Female Liberation...

[ravage]

Re: Female Liberation…

@PyariCgudia

Ab aap aaye naa asliyat par.

nahi, ab phir bhi asliyat nahi samjhin.

I do not think so. Prime TV, when we had it, was a blatant attempt to punjab-ize everything. I think most of the people I knew from Karachi were very much annoyed at the channel and it was a joke for many. It certainly showed only one side of the story.

but this isnt just one random tv channel is it?

I knew something was off with your distinction. So you really do think that what you’re seeing on TV is the West and that the Big Bad West is ruining your country. I’m sorry, but you’re no better than the common average Pakistani. I wonder if its genetic - this habit of blaming others for their own fall?

ah, and are you genetically different from pakistanis now hm? my point pcg is, that i dont care what mechanics are involved in what gets represented as western culture. Im principally concerned with the impact it has on my society. I dont care about the western society because it isnt mine, and I dont want to be discuss ideas of whether or not american media accurately portrays american life, because i couldnt care less either way. All I care about is that this is foreign influence on us that is unhealthy for us, you guys can fix your own houses however you please.

And you’d think Pakistanis would be intelligent enough to distinguish. Even if they can’t distinguish - no one is forcing the culture down your throat at gunpoint. So media still is not a good enough excuse for behavior. Its like the argument that kids are killing other kids because they’re seeing guns being used on TV. At some point, you have to take responsibility for what is going on.

see heres why i dont care to distinguish. it is tangential to the issue of westernization in pakistan how that westernization is constructed, and whether or not it represents some guy in clayton texas. I dont care about the guy in clayton texas, he can do whatever he wants in life. What i do resent is the impact on Pakistan, and that is what I am principally concerned with. you caare about clayton guy, you go ahead and lobby for his representation.

These girls that were caught, were SENT HOME and told NOT TO ENGAGE IN LESBIAN ACTS. They were already caught kissing in the first place. I bet you that this has happened in schools before, and its just swept under the rug. People dont know how to deal with it. And if these girls were handed over to the government, the rich parents would make life a living azaab for the students. There is way too much in this story than the Western Influences you’re talking about.

The fact of the matter is, these rich girls are not given much direction (rich boys too). They’re bored. So what do they do? They steal for entertainment. They go and hold people up at gunpoint for fun. They do drugs for fun. Its an attempt to fill up some void in their lives. Many of these rich kids are suffering from depression, and many of them are flat out lonely. They want a lot of attention. So they do this to “look cool”. Its not Westernization. Its the fact that its not allowed in Islam. In their society. You see, lets take the West out of the picture and say that all countries in the world are Muslim. This incident would STILL have happened. Not because its Western. But because its simply not allowed. So when you rebel, you look to do what is not allowed. Not what is going on in America. Rape is not permitted in America or any other Western country. It still happens in Pakistan and at a high rate. Is it because of Westernization? No, its because its something they are not supposed to do.

nobody blamed the west for rape. maybe people would blame the west for Date Rape, but then that would be a different issue. you have to see that your golden shining world isnt really as golden and shiny as you think it is. The west does weild negative influence around the world, through bombs and a depraved media, whether or not all of the West agrees with it or not. You say george bush doesnt represent US? hes an elected representative, when he signs a paper, every international body in the world will recognize that america is at war with Bangladesh (should that happen). while it may be true that 80 percent of america disagrees with that decision, that doesnt change the reality on ground that someone who represents america is throwing a bomb on chittagong, and it will be, and should be, percieved as an american bomb.

likewise, it IS american media, it IS western media, it IS westernization. you feel that it is an unfair characterization? your problems then arent with the average pakistani, they’re with warner brothers.

Its not just thru TV shows bhai. Its not just thru the Internet. Almost every family has someone they know (family or friends) that has lived in Western Countries. Most rich people have visited Western countries. But they’re also exposed to their own culture - their own history. They know homosexuality exists because Islam told them not to engage in it. So by knowing something exists, does this “influence” a person? Does it make them engage in certain acts? I know about premarital sex, homosexuality, etc. I dont engage in it. And I’m not that religious to begin with.

But my upbringing has played a big factor in making me avert these activities.

very true. And that is what I principally am concerned with. regardless of how the world is around you, regardless of what is shown on tv as the west, and regardless of it being true or not, what I am principally concerned with is the upbringing of pakistanis. americans can be as evil as they want, or as saintly as they wish, I just dont care. we should not allow western culture as packaged around the world via satellite (including internet) to make us lose our heritage. so you see Im just as inward looking as you, only I dont blush when westernization is disparaged.

So who is really at fault here? Again, I say its the Pakistanis themselves.

Ravage, whine about the West all you want. Its there. And if that’s the scapegoat you want to use, go ahead. Its not going to improve anything.

as I said, you need to identify that there is a problem before you go around fixing it. you’ll never be able to defend yourself from the immoral aspects of western influence if you never identify what they are, if u never concede that they exist.