Harder than Harvard!

Amazing success story from India. And I don’t think Infosys is even the biggest Infotech company there, TCS is probably bigger.

Anyway, now Chinese are trained in eating dosas!

JAI HIND!
NEW YORK (FORTUNE Magazine) - It’s just before nine on an overcast morning, and Yesha Bhatt, a 21-year-old engineer from Mumbai, joins a river of black hair flowing from her dormitory to the main classroom building on campus. Jake Hu, a 21- year-old from Jiangxi province in China, slips into the procession after hurriedly downing a dosa. Others – 4,000 “freshers,” as they’re called – talk on their mobile phones and gossip with friends as they make their way to class.

These are India’s chosen. Securing a position at Infosys is more competitive than gaining admission to Harvard. Last year the company had more than 1.3 million applicants for full-time positions and hired only 1 percent of them. (Harvard College, by comparison, accepted 9 percent of applicants.)

nside the steel gates at Mysore, an old silk town about 90 miles south of Bangalore where Infosys has its headquarters, few expenses have been spared in the effort to impress the several hundred freshers who arrive each week for the 14-week training programs. There’s a high-tech bowling alley, a hair salon, an infinity pool studded with palm trees, one of the largest gyms in India, and a geodesic dome that houses three movie theaters and looks as though it just rolled in from Epcot Center. Indeed, the $120 million Infosys center, which opened last year, is an odd combination of Disney World, Club Med, and a modern American university. It’s enough to make you forget the poverty outside and believe you’re in a First World fairy tale.
Boot camp for smart people
But this is not summer camp. Before even being considered for a job at Infosys, each applicant must pass an exam made up of math equations and logic puzzles that many fail. After the interview, after the job offer, comes the real test: eight hours a day at Mysore studying lines of Java code, attending team-building workshops, and learning to differentiate the do’s of global workplace etiquette from the don’ts. In order to graduate, every fresher has to pass two three-hour comprehensive exams.
Sometimes the students break down, says Ravindra Muthya, head of education and research. But only 1 percent to 2 percent drop out. “For us, this is very expensive,” he says. “We can’t lose them.”
Which raises the question: In a country like India, where daily newspapers run math equations for entertainment and the talent pool of engineers is said to be as expansive as the Ganges River, why must Infosys spend $5,000 per fresher for training?
“There is still an abyss between the academy and the industry,” says Abhishek Shandilya, 23, a mechanical engineer who graduated from college in Bangalore last year.
Infosys executives agree, saying that India’s higher-education system – often unpredictable and in some disciplines outdated – is preventing its new recruits from being placed immediately on client projects.
“I do not mean that we do not learn things in colleges,” says Shandilya, “but the knowledge we attain there is very raw.”
Many freshers, like Shandilya, come with little or no practical work experience. Infosys doesn’t mind. In fact, the company prefers hiring a mechanical engineer who lacks computer skills but shows a high aptitude for “learnability” (Infosys-speak for being a quick study) over a computer scientist who can’t solve problems beyond his technical training.
In many ways, Infosys treats its new recruits as if they’re still college students. On the Mysore campus, strict rules are in force. Boys are not allowed in the girls’ dorms (and vice versa). There’s no alcohol, anywhere, anytime. But you won’t hear many complaints. For most, the opportunity to work for Infosys is a dream come true.
Murthy’s dream
Bhatt remembers hearing about Infosys and its founder, Narayana Murthy, while growing up in Mumbai. Her father, a banker, talked about how Murthy was the “most down-to-earth person.”
Yet on Bhatt’s first day of class at Mysore, Murthy was anything but down-to-earth: There was his image, 12 feet tall, beaming down from two screens in the Mahatma Gandhi Auditorium, welcoming all the freshers – or Infoscions, as they’re also called.
In 1981, when Murthy hired his first recruits, there were few rules, and training happened on the job. The job, in those days, meant working out of a makeshift office in Murthy’s home. Today the virtual and impersonal welcome doesn’t bother freshers like Bhatt or Shandilya, who says he came away inspired. With scale comes anonymity, a fact not lost on the eager employee.
“I’m one of nine Abhisheks in my row,” he jokes over a traditional Indian meal at one of the food courts.
As Infosys has scaled up its workforce, it has relied more on technology for training purposes. “Productivity improvement comes from converting synchronous transactions to asynchronous transactions,” explains Murthy. His example: switching from phone calls (synchronous) to e-mail (asynchronous).
There’s an online database of Infosys case studies for employees who need help with client requests. And because of the ever-increasing class size in Mysore, the company is turning to computers to do much of the teaching.
Nagendra Setty’s Java class in the Gordon Moore Room – one of 58 high-tech classrooms on campus – is a case in point. Setty, an applications designer, clips on a microphone and lectures for three hours about J2EE, a Java platform. Then he steps away from the lectern, allowing the 100 students to work independently, building their own applications on their own computer monitors for the rest of the day.
While most of the training focuses on technical skills, freshers spend a lot of time working on softer skills such as team building, comportment, and improving interpersonal communications. In the Jeff Bezos Room one morning, Bhatt listened intently as the instructor discussed the importance of body language and told the class to practice smiling in front of a mirror.
There are plenty of smiles down the hall in the Harley-Davidson Room, where four students in Sudha Prasad’s corporate etiquette class perform a skit about trying to get back onto campus after drinking too many cocktails at a local bar and missing curfew.
“You are all brand ambassadors,” Prasad tells her class as she runs through several what-if scenarios.
It is ironic that Murthy and Nilekani – two low-key and modest executives – created a global b*****ng powerhouse in a country that favors the subtle over the brazen. But at Infosys U., the corporate logo is rarely out of sight. It adorns sugar packets, coffee mugs, polo shirts, and umbrellas. Each of the seven dormitory buildings is in the shape of one of the letters in “Infosys” – an effect visible only from the air.
An expanding brand
The brand now attracts attention far beyond India’s borders. The company has offices in 18 countries, including China. Jake Hu, the fresher from Jiangxi, who eats dosas with chopsticks, is one of 100 Chinese undergraduates selected by the company and government officials in Beijing to spend seven months training with Infosys. The exchange, an attempt to deepen the relationship between the two countries, is also a way for Infosys to find and train talent while it ramps up its operations in China.
“Infosys China is developing fast and provides a lot of opportunities,” says Hu during a break from a programming class. He will return to China this spring and expects to graduate with a software engineering degree in July.
But he and several compatriots aren’t sure the salaries Infosys pays in China can compete with those of other global firms. His dream job, he says, is to work in marketing for Procter & Gamble (Research). The Chinese students aren’t the only ones talking about pay. Outside the Gandhi Auditorium, two Indian freshers are planning their escape. “The pay is lousy,” one girl says. (Salaries start at about $5,000 a year.)
While the two say they are thrilled to be at Infosys and think the training is the best around, they also know its market value and plan to find a higher-paying job or apply for an MBA after a year with the company.
Paying for talent could end up being the industry’s – and perhaps the company’s – Achilles’ heel. The competition for well-trained engineers drove salaries in India up 15 percent last year. And job hopping has become commonplace.
“Every evening, Infosys capital walks out the door,” says Muthya, the education director. “Our job is to get them to come back.”
For now, Infosys has no choice but to continue scaling up. Blueprints for expanding the Mysore campus have been completed, and by 2007 it will have the capacity to train 10,000 employees at a time. That’s more than double the number it can accommodate today.
With a million-plus applicants a year and a relatively low attrition rate, Infosys appears fit for the coming talent battle. The Mysore training center may or may not help win that fight, but one thing is certain. These 4,000 young engineers didn’t come here to laze around the pool or burn calories on the company’s treadmills. After a week at Infosys U., Bhatt has yet to make it to the gym.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

It's not harder than Harvard, it's more competitive.

I've worked with Infosys folk. Very dedicated, very hardworking, however the work they do is hardly ground breaking or cutting edge. Such is the nature of their business, though.

But on the business side of things, it's a very, very well managed company. When our company was looking to outsource work for older generation products, Infosys was chosen out of a short list of a dozen or so companies that specialized in this task. We looked at Canadian, American, Irish, Australian, Thai, Vietnamese, Malay and of course Indian companies. Infosys was not at all the cheapest, but they were certainly the most impressive.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

Infosys sounds like a really good place to be (bowling alley, pool, theaters, lol). However, being harder to get into is no plus point. Consider India’s and USA’s *People:Universities *ratio, it’s evident that the acceptance rate will be very low. Either way, good for India… :k:

Re: Harder than Harvard!

Pkap, don't get your hopes high. They receive over a million applications a year.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

how many of those applications are quality applications though :)

Re: Harder than Harvard!

^ why does that matter? what portion of apps to harvard are quality?

Lately I understand Harvard has actually become tougher for Indians and Chinese to get in because so many of them qualify and that swings ethnic mix

Re: Harder than Harvard!

Harvard and Infosys arent even similar things to compare. One is a university (with many a mediocre department riding the coattails of some excellent ones), other is an average software company with a huge and expanding market.

Also, they hire pretty much anyone with half a brain from any half-decent engineering college in India. A position at Infosys isnt even a prestige job. Just code coolie conglomerate. Ditto for TCS, WIT etc. These companies arent making money on ingenuity or excellence, just on plain volume.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

It's the business model that is amazing...most software companies do mundane work.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

Infosys is a mediocre company? what world are you living in? Look at growth rate. Look at where all they have opened branches. and look at the last dozen or so deals where they have beaten what used to be Big 6...5...4. The days of 'big body shop' is not what all Infosys is. Or TCS or a half dozen others.

Harvard - mediocre riding coat tails of excellence...ofcourse. That's how any institution grows. You become the best in something, expand and in due course become best in more than one thing.

As to hiring half a brain & half decent engg colleges - isn't that the whole point being negated by the original article? The stats cited shows the selectivity is more in Infosys than Harvard. How can you reconcile that to your 'half brain...come in' impression?

Just plain volume? just plain volume? have you ever been in any business? Volume is everything. I know a hundred firms with the best research scientists and engineers in a few countries. All of them grow to about 20 to 100 people and then stop. And then they split as the partners leave. Suddenly they are not all that excellent and the key guys from there go work for somebody in Infosys. Volume is what India is all about - population, markets, crowd, whatever you want.

IBM adds 15000, Dell adds 20000, GE adds x0000...what's all that? volume.

How long can Toyota and VW survive but for volume?

Re: Harder than Harvard!

The article isnt accurate in its glorification of Infosys’ exclusivity. I graduated out of whats considered a good indian engineering school half a decade ago. None but the bottom of the barrel from good schools join Infosys and TCS. The more enterprising among those who did join jumped ship as soon as their contracts expired. Their ideal candidate is a fresh bachelors graduate desperate for a job. Plenty of these in India, because there are plenty of mediocre colleges in India.

Infosys is NOT a great place for a good engineer. It is for code coolies. It, however is a very well managed company, and much of its profits come in from mediocre software maintainance jobs in the West, engineers being paid salaries much lower than their counterparts in the countries where these jobs are done.

Walmart is a great company, and employs a hell of a lot of americans. Doesnt mean that it is a great place to work at.

I do like Infosys for one reason though. They have raised the payscale of engineers in India in general. Multinationals running engineer-sweatshops in Bangalore are forced to pay their smart engineers more to prevent them from jumping ship.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

it matters. kinda like when it comes to sales qualified leads are always better than unqualified leads..know what I mean mate.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

queer - if your point is that IITians and REC'ans (many) wouldn't join Infosys, I agree. There are hundred of other enng colleges, less well known from where they come from and there is a bunch within that, that are pretty good. I think the objection is to (if) that takes anything away from Infosys or these employees.

Working in Walmart may not sound great to us but for a certain class of people, they work towards it. I actually know their Cxo and a bit about the recent hullabulla they had to go through.

All that aside, my point is that because we know a lot of grads with a lesser degree than us join Infosys etc doesn't make that a lesser company. That is their product

Re: Harder than Harvard!


PVT engg colleges where professors dont know how to prgarm in C and these ppl by faking there resumes get into these so called big IT companies.i ve seen ppl without studying engg r able to get BE Btech deg certificates for just 30000 rs. and these r the ppl who r mojority in the companies like tcs,infosys etc.:D now u can guess their standards

Re: Harder than Harvard!

:naraz:

Re: Harder than Harvard!

PCL, can u actually read?
first off, no such thing as "so called big IT companies". a company is called big only depending upon their turnover and stock value.

that company hired 1 % out of the 1.3 million applicants. u have to be an illiterate village bumpkin to think what u just mumbled about their quality. the software proffesionals job is not that of sticking stamps on a paper that anyone can get in with "fake" degrees. seriously, were drunk when u typed that??
PS. btw ur spelling of "majority" kinda reveals stuff. a & o arent even near on the keyboard.......just joking :)

Re: Harder than Harvard!

dude, did you look at your spelling of proffesional before you mocked her mistake :slight_smile:

anyhoo, I have worked with infosys and TCS folks and i find TCS to be a better company in terms of its people. But then again, my exposure is limited to 2 encounters with infosys and one with TCS.

Majority of the people there are hardworking, yet not groundbreaking, but that is simply not their role, their charter is to deliver quality services at low prices. At the same time, those who rise within TCS ranks are the ones who learn about inductries and become experts in an industry or become specialists in a technology, others go through the churn and burn and leave. In general a good group of people. I can see the difference clearly as I compare this group to an avg group of indians.

Re: Harder than Harvard!

US is more competitive than infosys or TCS, just compare how many mexicans, eastern europeans and desis want to move here and how many actually get in :D

Re: Harder than Harvard!

pir sahib...i mean fraudia bhai, my spelling of professional with the double ff was a typographical error.
but to put an "o" instead of an "a" cant be a typo cos keyboards as we know them have "a" and "o" quite a few miles apart. :)

Re: Harder than Harvard!

surprising that you did not see that my typo was in spelling industries as inductries :)

which "a" did I mix with an "o" by the way my dear handy dandy dicktionary ;)

Re: Harder than Harvard!

ur typo was done purposely, so i let it slide :wink:
the “o” instead of “a” was done by “pyarilclarki” who’s case ur were defending(“mojority”-refer the initial post)