Hamza Yusuf at it again

Society Religion & Philosophy
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Seriously, i sometimes ask Allah at night during prayers... Why have we been blessed with the best religion but the most disunited of followers.

[quote]
I hope he will correct his statements and set the record straight otherwise it is duty of muslims to inform him of this, because a muslim is like a mirror of another muslim if they did or said something wrong then it there duty to inform and correct them!
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AK47, Zaytuna Academy and Institute....If you have further inquiries....please e-mail us at **[email protected], call us at (510) 582-1979, or write to us at 631 Jackson Street; Hayward, CA 94544-1533.

Please send me a cc of the e-mail that you send to him. i'll PM you my e-mail address later. As you stated above, you want to do your farz and "inform" and "correct" him of those mistakes.

As AK47 has stated, Sheikh Hamza Yusuf is much more educated regarding Islam and other issues, than most of us in this Forum. As such, i suggest we try to improve ourselves before criticizing a brother of ours who is trying to do so much with his life. It cannot be easy for him either. Instead of bickering amongst ourselves as though we are back in kindergarten, why don't we pray to Allah to accept the good deeds each of us does? The "golden age" of Islam, when Muslim scholars were respected wherever they travelled, when universities in Baghdad were renowned around the world for their stocks of books and scholarly efforts - how did we reach that point? Did we reach it by pointing fingers at everyone else's flaws or did we reach it through our own jihad to improve ourselves and our societies?

This is how we are killing ourselves, by infighting.

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lajawab said >>You might want to follow the Qadiyyani form of Islam as well...No terror in there either...No Jihad, no nothing...You can lie down on your back and let people push you down and walk all over you...Now That's real peaceful...The tyrants will love you for making their job easier...
<<

if Qadianis are cowards and lying down, who is acting as a tyrant to them?

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ENOUGH of Qadiyanis!!! Sheesh. :mad: Can’t you people find something else to talk about ? i don’t want this thread derailed again to discuss a topic for which we have 1 billion other threads.

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whatever happened to the tolerence:D j/k:):flower1:

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Thanks for sharing, Nadia. Very interesting read indeed.

I think a part of it is true, we do have many faults in ourselves too. Why else are muslim groups fighting amongst themselves? If we can't even be nice to fellow muslims, just because they are from a different sect, then how could we respect people from completely different religions?

It's true, we must change ourselves first. We still have a lot to learn, thanks for the reminder.

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I remember that 60 minutes interview he did after 9/11 where he got rid of his trademark turban and islamic dress and opted for the trimmed goatee, blue tie and american suit. Whereas the other participants, I believe the other was Siraj Wahaj, kept their Islamic dress. You can read the transcripts online somewhere where he also said something to the point where Jihad isnt really needed or something like that, I'm paraphrasing, and that women should wear hats instead of scarves? I Dunno, but I know a lot of muslims lost a lot of respect they had for him.

I also think that his popularity is due in large to the fact that he is a caucasion american, he speaks natural american english, and he's a good speaker. I guess you could call him the "white malcom x"

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by yusuf1982: *
and opted for the trimmed goatee
[/QUOTE]
I think he always sported a goatee. 9/11 notwithstanding.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Lajawab: *
Daniel Pearl was an Israeli spy...Spies deserve death...

Hamza Yusuf is a great speaker however...
[/QUOTE]

LOL.. a spy .. looks like you read the conspiracy theory magazine..

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by nomaan: *

LOL.. a spy .. looks like you read the conspiracy theory magazine..
[/QUOTE]

No he does not have to read conspiracy theory magazines..for people like him this form of knowledge is common sense.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
I think he always sported a goatee. 9/11 notwithstanding.
[/QUOTE]
]

Hamza's hair does not grow on his cheeks. This is his explanation for this goatee. Its a look I copied. :)

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**

Thank you, Sadya. :flower1: Thanks so much. i hope you always stay this polite.

i suspected that if a female responded to this thread, a slightly more logical, kinder reply would be forthcoming. Half of the replies in this thread are from individuals who have not met Hamza Yusuf, but hey - that need not worry us as we criticize a Muslim brother’s efforts. Regarding the comment that the reason he is “popular” is because he is a Muslim Caucasian - i know black guys who have reverted to Islam, they’re as black as the colour of the Kaabah. Does that minimize my respect for them - no, i love them just the same because they have shown me what it means to be true Muslim “brothers and sisters” - not just in name but in reality. My respect for them is substantial. i couldn’t give a damn if someone is as black as the night sky, it’s what’s inside that matters. If Hamza Yusuf was black - how would that change my perception of him? When we go to pray at the mosque, do you purposely try to sit next to someone who has lighter skin… for the life of me, this issue of colour is beyond my comprehension.

Anyways, thanks Sadya for your comments. i wish we would ALL (self included) learn to look beyond our differences of opinion and truly embrace each other in a move towards unity. But i guess that’s a long ways off by the looks of this thread.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Faisal: *
Instead of making a vague statement, wouldn't it be better for you to prep your post with a direct quote from the Quran which explains jehad in terms of military meaning?

[/QUOTE]

**Then after that He made (Jihad) "fighting" obligatory against all those who fight you (Muslims); not against those who didn't fight you. So Allah ordered:
And fight in the way of Allah those who fight you... (V.2:I9O).

March forth whether you are light (being healthy, young and wealthy) or heavy (being ill, old and poor), strive hard with your wealth and your lives in the Cause of Allah. This is better for you if you but knew. (V.9:41).

So when you meet (in fight-Jihad in Allah's Cause) those who disbelieve, smite at their necks till you have killed and wounded many of them, then bind a bond firmly (on them i.e. take them as captives). Thereafter is the time for) either generosity (i.e. free them without ransom) or ransom (according to what benefits Islam), until war lays down its burdens... (V.47:4)

If a wound (and killing) has touched you, be sure a similar wound (and killing) has touched the others. And so are the days (good and not so good), We give to men by turns... (V.3:140).

O you who believe! When you meet those who disbelieve in a battlefield, never turn your backs to them. (V.8:15).

“O you who believe, fight those who encircle you (close to you geographically) of the disbelievers and let them find harshness in you” [TMQ At-Tauba: 123]
**there are so many ayahs and hundreds of hadiths about jihad which is fighting the enemy I can;t understand people who say there no military jihad. This jihad on yourself is just plain nuts neither the sahabah or muhammad(saw) proclaimed such a thing!

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Again you are not answering the quote. Please list all the muslim countries who have waged war on USA. If you say that there is no muslim state presently, then your point is moot, again.

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Then whoever transgresses against you, you transgress likewise against him. And fear Allah, and know that Allah is with the Muttaqoon (Pious)” [TMQ Al-Baqarah: 194].

This ayah is sufficient to anyone able to read, that a terrorist state like america which openly waged war on muslims is an enemy state and needs to be defeated. If you expect those puppet regimes in muslim countries to declare war on america then you dreaming.

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"who would be considered a martyr for his cause" this is what he said. Muslims don't have sole rights over the word "martyr". Anyone can be a martyr. What exactly is your point?

[/quote]

*Hamza Yusuf is talking and representing islam he is not explaining an english language seminar.The prominent meaning of “Martyr” Shaheed in Islamic terms is, a person who is killed in Jihad. This is the highest degree of martyrdom. A lesser degree is for a Muslim who gets killed defending his/her family, his/her wealth, or his/her honor, a person with terminal illness, a woman who dies while delivering a child, and the one who dies drowning. But this applies only to Muslims according to the definitive Ayah in the Quran: “Verily, Allah forgives not (the sin of) setting partners (in worship) with Him” (Surah 4 Verse 116). Hence, Martin Luther King – although he stood for a just cause-- definitely does not fit in this second category of martyrdom unless he became a Muslim before he died. *

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Well said! AK47.

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mashallah this man has done alot and may allah make him even wiser and a better muslim as time goes on so that he coudl do islam an even greater service.

As i rightly remmber during war it is a muslims requirement to not hurt the young the old, the women, the ones who surrender, the cattle or any form of crop. how can any one justify the killing of innocent ppl as jihad.

thank u nadia bibi for sharing the article u always post somethign informative :p

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Well-stated, Waleed. Insha’Allah.

:k:

**
aw thanks Waleed :flower1: i really appreciate that, thank you :slight_smile: :flower1:

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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by ak47: *
*(V.2:I9O).
(V.9:41).
(V.47:4)
(V.3:140).
[TMQ At-Tauba: 123] **
[/QUOTE]
Well done ak47. See, if you make a logical, evidential argument, it is much better. Now, why don't you send this via email to Hamza Yusuf alongwith a excerpt of his speech (?) and see what do they say? He may come back and say you have a point, or he may explain to you the context of the ayat and why he feels you are reading it wrongly.
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by ak47: *
This ayah is sufficient to anyone able to read, that a terrorist state like america which openly waged war on muslims is an enemy state and needs to be defeated. If you expect those puppet regimes in muslim countries to declare war on america then you dreaming.*
[/QUOTE]
"Puppet regimes" they may be, but you have just indicated that it will be akin to "dreaming" if we think any muslim country has declared war on US. So, first establish a muslim state, then declare war on US. Then come back and make this argument.

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by ak47: *
**Hamza Yusuf is talking and representing islam he is not explaining an english language seminar.The prominent meaning of “Martyr” Shaheed in Islamic terms is, a person who is killed in Jihad. ...But this applies only to Muslims according to the definitive Ayah in the Quran: “Verily, Allah forgives not (the sin of) setting partners (in worship) with Him” (Surah 4 Verse 116). Hence, Martin Luther King – although he stood for a just cause-- definitely does not fit in this second category of martyrdom unless he became a Muslim before he died. *
[/QUOTE]
You and he are probably talking about two different things. While you are right about Islamic definition and all that, it is just that.... an Islamic definition. You can keep it close to your heart and make it exclusive... your view point doesn't necessarily make it right. Others can use the term differently or more loosely.

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by ak47: *

here he is saying jihad is not military even 7 year old kids in palestine know jihad is to expel the israel occupiers from the land!

[/QUOTE]
Those Palestinians are fighting a defensive war. It is in defense of there mother land-no one who is peaceful would support an offensive jihad. Forcing Islam on ppl is HARAM. There is no compulsion in Islam.

I think this guy is dreaming the US is bombarding the muslims lands with everything they got!

[/QUOTE]
The US is justifiabbly taking pre emptive action against those who are likely to commit another ghastladly act ala 9/11. They are fully justified to defend their people.

Hamza Yusuf: If there are any martyrs in this affair it would certainly be those brave firefighters and police that went in there to save human lives and in that process lost their own.

according to yusuf non-Muslim firefighters and police o sept 11 who lost their lives are shuhadaa' and will not have accountability on the Day of Judgement !

[/QUOTE]
I dont think that was meant literally. Even so, they would be the only martys there. Certainly not those beats who had no care for human life!

Hamza yusuf has much greater knowledge than me...

Sure does. Should have left your post at this.

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I got a chance to hear to this guy last year at Isna. He was thoroughly unimpressive. He brought in some references to Thomas Jeferson in the context of present day American Muslim situation that were absolutely vague, unrelated, and sounded like were used only to throw in a new spin to affairs to show off his eloquency and historic tid bits. I think most of the people who are impressed by him are impressed because of his language not content. The guy is shallow and tries to win fame by touching popular sentiments using his eloquency and scholarly-sounding reasoning. HaaN, there was another guy, Tariq something, who spoke after him and he was in fact good.

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^^Eloquency itself is an art...That's why Shakespeare, Huxley, Orwell were considered to be the best writers of all...

And anyways, it's not like eloquency is taught in any class...It comes from within and is achieved through a great deal of hardships and endurance...

I am sure some people are really impressed with the way Jerry Falwell speaks...His mouthing off someone's faith as if it was garbage speaks volumes about eloquency there...

Perhaps that's more your style...

However, disregard this remark...

Gift of delivery is nice gift...One should use it...

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by angelo_dundee: *
Those Palestinians are fighting a defensive war. It is in defense of there mother land-no one who is peaceful would support an offensive jihad. Forcing Islam on ppl is HARAM. There is no compulsion in Islam.
[/quote]

In palestine it is a defensive jihad that is correct. But Hamza yusuf said people like the palestinian kids need authority to fight jihad say what, since when do you need authoirty to fight occupiers it written in quran go look at the ayahs above it clear cut you don’t need authorty to fight jihad. It is like saying I need authority to pray!

** You are incorrect about your no compulsion in the deen statement because if a muslim becomes murtad he knows its verdict of 3 days to return to fold of islam or it is death sentance. only non muslim has no compulsion in the deen**

[quote]
The US is justifiabbly taking pre emptive action against those who are likely to commit another ghastladly act ala 9/11. They are fully justified to defend their people.
[/quote]

*So the US is justfied to bomb the living day lights out of muslim lands, I see so muslims are not justified to attack the US for its terrorism or israels terrorism is that right why because that not terror according to some people hmmm intresting i see. *

[quote]
Hamza yusuf has much greater knowledge than me...
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Yes and he should use it wisely.