Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

One can disagree with some of his view points on music and other issues but what a genius man he is. He is miles miles ahead of all these scholars of today who are more Preachers than scholars. Haroon Yayha, Hamza Yousaf or Zakir Naik and Bilal Philips etc who cannot have such depth of geo-politico situation and such vision and knowledge.etc as they live there .I think Allama Ghamdi is one of the greatest scholar today in Islamic World

Salute to Ghamdi. Listen such a wonderful debate over Swat Issue.He blasted Talibans and Wahabi Ideology and covered whole Islamic History.What a beauty , what a knowledge.

Part 1

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Part 2

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Part 3

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Part 4

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Part 5

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Part 6

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Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Ghamidi was born on April 18, 1951 in a peasant family of Kakazai tribe from Jiwan Shah near Sahiwal, Pakistan.His early education included a modern path (Matriculation from Islamia High School, Pakpattan in 1967), as well as a traditional path (Arabic and Persian languages, and the Qur’an with Mawlawi Nur Ahmad of Nang Pal). He later graduated from Government College, Lahore, with a BA Honours in English in 1972.Initially, he was more interested in literature and philosophy. Later on, he worked with renowned Islamic scholars like ***Sayyid Abul Ala Maududi and Amin Ahsan Islahi ***on various Islamic disciplines particularly exegesis and Islamic law.

Ghamidi’s father was a follower of Sufism. In the later years of his life, Ghamidi changed his opinion about Sufism. He wrote a criticism on Sufism in his book Burhan and also didn’t include it in his book Mizan, which is a comprehensive treatise on the contents of Islam.

Ghamidi worked closely with Sayyid Abul Ala Maududi (سيد أبو الأعلى المودودي, alternative spelling Syed Maudoodi; often referred to as Maulana Maududi) (1903–1979) for about nine years before voicing his first differences of opinion, which led to his subsequent expulsion from Mawdudi’s political party, Jamaat-e-Islami in 1977. Later, he developed his own view of religion based on hermeneutics and ijtihad under the influence of his mentor, Amin Ahsan Islahi (1904–1997), a well-known exegete of the Indian sub-continent who is author of Tadabbur-i-Qur’an, a Tafsir (exegeses of Qur’an). Ghamidi’s critique of Mawdudi’s thought is an extension of Wahid al-Din Khan’s criticism of Mawdudi. Khan (1925- ) was amongst the first scholars from within the ranks of Jamaat-e-Islami to present a fully-fledged critique of Mawdudi’s understanding of religion. Khan’s contention is that Mawdudi has completely inverted the Qur’anic worldview. Ghamidi, for his part, agreed with Khan that the basic obligation in Islam is not the establishment of an Islamic world order but servitude to God, and that it is to help and guide humans in their effort to fulfill that obligation for which religion is revealed. Therefore, Islam never imposed the obligation on its individual adherents or on the Islamic state to be constantly in a state of war against the non-Islamic world. In fact, according to Ghamidi, even the formation of an Islamic state is not a basic religious obligation for Muslims

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

I have been watching his program quite regularly now on the TV. I do not necessarily agree with his views but nonetheless I appreciate his knowledge and cool, patient style.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

lol, desertbird, do you know abc about the four people you mentioned?, calling the scholars cowards. We're well aware of the modernists and their understanding of the sharee'ah.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Desert bird... you didn't have to go to extreme and call other scholars as cowards. Do you have even little idea about the depth of knowledge of Dr. Zakir Naik, Dr. Israr and others? Ghamidi sahab may be a good scholar who speaks well but thats does not mean you exaggerate his position into something like the best and the rest as fools.

Ghamidi sahab is a modernist "scholar". If creation of a state is not a valid objective than we must all live under secular rule and go back to the age of colonialism.

He says he was impressed by teachings of Maulana Maududi and Ameen Ahsen Islahi. You do not know what Ameen ahsan Islahi said. Ghamidi sahab is just fooling everyone.

He is in my opinion, misguiding people. According to Ghamidi's view, women do not need to cover up in modern day and there is no need to have an Islamic state. So what state should we have non-Islamic state with no Quranic law?

Get a life man.... and I respect your opinion and your love for Ghamidi sahab. But please abstain from calling other scholars as cowards. Just shows your caliber.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Well I personally like his style of discourse. Dr. Khalid Zaheer is one of his students, both of them have come up with a unique methodology where they set a side Ahadith and debate issues on the basis of Quran. (You will find that they mostly quote from Quran, even when it is asked what is muslim view on this and that, they only quote Quran). I am not of a view that they don’t believe in the validity of Hadith but the have devised this new method. where Hadith is treated secondary... .

Is Ghamidi Sahib Munkire Hadith?
*Response:
Ghamidi Sahib has written a book “Al-Meezan” in which he has mentioned the outcome of thirty years of his research of what the teachings of Islam are. The book is comprised of more than seven hundred (700) pages. In his book, he has quoted one thousand and twenty-eight (1028) ahadith to explain various aspects of Islam (more than one hadith per page!). In the beginning of the book he has elaborated his understanding of the status of hadith in learning Islamic teachings and he has also explained his point of view on how the contents of hadith should be reflected upon to properly benefit from them. His book is available for people to read. Before commenting upon Ghamidi Sahib’s attitude towards hadith, one should read his ideas on the subject carefully.

A few other pieces of information might also help:

i) Ghamidi Sahib taught for at least two years the meanings of ahadith of Sahih Muslim on AAJ television every Sunday for fifteen minutes. He has a plan to concentrate on doing research on ahadith after he has completed his translation and exegeses of Qur’an, if God permits him to live on.

ii) Apart from Ibn Hazm, and may be a few others, no other first-generation scholar believed that information coming down to us through hadith was as authentic as the Qur’an and sunnah mutawatirah.

iii) Hanafis, who were also referred to as people of Iraq, were called Ahlur Ray in the second century of Islamic history as against the others who were called Ahle Hadith. The distinction between the two was that while the former thought that it was preferable to base one’s religious opinion on ra’y (opinion based on analogy) in the light of Qur’an and sunnah than on the weak source of khabare wahid (information from one or a few individuals which is what hadith is), Ahle Hadith, Imam Shafi being the most prominent amongst them, thought that hadith should get preference over ra’y.

iv) There are several mentions of Rafa Yadain in Bukhari and Muslim and yet Hanafis don’t make it a practice of theirs. The earlier Hanafi position on it was that the mention in hadith is inconsistent with the sunnah that was prevalent in the Muslim society (a similar stance is reported about Imam Malik in Bidayatul Mujtahid). The later Hanafi explanation has altered and they now claim that there were ahadith of prayers without Rafa Yadain too. The question is that if Hanafis can prefer some ahadith which are weaker in authenticity compared to others, what wrong has Ghamidi Sb done if he understands the meanings of ahadith in the light of Qur’an? There are many other examples of Hanafis ignoring authentic ahadith and preferring the opinion of their own scholars on the basis of some other argument. In Hajj, for example, authentic ahadith tell us that prophet, alaihissalaam, told Muslims on many occasions that if the sequence of rituals was altered by people inadvertently, it wasn’t a big problem; Hanafis insist that the person who has so done should sacrifice an animal (do ‘dum’) to compensate for it.

*Although it is nicely put in scholarly manner, but it should be clear that it is not due to our enduring that Quran is valid to date, it is Allah (SWT) who took the responsibility to preserve truth regarding this last revelation in what so ever form, and as we can see Hadith is more like explanatory tool to understand Quran firmly (and it has mention of things that are not even present in Quran or we may not deduce it), because in a lot of matters if one decides with his own intellect he will go astray.As Quran says it guides people (who understands it from the authenticated sourses) and lead them astry (to those who make up their own meaning from the verses of Quran and go astray) Therefore, we have to converge to the explanation provided by Ahadith. And as you can see in 2nd point he deliberately said something and then successfully escaped from the matter.
My point is if something is in Hadith books (even something in History book and is nothing but the manifestation of truth) and after using all our tools (ilm-e-rejal, ilm-e-hadith, etc) we conclude its authenticity, we should also adhere to it. Our exploration of truth should be scientific rather sentimental.

But regarding Tabliban issue (a scio-political matter) he pointed out very commendable things, those should be pondered upon.

Regards

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Peace desert bird

This is a clip from an 8 part youtube video it has Sh. Hamza Yusuf talk about some of the issues with the ex-Prime Minister of UK. If you watch the whole 8 parts you will see that Sh. constantly makes ‘digs’ at the bad policies of UK and US to an extent that people are laughing because he is sitting there as a guest saying it to Blair’s face, trying to make him apologise for his previous wrongs, but Blair does not do it.

However, you will also see that the show is totally dominated by Sh. Yusuf and his explanations use all forms of references, in the Qur’an, Sunnah, scholars lives, western celebrities and references from Chinese and Christian religions.

And on top of it he directly addresses the issues that face us today and at the end of this clip he brings information that is valuable and that is about the “cure to greed” he has directly addressed this problem and left us with the information about his book that he has written so we can get more in-depth information on this matter.

If I do the same with all the other people you have mentioned no doubt I will come with the same thing. The people you mentioned are also known on an international scale, but Javed Ghamidi is known only to Pakistanis and may be some Indians around the world, but most of his topics are localised to Pakistan affairs.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

I guess popularity has more to do with media coverage rather than a decree of most knowledgeable. Moreover it also deals with the subject matter you encounter. Sub-continent has produced a number of great scholars but due to lack of public awareness most people don’t even know their names. From Pakistan I know Moulana Fazulur Rehman and Qazi Sahab more than any other "religious" scholar, because I am "Newsa-hoic":)

Regards

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

This is a reminder to all Brothers and Sisters in this forum who are residing in Pakistan (and also outside it) that they should refrain themselves and instruct others to refrain from the writings, speeches and programs of Javed Ahmed Ghamdi who is the head of Al Mawrid Institute Lahore, Renaissance, Understanding Islam, Islamic Issues.

The gentleman and his affiliates are deviants to the extreme of rejecting the Nasoos of the Quran let alone the Hadith. Ghamdi has insulted the Ulemas of Deoband in his book burhan.

He rejects

  1. Any form of Had (Prescribed Punishment),
  2. Hadith to be direct
  3. Nazool Eesa Alahi Salam and his Life (like Qadiyanis)
  4. Had for an Apostate (Murtad)
  5. Claims the 7 recitations of quran to be wrong (he is a close ally and aide of Daniel Pipes and Robert Spencer)
  6. Music and Dancing of all sorts is permissible
  7. Jihad against oppression is the only jihad allowed
  8. The Shahadat of a man and woman are equal
  9. There is no concept of Purdah (Hijab / Veil) in Islam,

Apart from this he is flying high these days by coming on TV brought by GEO Television. Mr. Ghamidi has special interest in Asma Jahangir and Qadinyanis much of whose ideology is reflected in his articles.

One of his student Khalid Zaheer is Munkareen Hadith Like Islahi, Farahi, Ghulam Ahmed Pervez, Allama Mashriqui. Khalid Zaheer is a professor at LUMS, Lahore (one can expect him to be in places like this).

Ghamidi's books are Bayan, Mizan and Burhan, the last one being a mockery of Islam, Prophets, Companions, Imams, Muhaditheen and Mufasereens. They are seldomly available in Pakistan but are available at Danish Sara which are regional centers for Ghamidi's Operations.

The aim of this posting is to request all members not to fall into the traps of Ghamidi. At present he is being fully supported by the Qadiyani Lobby against the Hudood Ordinance.

SALUTE for what Mr. desert bird?

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Its Media Coverage , nothing else. Arab and the whole world may be unaware of Ashraf Ali Thanvi , Syed Maudoodi , Shah Waliullah etc so means that Hamza Yousaf and Haroon Yayha are greater scholars than these personalities as they are in limelight of screens and youtubes, blessings of tech. indeed ! .They all combine cannot even reach the foot-level of anyone of these personalities and thier works and contributions towards Islam .Terrorism is the order of the day so everyone rise and start giving lectures and start making ’ Theroies’ about it and ’ slightly’ criticizing Western Policies not make them scholars .

Allama Ghamdi , Shah Waliullah , Ashraf Ali Thanvi and Maulana Maudoodi talks about political depriviation of past 1400 years , philosophy of political islam , Khilafat-o-Malookiat etc etc. Wahabism , Talibinization born from this concept of fighting against whole world to establish so called Islamic State or Caliphate even if you have to cut people throats , blast them in suicidal attacks or kill them like in twin towers , its ’ Jihaad '.

PS: PM of Secular Turkey did more to Israeli Prime Minsiter in Davos Conference and left the Conference when he was not allowed to speak.I salute him more and he is my true hero than these who cannot dare to speak against the Dajjalic Social and Economic System of West but hard on Namaaz Roza only.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

^Yaar desert bird

Please pray for me that I am not affected by media coverage ... perhaps then I may see things as clearly as you.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Mulla Propganda Machine start on everyone if one dare to speak truth or not follow thier Conventional Rigid Version , who cares :confused:

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

No Sir , you are setting traditions of hours/day or month coverage as knowledge-base. 70% mosques of US are made and sponsred by Saudia Arabia and thier imams are wahabis .By that logic , only this sect is true as they have more resources and coverage of petro-dollars while poor brelvi and deobandi in Pakistan cannot afford it , so they are wrong as world not know about them. What this logic :confused:

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

I agree with shafiq

media is giving coverage to all these moderates. they are misleading people of pakistan.
ghamdi's views are close to those of ahmadi group.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

^^ Anyone against Wahabi/Salafi hardcore version = Qadiyani :flower1:

He has worked with Maulana Maudoodi and Ameen Ahsan Islahi like Giants .Were they also Qadiyanis :rotfl:

PS: One of LUMS donor is Ahmedia Jamaat .Means every student and faculty member of LUMS is either Qadiyani or have friendship relations with them :rotfl:

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

He is humble and calm, but i wouldn't call him the greatest. :)

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Peace desert bird

I can only ask you to pray for me. For me ijaza, silsila, ikhlaq and what is being said and what is being done are more important than media coverage. But I don’t rule out coverage as a meaningful measure of ‘greatness’ … because such people create a demand.

…It is pointless to have a great mind who is of no use to someone because he cannot be accessed, likewise it is pointless to have a famous person without knowledge…

I don’t think any of the people mentioned above are at any of these extremes. I do however reject the obvious disparity that you are giving them, but then perhaps I need to understand urdu and Javed Ghamdi more. I will listen to him more now that you have pointed out your interest in him, but the little I have seen I do not agree with everything he has said, but the good thing is that he is willing to change his mind when given evidence.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

There are basically two kinds of people.
**
Category # 1.** One who want to learn the actual truth and follow it, even if it is against their taste, wishes, and desires...Even if they have to give their life for it, they would follow it after their heart recognizes the truth from authentic sources.

Category # 2. Who desire to do something (e.g. listening to music, no hijab, no beard..etc) but know the authentic sources forbid it, so to console their heart they seek scholars who would allow those forbidden things for them, but such people forget that their is also a scholar sitting inside them (inner conscious) "Zameer" ki awaaz bhi kabhi sun leni chahiyey.

Ghamdi is a perfect choice for the people of category # 2.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

Okay I've listened to the first video posted by desert bird

Conclusion:

Topic was a basic one about the difference of groups and group mentality.
All the scholars have talked this topic to state of deep insight.

Also, I notice Javed Ghamidi has an interesting style he will impose the question and impose the answer to the question in a monologue. He will not give any or very few references to what other scholars have said to back up his claims and he has a very intellectual style of self-authority which is not from the sunnah of traditional scholars.

Scholars of tradition use statements of their predecessors to back up their claims and push any arrogance away from themselves by attributing to others. This I do not see in the spoken style of Javed Ghamdi. Javed Ghamdi reminds me of a university lecturer who has lots of dogma and is involved not in bringing out people to think but to convince them to believe his thinking - i.e. indoctrination.

His style will numb the mind and not bring about a sense of self analysis, but at the same time convince the listener that we are hearing the truth.

Re: Greatest Scholar Javed Ghamdi : Salute

If you listen the other parts which are of 6 6 or 8 minutes hardly , you will see he has given references of Syed Maudoodi , Abul Kalam Azad Ameen Ahsan etc and other scholars.

What you call arrogance , i call it ' blind following ' that we just follow what our peer sahab , hazrat sahab , maulana shiekh ul arab o ajam used to say .