Re: Gaza Under attack
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Re: Gaza Under attack
oh i see...so you have a crystal ball..you know exactly what i have been itching for..what else am i itching for Jolie! please tell me...lol
now lets get to generalization topic and the one you are using to emotionalize people. I avoided it because i dd not derail the thread but since you are "ithcing', let me respond to it.
First and foremost...people can go back and read that thread...i posted an article by a dawn bolgger and made my comments in that context.
***"Good article portraying nuisances, conspiracies and insecurities that are now inherently part of our social DNA....driven by too much of religion doze given to this nation across the spectrum. whenever i go to pakistan, I get suffocated by one-dimensional thought process i.e. blaming west/USA/jews/indians for everything, refuse to take any blame for our utter incompetence almost in every field, and keep bringing religion into every discussion and issue and thus shutting down any opportunity to discuss freely..............
i have been to over 45 countries (for my job mostly) and i have yet to find any country where people hate jews as much we do in Pakistan.......................as if jews have a different creator.... if they are so bad blame the creator first who is producing such toxic material...
jews are closely followed by hindus and USA in terms of hate..pls note, Pakistanis do not hate Indians, they hate hindus. always surprised that sikhs are always adored by Pakistanis....Christians and Buddhists are ok as well but hindus....***"
Am i ashamed or embarrassed for making these comments? Absolutely not. I stand behind what i said. I have born and raised in pakistan...i lived in rural areas, urbans areas, my family unfortunately runs for politician elections from a rural base and for years i had to travel across villages, meet ordinary people during those campaigns. I went to school in an urban sitting and lived in lahore, faislablad and many other places for over 20 years...and yes i can say with fully confidence how we Pakistanis think of jews.. i know what the word yahoodi means in our society...i know all the sayings and proverbial phrases that we have in our social lives to explain yahoodis. Majority of Pakistanis live in villages and i know the kind of sermons religious molvis deliver about jews and what our ordinary population in those villages/towns think of jews...i dont need to generalize anything. The amount of hatred we have against yahoodis (that is the word mainstream pakistani use for them) is not a hidden taboo.
And then i said the next one in line are hindus and USA. and i specifically said that pls note, Pakistanis do not hate Indians, they hate hindus. always surprised that sikhs are always adored by Pakistanis....Christians and Buddhists are ok as well but hindus...."
i am not generalizing Pakistanis for sikhs and many other communities because i never found that behavior among pakistanis for those communities...but yes in Pakistan where i was raised yahoo wa hanood were always sees suspiciously. I know many guppies know what i mean when said hanoodd wa yahood.
So i am just saying what i have observed. I am not embarrassed at all but yes i am embarrassed that our society has become radicalized and i have a huge problem with it and i will keep saying it.
Read your own long post. It makes no sense whatsoever except one contradiction that stands out like sore thumb. You give long emotional verbose at the beginning about how you know Pakistan (namely Lahore and Faislabad, lol) inside out and at the end you finish your assessment by saying where "I was raised, yahoodi is a bad word". So your Pind now represents whole of Pakistan and all Pakistanis must bear the guilt and responsibility for what happens in your village?
Of course I know you are neither ashamed nor embarrassed and this is why I strongly believe people like you would only understand the toxic effects of seriously injurious stereotyping that gets churned out simply out habit when people like you become the victim of your own propaganda and hate. Then you'd know what it feels like to be tarnished callously with a same negative brush.
How graciously you insist that not all Jews are Zionist, but you have you ever spared the same mercy and civility towards Pakistanis? No they are all racist, Jew and Hindu haters, and somewhere in this world, plenty of people would also place you in that group.
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Of course it makes a difference. It shows you are a liar and you fabricate and twist people's words when it suits your agenda.
Expose me, lol? Look who's talking. Not a single word regarding your own well recorded bigoted behaviour. Maybe I've given you a taste of your disgusting medicine. Does hypocrisy still taste sweet? Now you know how it feels.
Yes its all about ego who on earth wants to be preached by internalized racist and a hypocrite. But keep ranting about my ego and personality, you've clearly made a great discovery.
ok mam..sure i am a liar...guppies can read and make their own mind. You said amreeeka and i quoted "all of amreeka"...............you obviously did not mean all of amreeka when you said amreeka.....i am a liar.......you won, as always!
now, speaking of my bigoted behavior and why i did not say a single word on that topic of jews and hindus..read my other post.. I was avoiding it not to derail the thread but i am have answer my stand on that issue.
Internalized racist and a hyppocrite........fine whatever you think. I am not ging to defend. You can have the last word.
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Read your own long post. It makes no sense whatsoever except one contradiction that stands out like sore I thumb. You give long emotional verbose at the beginning about how you know Pakistanis inside out and at the end you finish your assessment by saying where "I was raised, yahoodi is a bad word". So your Pind now represents whole of Pakistan?
My pind or your pind...does not matter. I am making a very focused statement. Please read it again. The observations that i noted are based on a collective experience urban/rural.
Bottom-line, if you think majority off Pakistanis have a different viewpoint of yahoodis and jews or haanoods, fine. You have your opinion. What yahoodi means in our society i dont have to explain.
I made this explanation because you were leveling accusation after accusation...and to say that I stand behind my words for a reason. I am not hiding behind any excuses. I believe we have this problem in Pakistan and i will say it openly. And yes that is why i said that i dont see that problem against other communities such as skikhs, Buddhists and christian.
if that makes me bigot, racists and whatever you think..fine.
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This one state solution looks more scary but unfortunately due to deafening silence from entire muslim world, we are leading towards that. Its funny how everyone is forgetting it can be their turn tomorrow.
The Daily Show explains why discussing Israel-Palestine is so hard - Vox
The Daily Show explains why discussing Israel-Palestine is so hard
Updated by Max Fisher on July 22, 2014, 11:10 a.m. ET @Max_Fisher](http://twitter.com/Max_Fisher) [EMAIL=“[email protected]”][email protected]
Even if you see the joke coming, it’s still pretty good. Jon Stewart begins to introduce a segment on the ongoing Israel-Palestine conflict but on saying the word “Israel” is immediately shouted down by overly zealous supporters of Israel (what we in the business call “pro-Israel trolls”) who accuse him of unfair double-standards, being a self-hating Jew, and so on. He says the word “Hamas” and is mobbed again, now told he supports the murder of Palestinian children and is a Zionist pig.
Just to be clear: this is a zero-exaggeration, 100 percent accurate portrayal of what it is like to cover Israel-Palestine during times of conflict.
An article about Palestinian casualties from Israeli air strikes is met with outraged accusations that the author hates Israel and secretly wishes for the deaths of Israelis; an article about Israelis suffering under Palestinian rocket fire is met with outraged accusations that the author hates Palestinians and is complicit in their deaths. On any given day during periods of conflict, the New York Times is accused of both.
To be clear, that’s not to whine about how covering Israel can be difficult — Western journalists are obviously just bystanders in the conflict, which causes actual real-world harm to Israelis and Palestinians far beyond the mild annoyance of getting yelled at by people. But there is a serious point to be made here: starting and having an actual, reasonable public conversation about the conflict is made next to impossible by this effect, to the point that non-partisans have fewer opportunities to learn about it, and that partisans have almost no opportunity to discover the shades of grey, or god forbid the humanity of people on the “other side.”
Why is the Israel-Palestine conversation so uniquely polarized, and so angry? There are many reasons: decades of enmity, broken agreements, and violence only explain so much. Partly, it’s the stakes, which go beyond even the risks of death. Both sides see their very nation, and thus their identity, at danger of being wiped out, and they’re not wrong. Both sides see themselves as the entrenched, encircled, endangered minority.
Crucially, both sides also believe that the world could be on the cusp of imposing an outcome either to their favor or disfavor; this sense of an imminent and decisive judgment from the outside world compels partisans on both ends to litigate their worldview as aggressively as possible. The fact that the world has not yet come around to your preferred side’s obvious righteousness and moral superiority just proves that the media is unfairly skewing against you. And that makes shouting down any public conversation less 100 percent compliant to your worldview not just justified, but a moral imperative. Given that the outside world does play an important role in mediating the Israel-Palestine conflict, the fact that public discourse around it is broken has real-world implications way beyond just making it annoying for people in the media like Jon Stewart.
CARD 1 OF 25LAUNCH CARDS
What are Israel and Palestine? Why are they fighting?
Israel is the world’s only Jewish state, located just east of the Mediterranean Sea. Palestinians, the Arab population that hails from the land Israel now controls, refer to the territory as Palestine, and want to establish a state by that name on all or part of the same land. The Israeli-Palestinian conflict is over who gets what land and how it’s controlled.
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Israel in red, Palestinian-majority territories in pink. Wikimedia Commons
Though both Jews and Arab Muslims date their claims to the land back a couple thousand years, the current political conflict began in the early 20th century. Jews fleeing persecution in Europe wanted to establish a national homeland in what was then an Arab- and Muslim-majority territory in the British Empire. The Arabs resisted, seeing the land as rightfully theirs. An early United Nations plan to give each group part of the land failed, and Israel and the surrounding Arab nations fought several wars over the territory. Today’s lines largely reflect the outcomes of two of these wars, one waged in 1948 and another in 1967.
The 1967 war is particularly important for today’s conflict, as it left Israel in control of the West Bank and Gaza Strip, two territories home to large Palestinian populations:
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Note that, since 1967, Israel has returned Sinai to Egypt. BBC News
Today, the West Bank is nominally controlled by the Palestinian Authority and is under Israeli occupation. This comes in the form of “settlers,” Jews who build ever-expanding communities in the West Bank that effectively deny the land to Palestinians, and Israeli troops, who protect the settlers and enforce Israeli security restrictions on Palestinian movement. Gaza is controlled by Hamas, an Islamist fundamentalist party, and is under Israeli blockade but not ground troop occupation. The two Palestinian groups may have reconciled on April 23rd, creating one shared Palestinian government for the first time since 2007. That prompted Israel, who believes Hamas will never give up its commitment to destroy Israel, to suspend talks.
The primary approach to solving the conflict today is a so-called “two-state solution” that would establish Palestine as an independent state in Gaza and most of the West Bank, leaving the rest of the land to Israel. Though the two-state plan is clear in theory, the two sides are still deeply divided over how to make it work in practice.
The alternative to a two-state solution is a “one-state solution,” wherein all of the land becomes either one big Israel or one big Palestine. Most observers think this would cause more problems than it would solve, but this outcome is becoming more likely over time for political and demographic reasons.
Re: Gaza Under attack
When one chicken is being slaughtered in front of others, the others are least bothered and don’t fathom that they could/will be next. 
One state solution say to Israeliyon ki jaan jaati hai.
Democratic state main Palestinians ki majority ho jaey ji or equal citizenship rights dainay paRain gay.
Uss soorat main dakhna kitni jaldi ‘democracy’ ko abandon kartay hain Amreeka ki asheerbaad say.
Three-fourth of Palestinians favour 1-state solution. They don’t want their country chopped up.
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My pind or your pind...does not matter. I am making a very focused statement. Please read it again. The observations that i noted are based on a collective experience urban/rural.
Bottom-line, if you think majority off Pakistanis have a different viewpoint of yahoodis and jews or haanoods, fine. You have your opinion. What yahoodi means in our society i dont have to explain.
I made this explanation because you were leveling accusation after accusation...and to say that I stand behind my words for a reason. I am not hiding behind any excuses. I believe we have this problem in Pakistan and i will say it openly. And yes that is why i said that i dont see that problem against other communities such as skikhs, Buddhists and christian.
if that makes me bigot, racists and whatever you think..fine.
Now you are talking as if you are a great social scientist. People are not mind readers. Since when did making sweeping and boorish generalisation about a huge population based on personal experience in certain geographical area becomes ‘focused point’. You clearly didn’t say half of the things in your original post that you are saying now which would’ve made your post look a lot respectable and reasonable. But that makes me repeat my earlier point that people are not mind readers.
There’s a big difference between acknowledging the problem, introspecting and making sweeping generalizations and callously stereotyping to prove a point. People do the former all the time in PA and everywhere else in the forum, but you tend to get so hyperbolic and self destructively negative and dogmatic that it makes you look like a victim of internalized racism.
When you declare a large group of people as innately racist against certain groups, it hardly matters how loudly you emphasis that they get along fine with the one or two odd groups. It makes no different.
I don’t expect you grasp the impact of such crass generalisation, accusation and stereotyping that has on Pakistani community (especially overseas Pakistanis) that absolutely has nothing to do with such behaviour and in fact condemn it. I don't expect you to respect their position and voices. But I belong to that group, and I know how damaging such lazy and racist generalisation can be, therefore I wholeheartedly oppose such moral duplicity. There is so much to Pakistan and Pakistanis than certain bigots and racists from the Pinds of Northern Punjab.
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Come on, people. No one's got time for that. Stick to topic.
Hamas captured one of Israeli soldier. He is an enemy combatant and a prisoner of war. But western media is calling it a kidnapping.
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No it absolutely does not allow isarel to exercise its brutal policies...i have said it so many times..so many times.
but since when power has started to apply moral doctrine?
since when powerful forces have started to think about humanity? that is the harsh reality that hamas the weaker party in this conflict needs to keep in mind while makiing those strategic military moves. that is all.....
but every time you bring up this point, ...one will start questioning your loyalty to poor Palestinians and will start labeling you a Zionist.
I again repeat it...IDF is a brutal zionist force. all i want is to save poor palsnetinas from them as much as we can
If big powers are not expected to exercise and think about morality then why get so defensive and start policing people when all that outraged is rightly directed at them? Ironically, at the end of the day 'terrorist organisation' is expected to take the lead and show some morality and concern for humanity, but not big illustrious powers that brand itself as champions of human rights, custodian of civilization and in return asks the world to blindly worships them.
Truth of the matter is that Israel has every technical option to blow Hamas rockets in the air way before it enter its territory. But it choose to unleash absolute death and destruction on Gaza through heavy handed collective punishment.
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Now you are talking as if you are a great social scientist. People are not mind readers. Since when did making sweeping and boorish generalisation about a huge population based on personal experience in certain geographical area becomes ‘focused point’. You clearly didn’t say half of the things in your original post that you are saying now which would’ve made your post look a lot respectable and reasonable. But that makes me repeat my earlier point that people are not mind readers.
There’s a big difference between acknowledging the problem, introspecting and making sweeping generalizations and callously stereotyping to prove a point. People do the former all the time in PA and everywhere else in the forum, but you tend to get so hyperbolic and self destructively negative and dogmatic that it makes you look like a victim of internalized racism.
When you declare a large group of people as innately racist against certain groups, it hardly matters how loudly you emphasis that they get along fine with the one or two odd groups. It makes no different.
I don’t expect you grasp the impact of such crass generalisation, accusation and stereotyping that has on Pakistani community (especially overseas Pakistanis) that absolutely has nothing to do with such behaviour and in fact condemn it. I don't expect you to respect their position and voices. But I belong to that group, and I know how damaging such lazy and racist generalisation can be, therefore I wholeheartedly oppose such moral duplicity. There is so much to Pakistan and Pakistanis than certain bigots and racists from the Pinds of Northern Punjab.
Obviously your particular point will always be politically correct that do not generalize...I am not debating that and i wish i had the liberty of exercising "do-not-generalize" mantra in yahood and hanood case in pakistan
but in context of "hanood and yahood" especially yahood and the way we in Pakistan think about them, say things about them and do not feel even one iota bad, i stand behind my words. I repeat it, i am not making casual stereotyping on this issue, as i see it. I feel very strong about this issue in our society and i have right to have viewpoint.
I mentioned about pinds, villages and what not just to make a point that yes i am now an American Pakistani but i lived for many years in different societies in Pakistan especially in my formative years and I am not an outsider who made up his mind based on some articles.
And no..i wish it was only some bigots from pinds in nortehrn punjab but that is not the case. I challenge, go to peshawar or any NWFP village and call a pathan a yahoodi and then see his reaction. When yoiu grow up in a country, read same literature, newspapers, hang out with freinds, travel acorss the country you obviously know where most of people stand on a certain issue. That is why i said we Pakistanis adore Sikhs despite the massacre they conducted in 1947.
If i am generalizing everything then i should have called pakistaniss hating every religion but i specifically said that somehow we adore sikhs (love their jokes etc), we are ok with Christians and Buddhists but when it comes to yahood and or hanood especially yahood, we as a nation have a different level off reaction. I dont know why? why so much intensity against them? maybe because they were particularly harsh on our prophet..i dont know. I am raising this point not to malign my people but as an issue that needs to be resolved.
You have made your point and i have made mine. we shd get back to the topic.
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just heard that all US airlines have halted their operations to tel aviv for safety reasons....
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How does that help the Palestinian's misery ?
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How does that help the Palestinian's misery ?
in no way ...but obviously some indirect pressure on Israeli govt. Hope all international flights to tel aviv gets cancelled for security reason. With almost zero reaction from rest of the world to Israeli brutality, any thing will be welcomed
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No matter how many times you hear the truth or see the facts, videos like this just make it all the more real…it’s gut wrenching, heart breaking and just down right deplorable
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Big brother today declared that it is all Hamas fault. Reminds me of some here and that Israel has a right to defend itself and therefore according to big brothers logic the massacre being carried out by IDF terrorists with weapons supplied by big brother is justified even if children are being burnt alive by phosphorus bombs, but because it is Israel it is fine. pathetic to say the least.
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Corruption of American moral values and intellectual thought.
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Neighboring Arab countries should open up their doors and let them immigrate out , grant asylum.
Jordan's experience really puts them off. Jordan hosted large numbers of Palestinian refugees and let them settle in Jordan, and then 20 years later the Palestinians led by Yasser Arafat started a civil war to try and take over Jordan. If it wasn't for the brutal counter-insurgency partly planned by Zia-ul-Haq which killed thousands of Palestinians, the Jordanian government would have been overthrown.
After that, no Arab country wants to take on the risk of inviting in a large Palestinian population.
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Zia-ul-Haq par la'nat ho.
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I have noticed on net that some people questioning that why is malala silent over the violence in Gaza? I simply cant comment on it nor am i bothered about Malala .... rather i have a counter thought .... Where are all the so called jehadi organizations like al qaeda, taliban, ISIS and their off shoots ... what have they done for the people of Gaza besides saying few sugarcoated words ....
now i absolutely dont support these terrorists organizations but i want to remind the right wing in pakistan and in islamic world that how come Jammaat islami Munawar Hassan, JUM's Fazal rehman and alll these taliban and AQ supporters not questioning where are all those people who call themselves the soldiers of Islam when it comes to defending muslims from other sects ??? I have not see any rally in Pakistan asking these questions....
i dont want all these animal terrorist organizations to involve in gaza but i do want to question munawar hassan and fazl rehman this question
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And thats where we are progressing towards.. and this could be the exact reason behind this massacre.
**Israeli minister warns the country ‘will take over the whole Gaza Strip’ if necessary, ****as latest airstrikes kill 28 members of Palestinian family
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Israeli minister warns country ‘will take over whole Gaza Strip’ if necessary | Mail Online