"fun" in arrange marriages..

Arts & Culture Culture, Arts, Literature & Linguistics
141

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zig~Zag: *
So, you and me agree at the problem that these practices are untraditional. To solve them you have to change the system, educate people about many things and draw a line. Draw a line between right and wrong in our culture. You want to blame the parents for that, go ahead but I don't think that is going to solve the problem.
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I wanted to refer to some posts made on this thread by "educated" people, and you tell me how else they learned these things if not through their parents....

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Originally posted by Shak killS: *
oh punjabi kuri, I meant to say that you nick is also really coool. about aranged marriage, **most of us risk arranged marriages only and only because of parents. *
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Originally posted by punjabi kuri !!!: *
**true.....well i would only do it to make my parents happy n well if it doesnt work out later on then its their fault. *
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Originally posted by 714: *
you fall in love with whoever you fall in love with-you can't control that. **I would never marry someone my parents didn't want me to.* And who says just b/c u love someone they love u back? And who says you fall in love with people you are allowed to marry? It would depend on the situation whether or not you say somthing to your parents.
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*Originally posted by Fret Wizard: *
Good points. Also, sometimes a person who thinks that they are in "love" will only later find out after marriage that they were infatuated instead of in love, and find out that they really don't love this person.

I agree, *I would never marry someone without my parents blessings, because then I'd have this lifelong guilt inside me which I can't imagine. *

Also, I don't think I could ever let myself fall in love with someone that I wouldn't be allowed to marry. I think people have a certain amount of control in who they tend to fall in love with. It all depends on the individuals personal guidelines.
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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by 714: *
But like fret wizard said **to marry someone that they didn't approve of would cause incredible guilt. I couldn't disgrace or hurt them like that.*
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These people have education and are not living in a remote village.

The reason they think like this is because of what they have observed in their lives.

On one hand they believe that a marriage without their parents blessings can not be successful, and on the other hand they also believe that things can go wrong even if their parents blessings are there with them!

They believe that they will have a long life guilt if they marry someone with whom their parents are not pleased, but at the same time they are least bothered about their own life, their spouse's life or their children's life getting ruined because of their pleasing their parents!

They all think in this way because they know how the majority of the people think and act, and they are aware that its not possible for them to accomplish anything by themselves.

Now, what difference do you expect education to bring? Believe me, unless you stop giving unconditional support to parents (saying that "parents can never think bad about their children's life") then don't expect anything to change in our society!

Justice is the only solution, be fair, don't support parents all the time, support parents only when they are right, specially when they want to follow unIslamic family traditions only to elevate their status and please their biradri members, do not support the parents!

142

[QUOTE]
I wanted to refer to some posts made on this thread by "educated" people, and you tell me how else they learned these things if not through their parents....
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Two things:

What to think?
How to think?

These people including you and me are growing in a world where parents are teaching their children how to think?

My, yours and everyone's parent have been brought up where they have been taught what to think? Their parents were brought up like this and so on so on....

Why this change in mind?

  1. Pakistani society is going through industrilization. This effects the society just like U.S.A was effected during 1950's.

  2. Most of these kids are brought up in U.S or other western countries where industrilization is present.

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Now, what difference do you expect education to bring? Believe me, unless you stop giving unconditional support to parents (saying that "parents can never think bad about their children's life") then don't expect anything to change in our society!
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I don't think there is anycase like that. People are just the products of economic and social stability of a society. Their thinking, way of life and decision making is related to a society's position on where it stands economically and socially.

Do you think just because of the unconditional support parents' have they are performing these kinds of untraditional practices?

No! these parents don't even know that. They think it is right to do because when they were kids same things happened with them. So, whatever they say to their kids now is what they learned when they were kids from their parents.

How to break this cycle?

Only you can break this cycle by argue. When you explain your point of view and stand by it. On the other hand I think the government should take necessary steps in stoping these practices and educate people about bringing up children in the 21st century.

143

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Fraudz: *

so are you not straight anymore,
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Did I ever said that?

[quote]
in Pakistani anymore
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Nope.

144

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *

It seemed to me that you were quite shocked to know that parents actually care about money, status, respect more than they do for their children....
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Huh?

You accussed me of making assumptions, proved yourself wrong!

145

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zig~Zag: *

Two things:

What to think?
How to think?

These people including you and me are growing in a world where parents are teaching their children how to think?

My, yours and everyone's parent have been brought up where they have been taught what to think? Their parents were brought up like this and so on so on....

Why this change in mind?

  1. Pakistani society is going through industrilization. This effects the society just like U.S.A was effected during 1950's.

  2. Most of these kids are brought up in U.S or other western countries where industrilization is present.

I don't think there is anycase like that. People are just the products of economic and social stability of a society. Their thinking, way of life and decision making is related to a society's position on where it stands economically and socially.

Do you think just because of the unconditional support parents' have they are performing these kinds of untraditional practices?

No! these parents don't even know that. They think it is right to do because when they were kids same things happened with them. So, whatever they say to their kids now is what they learned when they were kids from their parents.

How to break this cycle?

Only you can break this cycle by argue. When you explain you point of view and stand by it. On the other hand I think the government should take necessary steps in stoping these practices and educate people about bringing up children in 21st century.
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If there is a difference in our upbringing and our parents upbringing, then why shouldn't there be a difference in what is good for us and what was good for our parents!

How can all that which was good for our parents can be good for us when we are brought up differently?

Yes, I do believe that parents are only able to implement their UnIslamic traditions because they enjoy unconditional support in our society.

Parents believe that if they against their family traditions, their biradri members would talk about them and they would lose their present status in their biradri, this they take it as an insult, because the biradri members would consider you important only if you do what is acceptable to them, and parents try their best to please their biradri members.

You are right about the breaking of the cycle, that one should argue, but be honest to yourself, can I alone go against my whole family? even if I did go against my family, do you think that my relationship with my family members would be the same?

Even if I am right and I have proved my point of view, most of my family members would not be able to assimilate it and would hate me and abandon me, and they would spread the news about me being the black sheep and people would believe them because most of the people are firm in their belief that "parents can never make wrong decisions for their children".

Regarding the involvement of the Government, you are right that some steps should be taken soon to eliminate these UnIslamic traditions...

146

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *
You are right about the breaking of the cycle, that one should argue, but be honest to yourself, can I alone go against my whole family? even if I did go against my family, do you think that my relationship with my family members would be the same?

Even if I am right and I have proved my point of view, most of my family members would not be able to assimilate it and would hate me and abandon me, and they would spread the news about me being the black sheep and people would believe them because most of the people are firm in their belief that "parents can never make wrong decisions for their children".

Regarding the involvement of the Government, you are right that some steps should be taken soon to eliminate these UnIslamic traditions...
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When things like that happen stand up for yourself. Don't care what people say about you. You know things will clear up that who is with you and who is against you. It is a tough time just like for example in U.S the pregnant teen issue. Even tough parents will not like it but, the government is there to help them. In Pakistan, the issue with the marriage they are not. The government is weak and poor.

147

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If there is a difference in our upbringing and our parents upbringing, then why shouldn't there be a difference in what is good for us and what was good for our parents!
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How can all that which was good for our parents can be good for us when we are brought up differently?

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As I said they don't know. The environment was what to think? Their parents say it is good they think it is good. There is big generation gap between you and your parents and in between this gap lot of stuff happend that shaped our present society.

148

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *

Huh?

You accussed me of making assumptions, proved yourself wrong!
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Incase you forgot, it is you who accused me of making assumptions!

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*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *
Did I say that? Don't make assumptions!
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Now this is an assumption!

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*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *
Maybe, your parents aren't good as mine are.

Lucky Me

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Now this is the communication we had on which you claim that I have made an assumption and I proved myself wrong....

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*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *
Yes, I know that

Did I say that? Don't make assumptions!
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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *
I asked you a question....There is a difference between assumptions and questions...
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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Pakistani Tiger: *

Don't mix apple with oranges.

Why would parents certainly stop caring less in that part of their children, where the children need them most?

..and why would parents put biradi first than their own children? For money? Status? Respect? LAMO. Undoubtly, need of education ponders.

Which Biradi do you belong to?

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *

And I responded to these questions you had asked me...

It seemed to me that you were quite shocked to know that parents actually care about money, status, respect more than they do for their children....
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I had asked you a question, so even though my question was based on certain assumptions I had after reading what you wrote, still you can't accuse me for having assumptions like yourself. You cannot differntiate between a question and an assumption, and at the same time you accuse others of having assumptions then you forget that it was you who accused me for assuming and infact you proved yourself wrong!

149

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zig~Zag: *

As I said they don't know. The environment was what to think? Their parents say it is good they think it is good. There is big generation gap between you and your parents and in between this gap lot of stuff happend that shaped our present society.
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I agree with you, but why is it that even educated people today support the parents even when they know that parents are not doing the right thing?

I mentioned the response of educated people, who know all this that you mention about generation gap and difference in upbringing, but still you hear everyone saying that "parents know what is best for their children" and that "parents can never intend to do something wrong for their children"

I am only concerned about others because I know how "the others" influence our parents!

150

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Zig~Zag: *

When things like that happen stand up for yourself. Don't care what people say about you. You know things will clear up that who is with you and who is against you. It is a tough time just like for example in U.S the pregnant teen issue. Even tough parents will not like it but, the government is there to help them. In Pakistan, the issue with the marriage they are not. The government is weak and poor.
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Marriage is the foundation of a society, isn't it true? Our government is a powerful government and it is not poor, Pakistan Army rules Pakistan and we know how much is spent on our Army in the name of "Defence", I don't want to get into this here, but the truth is that if our government wants to solve this problem, it can solve this problem, but it seems to me that they do not want to solve this problem.

They don't want people to live happily, they want people to have social problems and they don't want our society to be a strong society, since marriage is the foundation of any society and if we start having happy marriages, we shall have less conflicts and we may start thinking for Pakistan together and that is a threat to the people who are ruling Pakistan, who are selfish people!

The ruling elite wants us to have differences and hatred for each other in order for us to be busy fighting and not become an obstacle for them!

Take the Meerwala incident for instance, how many women in our society have gone through what the girl from Meerwala went through? Do you think that the Government is unaware of all the other cases? The Pakistani Police knows what goes on where, but they do not take action against the one's who are wrong most of the time, but they did take action against those who were involved in this particular case! Ever wondered why?

If the Pakistani government was weak, it wouldn't have been able to take any action against the culprits, but it was able to do so because they have the power to do so.

So let me assure you that the government is not weak, they are very powerful, its just that they do not want a happy society to exist! Its not in their interests to have a happy united strong society!

151

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *

So let me assure you that the government is not weak, they are very powerful, its just that they do not want a happy society to exist! Its not in their interests to have a happy united strong society!
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No! it is not like that Pakistan still is a 23 or 25 curropt nation of the world. There are so many problems exists that this problem comes later. Government is not strong, they have debt problem, education problem, water problem etc etc.

It is weak and it will take time for it to become strong atleast when the debt is gone.

You mentioned it is not in their interests. Then what is in their interests?

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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *

I am only concerned about others because I know how "the others" influence our parents!
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I just mentioned that they are also brought up like that. Just think of them as on the other side of the fence.

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Anyway I think the disscussion over the topic is over. Otherwise, we’ll going to start talking over the government. This is not the topic.

So, ba bye :wave: