Hazrat Isa A.S.

[psyah]

Re: Hazrat Isa A.S.

@brahmachari99

Psyah,
I did read your earlier response. The point of contention wasn’t weather Friday meant this Friday, the next Friday, or Friday ten years from now. The difference in opinion simply was whether “Jummah” translates to “Friday” or to “Tuesday”.

The comparison in my opinion is appropriate, because according to you the word “tawaffa” attains special meaning only in case of Isa (AS) i.e., taking up whole body. For everyone else, it means “death.” The “taken up whole” meaning has no precedent and is never used for anyone else anywhere. This is exactly similar to what my friend’s position is about “Jummah”. When I asked him to show where “Jummah” has ever been translated as "Friday, he replied it means “Friday” for Zaid, Bakar, and everyone else, but when it comes to his buddy Saleem, “Jummah” means Tuesday. Well, sir, if “Jummah” indeed means “Tuesday” and “tawaffa” means “taking up the whole body”, then indeed there must be some prior examples of similar usage.

Peace brahmachari99

You see that is where you are mistaken … the contention is not whether “tawaffee” means “death” - it is whether “tawaffee” - i.e. taking can be done on the whole body alive as well as in death.

You see I have already established that “tawaffee” cannot mean death … because according to the Qur’an “death” does “tawaffee” … death doesn’t do death, but death “takes” - you cannot confuse the act for the one doing the act.

I agree in many places when the maf’ool (object) is ghaib in the Arabic - then it is understood as the person is dieing … also focus on most of the cases the word for “soul” = “ruh” isn’t used … it says “take them” or “take him” - when I say I’m going to give HIM a book, I’m not giving “his soul” a book … I’m giving it to “all of HIM” … however in most cases I agree that “soul” is meant - despite the word not being used.

There is no doubt when the word in Arabic “mawt” is used … however, when we use “tawaffee” it can take the literal meaning outside the interpreted meaning. Death is the interpreted meaning not the literal one.

Now in your example “Friday” is the literal translation of “Jumma” however “tawaffee” is never literally translated as “death” - this is where your comparison is totally false. “tawafee” means “to take away/up” …

Also in your example you are talking about “translation” however in this topic we are talking about “interpretation” - there is no translation taking place … we are not disagreeing on the word - we are disagreeing on the meaning of it.

Tuesday for Friday is a raw example and can never be accepted as a tangible alternative.

The other difference is that we are talking about a “verb” whereas your example is about comparing “nouns” …

Nouns are simple - they are single words, however verbs are more diffcult they have three things going on.

Verbs are pure acts, Something needs to do the act, that is called the “subject” - or Faail in Arabic, not always, but something needs to have the act done on it - that is called the “object” … or “maf’ool” in Arabic … the verb is the f’il.

Now I hope you are in sync with me on this …

The pattern of {doing-doer-done on} is present in most cases:

Like the Arabic sentence in a single word:

Darabtuhu -

**I hit him

**Darab - Fi’l = Hit
tu - Fa’il = I
hu - Maf’ool = him

ka in Arabic means “you” directed to a male … this is how we establish the literal translation … now after this we have to make it make sense in context to the verse and the passage and the overall story of the person(s) being talked about only then can we get to the proper meaning.