us :pcg:
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
There are definitely enterprising women in Pakistan. But the vast majority don't even have the opportunities. Not that they wouldn't do more if they had them.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
most of the time, women that are hired in companies, are to break the mens boredom. this one girl that i know .. the place that she got hired at, i knew a person from that office. he said, this girl can do nothing, but we've only hired her because she easily goes around sitting in everybody's laps.
so .. women also need to adopt a more professional act. and those women who do have that, they need to be given more respect.
the office that i used to work at ... i dont really have issues working amongst men, and there was no other girl besides me. and the men used to crack jokes amongst themselves, and also sometimes have a few jokes together with me .. i never really mind that ... ofcourse they were in limits of what jokes they can make in front of me, and i had set that boundary w/o words. it was a nice environment overall to work in. just before i left my job, 2 more girls were hired for accounts or something ... and later whenever i went there (to get some documents, or just to get my friend from there to have lunch or whatever) ... the boss was always complaining how annoying these new girls are. they make a drama out of everything. and are always whining.
i had good contacts with my boss. and this one time i was there to get my friend for having lunch, the boss said let's all go out for lunch, it's on him. and the girl very mischievously said ... no one ever asked me to go have lunch.
so yea .. it's also a problem of not being groomed with the etiquettes of being in a work environment. girls lack that seriously at times. and of course men take advantage of that.
Re: Hello Girls-Born-Abroad :D happy thread
Life's tough for Pakistani women thats most probably why they become manipulative and 'chaalak' as some people call them, cuz wahaan sedhay tareeqay sai koi kaam nahin hotaa.
In order to work pehlay husband ki minnatein karo, phir in-laws ki khidmatein karo. you have to take the whole khaandaan's permission..... they're not even allowed to do volunteer activities or go out of the home all by themselves (unless they're 50 yrs. old) so what do you expect them to do except cooking, scolding the maasis and watching soaps.... I don't blame them, they need a source of entertainment too.... they have to fight for every right they get every minute of their lives and its not easy and pretty frustrating.
Life for a woman here in USA is much much easier IMHO and I'm glad I got a husband who likes me working. Abhi since I'm expecting a second child, my MIL has already had "the talk" with me about quitting my job and having more kids lol, I do agree with her and I'm probably going to do that since it was my decision in the first place to quit after having a second child, but see how us Pakistani women are TOLD to do things..... aren't we old enough to be responsible enough to think about these things and they could at least ask so, what are your plans.... before giving a lecture that was not needed in the first place (I didn't really mind since I have a great relationship with her but its a good example to quote). Anyways, enough rambling..... I just wanted to make a point that I hope has been noted :)
I hope I didn't make the thread unhappy :)