Dr. Samr Mubarak said today that the experiment to produce gas from Coal has been successful and initially they would be producing 100MW of electricity…
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
when will production start??
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
when will production start??
Well, it is upto the govt now, project is there to be started, govt have to provide fund... and i don't know if PPP govt would be considering something like this ( development of such projects is not what is in the list of priorities Zardari got)
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
…Hence, we will miss BBQ TOO :hinna:
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^ yea........ but the thing is.......i heard from another expert..
dr.samar is bringing some new technology, which hasn't been commercialised or tested for its economic feasibility..........
the well developed,tested,and commercialised technology would be much less risky, and economically viable.........and sure about its development into a practical workable solution on large schale.
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^^ They are starting with 100MW pilot project whereas and they are calling it cheaper then what we are paying today.. ofcourse if the fuel is not the imported oil and is generated internally then yes chances are it is cheaper...
Technology can be expensive but that i one time expense, which can be depreciated over the years... the important thing is operating cost and means of operation...
When somebody like Dr. Samr says that we have successfully produced gas from the coal ( assuming he is going by his initial claim when the project started few years back, that it would be cheaper) then i have reasons to believe that yes the technology is feasible enough to go for it.
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^^^
The biggest problem of coal is the logistic cost. Being a low density commodity, it's transportation cost towards long distances can make it totally unfeasible. Thar coal reservoir is low quality coal reserve wit low energy value. This is the reason that all our cement industry in the northern parts of Pakistan uses imported coal from Indonesia or Australia.. which is more feasible after paying an inland freight for nearly 2,000 km.
The best utilization to use Thar coal can be to install power plants in the area without transporting the coal to other parts of the country. This required innovation by our scientific community to devise mode of electricity production through utilization of this huge reservoir of low quality coal. Although very little can be expected from this development in the short term, if we continue our efforts.. this resource as a huge potential to overcome our energy deficiencies.
What is really needed to exploit this resource is the participation of private sector giving them concessions.. even if the government has achieved some scientific breakthrough in their research.. Government or Dr. Samar has very limited capability/potential to put this resource to any meaningful benefit. Devising an effective policy to take benefit from these coal reservoirs would require government to ensure safety of the investors in the area.. long term guarantees which can give protection to the investors.. and enough return on investments.
Presently investors lack confidence that their interest will be sufficiently protected in the long run. What government should do is address these issues being faced by the investors.
As far as government deciding to develop the technology and set up a power plant for 100 MW is concerned.. I can assure you it will be the most expensive plant in the world.. producing most expensive electricity in the world.. or in the end will practically produce nothing but eat our tax payers money... it's just a chance/opportunity for some corrupt politicians/bureaucrats to make huge commissions for themselves..
I am not sure if the news is really that great in the end..
P.S. @hanibal
It's probably one of those days when we must disagree on everything..
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
Load Shading has again started since 3 days
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^^^
P.S. @hanibal It's probably one of those days when we must disagree on everything..
Atleast we can agree to this!!! So all is not lost after all! :)
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
I don’t know if hanibal would listen to what this guy has to say…but for others…
just foget for a moment that the guy is PTI…listen to what he has to say…
12:00 to 20:00
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
I don’t know if NomiCA likes to read anything which is not said by PTIan but for others here is something about the project:
http://www.aaj.tv/2011/12/thar-coal-project-‘successful’-dr-samar/
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
I do......... i was just pointing out another POV.......just as yazdi pointed out..........
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
Load Shading has again started since 3 days
Again started?? When did it stopped. Its a never ending torture.
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
I do......... i was just pointing out another POV.......just as yazdi pointed out..........
And i have seen same from the many So-called Experts about the Kalabagh dam
The 100 Million Barrel Diesel per annum (some what 270,000 bpd) alone is good reason to go for this project, let alone 10,000 MW of electricity, the opportunity cost, i.e., bills we are paying to rental power plants + cost of importing fuel oil + other oil-fired power generating plant.... combine it all together and see where you stand.
No technology or technical project in the world is the last word of Allah, there is always room for improvement and there is always chances that the technology once deployed/introduced will get cheaper... and this has proved true so far!!!
I would go for this project then paying heavy amount of foriegn-exchange to purchase fuel oil to run the oil-fired power plants and the would like to see the back of the oil-mafia who is being benefited from this trade.
Atleast with this, no one then can or will create hurdles for developinf hydro power base projects.
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^^^
This route being taken by the government/Dr. Samar is an experimental procedure which is not being successfully used anywhere in the world. It will be ridiculous to put all our eggs in an experimental basket. We have an immediate problem at hand which is energy deficiency which is hitting hard on our industrial economy. Industrial growth has come to a halt for past 4/5 years which has halted industrial job creation.
We are hearing these stories for last several years.. and practical position is that we did not move an inch towards the solution. Can we wait for the wheel to be reinvented in this situation.
Okay.. if the government wants to put some resources to pursue this experimental technology.. they can continue to do the experiment. 8/9 billion rupees is not a lot of money which can not be injected in this experimental R/D.
We need to be practical in addressing the energy deficiency in the country and restart the process of industrialization. We need some sure steps to be taken in short term as well long term which will not make our advancement a hostage in the hands on this energy deficiency. We need to start construction of these hydro dams, we need to inject some imported gas in our national gas distribution system, we need to immediately start construction of Iran gas line project (Turkey is already importing a lot of gas from Iran)...
This inactivity of the government to resolve the situation is costing us very dearly. Just some propaganda statements about the success of an experimental process will not resolve our problems.. this may or may not prove commercially viable in the end.. but is not enough to suggest a solution to our energy crisis..
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
^^ And i am not talking about Govt at all... my thing is related to the project only and if govt can help, well i don't know...
Had govt had an ounce of seriousness about tackling the energy crisis and providing cheap electricity to the people of Pakistan, then there was an easy way, that is support the hydel projects in Northern Areas, some what 5000-8000 MW electricity would have been installed in the system or would be only months away if govt had taken initiative in 2008... but that is not the case, and i don't see any planning on this by any other political party, i have exchanged few emails here and there and there is some encouraging answer from few but i don't know if it is going to materialize.
The govt of PPP have wasted resources of expensive RPPs and have done nothing or near to nothing to solve the crisis, i don't know what other parties have in their bag for the solution..
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
And i have seen same from the many So-called Experts about the Kalabagh dam
The 100 Million Barrel Diesel per annum (some what 270,000 bpd) alone is good reason to go for this project, let alone 10,000 MW of electricity, the opportunity cost, i.e., bills we are paying to rental power plants + cost of importing fuel oil + other oil-fired power generating plant.... combine it all together and see where you stand.
No technology or technical project in the world is the last word of Allah, there is always room for improvement and there is always chances that the technology once deployed/introduced will get cheaper... and this has proved true so far!!!
*I would go for this project then paying heavy amount of foriegn-exchange to purchase fuel oil to run the oil-fired power plants and the would like to see the back of the oil-mafia who is being benefited from this trade. * Atleast with this, no one then can or will create hurdles for developinf hydro power base projects.
the alternative wasn't about scrapping this project........but to allow conventional tried/tested and commericially viable method of exploiting the thar coal........ this project should be allowed as a test case at best...........meanwhile some 'azmooda' project needs to be started ASAP.........
I would again request you to view the specific part of the video.......... it does talk about energy plan also........
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
Koyla 100 Rs Kilo :cobra: Mairi chilam bari mahngi banay gi aab tou 
Who has promised to finish load shedding 
Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
As rightly said by Yazdi, the coal quality is low? do you know what does that mean? if i am not wrong ( and correct me if i am) the first phase for digging the coal out from is going to cost some Rs 20 Billion or more, i don’t if what is the foreign exchange loss on that, and not to mention the time duration for the same.
If we go for the conventional method then the best solution is to build coal-fired power project along the coast line of Pakistan and import coal from Indonesia or Australia because Pakistani coal is going to be more costly… and that is the very reason this project of Gasofication of coal started if you do some research on the under ground gasofication of coal you will find out that it does not require minning, thus saving you billions right there and then.
Use phrase “Underground gasofication of coal” and read about it
and no this is no way a new technology, it is almost 100 year old technology and to me it is better then burning coal and getting in violation of Kyoto protocol or govt forced to by carbon credits just for the sake of it.
I the guy in the video, he have his own theory and reasons to dig the coal out and then use it for power/energy generation, i would rather want to skip the long and lengthy process of minning/digging the coal out and actually would like to benefit from the technology…
In short, i would prefer to have a satellite to see the Crescent of Ramadan and Eid than normal naked-eye-sighting, ofcourse later is tried and tested for centuries, but it is time to go move with the technology..
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Re: Finally - Some Good News in Electricity
Good, but the time from the statement to actual production (if it happens) will not be less than a decade IMHO.