Ohioguy, there are how many Taliban troops at large???
Second i never said that americans aren't fairminded.
They are just naive.
They believe what their govt says without questioning if it is true or not.
That is just plain wrong.
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
Originally posted by CM:
** There i don’t agree.
The sites or media i have mentioned write as objectively as possible for humans.
I personally will believe something in the economist anyday even if it is covered by CNN.
I will believe the economist.
Why?
Because they print all the news, the good the bad and the ugly - ie bush.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/biggrin.gif
CNN covers what shows the US is a good light and totally ignores news like the war in the congo and stuff happening in africa.
CM,
I’ll agree that what we recieve as news is limited to what is hot today. We do not get news that is not a headline.
CM,
Entertain the possibility that the US government does what the people want, that is why the US people trust and believe in their government.
I don't know how many Taliban troops are at large, fewer than last week, and fewer than the week before and more than there will be next week.
I asked you The US has achieved none of it’s military objectives in Afghanistan so far leading to the capture of Osama Bin Laden.
Now tell me has America achieved any of it’s primary goals in Afghanistan yet?
And on November 13 you said:-
Not bad! Ask me again in another week.
Ok we got a breakthrough here.
You guys do get limited information.
And most of the time IMHO it is from the american perspective and not from the global real politik perspective.
IMHO the US media puts the US at the top and rates countries against the US.
Whichs is just stupid.
While the british newspapers look at everything from their positions within the world and specifically the region.
I personally think that is because of their colonial past.
They understand that everything can't be compared to one single unit and should be taken as seperate cases.
Ohioguy, can you really be sure they will be less?
And second you don't know.
So the guerilla war is more than likely.
And you are saying the US govt doesn't lie?
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
Malik,
Ok, fair enough. Myvoice usually does this but here goes:
Return of Western detainees: Done
Remove Taliban from power: Done, even Pakistan closes their embassy.
Capture or kill Al-Qaida leaders: Number three al-Quaida leader killed, and a number of others killed. This was acknowledged by the Taliban. Still working on the rest.
Close terrorist training camps: Done, they are now being inspected by coalition forces.
Enable more humanitarian relief: Working on it.
All told, not bad in 10 days. I find this to be acceptable progress.
[This message has been edited by Ohioguy (edited November 24, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Ohioguy (edited November 24, 2001).]
Yes tell that to your very one Scotsman.
http://www3.pak.org/gupshup/smilies/smile.gif
http://www.thescotsman.co.uk/world.cfm?id=124631
Taleban reverses coalition gains
THE Taleban army, written off in recent days after losing Kabul, yesterday struck back at the Northern Alliance forces. A battle 20 miles north of the capital left Kabul’s new rulers licking their wounds - and raised questions over whether peace talks in Germany this weekend are premature.
Fighting raged throughout the day as Northern Alliance infantry, backed by tanks and artillery, tried to seize two ridges held by the Taleban outside the town of Maidanshar. The attacks were mounted without the backing of US warplanes, which were apparently busy pounding Taleban positions around the besieged city of Kunduz.
Having grabbed one of the ridges, the alliance forces were said to have been outflanked by a force of several hundred Arab volunteers. Alliance commanders insisted their forces retreated in good order. But the reverse at Maidanshar had the same roots as the stand-off at Kunduz. Arab and Pakistani forces who retreated last week from positions north of Kabul have now turned to fight - knowing that surrender means execution - and showed that at least for the moment they are more than a match for the alliance.
The fighting drew in Tajik and Uzbek alliance fighters, their Shi’ite Muslim allies, a local former mujahideen commander and the Taleban. It was not fully clear on which side each was fighting. That raises fears of a return to the vicious feuds blamed for the destruction of Kabul and the deaths of 50,000 people there before the Taleban took control in 1996.
The clashes cut the main road linking north and south Afghanistan. The alliance has tried to persuade the Taleban to surrender Maidanshar since it captured Kabul on 13 November. Northern Alliance commanders said they planned to ask for US air strikes. “We will ask the Americans to pound Taleban positions,” a commander, Sher Alam, said.
The reality, however, is rather different. The Taleban are, on this evidence, far from being a spent force. One problem is that the alliance, like the rest of the world, has assumed the Taleban are all but beaten. Northern Alliance commanders and local residents said that further to the west of Maidanshar, Hazara fighters who had been battling the Taleban had switched sides.
The Hazaras, a Shi’ite Muslim minority said to be descended from the soldiers of Ghengis Khan, have been loosely affiliated to the Northern Alliance and have been victims of Taleban massacres in the past. But the leader of the Hazara Hezb-i-Wahdat faction, Karim Khalili, dismissed suggestions of new ethnic conflict.
Malik,
The Taliban are defeated, not only from the NA and the bombing. The war has been won by taking away in support they have. Pakistan was the last country to abandon them. Now it is a matter of time, war costs money and without it you lose. It is a matter of time and the US has both time and money not to forget support from even Pakistan during the wait.
Originally posted by Ohioguy:
[quote]
Return of Western detainees: Done
[/quote]
Was that one of America's primary war objectives? No.
[quote]
Remove Taliban from power: Done
[/quote]
Really? And which government have you put in it's place? Whose the President, Prime Minister, government ministers? Do be forthcoming.
[quote]
Capture or kill Al-Qaida leaders: Number three al-Quaida leader killed, and a number of others killed. This was acknowledged by the Taliban. Still working on the rest.
[/quote]
Please give the exact number of people you have killed or charged in relation to this?
[quote]
Enable more humanitarian relief: Working on it.
[/quote]
Really? I hear American troops are scared to go into Afghanistan to carry out this task according to British government ministers. Wonder why?
[quote]
All told, not bad in 10 days. I find this to be acceptable progress.
[/quote]
So will I have to wait another week or ten days and then ask you whether America has achieved any of its primary war aims i.e. leading to the capture of Osama Bin Laden?
[This message has been edited by Malik73 (edited November 24, 2001).]
Originally posted by Ohioguy:
**Malik,
Ok, fair enough. Myvoice usually does this but here goes:
Return of Western detainees: Done**
Not a condition for which you went to war.
That is pr gloss.
Remove Taliban from power: Done, even Pakistan closes their embassy.
Really even in Khandar?
Capture or kill Al-Qaida leaders: Number three al-Quaida leader killed, and a number of others killed. This was acknowledged by the Taliban. Still working on the rest.
link it and prove it.
No CNN is not a valid site.
Close terrorist training camps: Done, they are now being inspected by coalition forces.
Even in taliban controlled areas?
Enable more humanitarian relief: Working on it.
Yeah i bet those afghanis sure do love poptarts.
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
[quote]
Originally posted by Ex-Army:
** Malik,
The Taliban are defeated, not only from the NA and the bombing. **
[/quote]
Yet neither the American's nor their child-murdering alllies the NA have got Osama yet?
CM,
"So the guerilla war is more than likely"
No, the Taliban are blowing their opportunity for a guerilla war. They had it right for a while, disbursing the forces through the country side. But when Kundoz falls, many Taliban will either have been disarmed, switched sides, or gone. By retreating to Khandahar, and declaring that they will defend that city, they are massing forces, and make really big targets.
Guerilla warfare relies on supplies, food ammunition, hiding, and sympathetic (or terrified) civilians. I cannot forsee a time when any of the above other than hiding places are available.
Yeah they haven't gotten him yet.
And only have reached their objectives after the Taliban released the hostages.
The US did nothing.
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by Malik73:
** Yet neither the American's nor their child-murdering alllies the NA have got Osama yet?
What is the hurry? We have him hiding like a animal in a cave. We plan on being there until he comes out just like we said when we went in.
[quote]
Originally posted by Ohioguy:
**CM,
"So the guerilla war is more than likely"
No, the Taliban are blowing their opportunity for a guerilla war. They had it right for a while, disbursing the forces through the country side. But when Kundoz falls, many Taliban will either have been disarmed, switched sides, or gone. By retreating to Khandahar, and declaring that they will defend that city, they are massing forces, and make really big targets.
Guerilla warfare relies on supplies, food ammunition, hiding, and sympathetic (or terrified) civilians. I cannot forsee a time when any of the above other than hiding places are available.**
[/quote]
That is a load of BS and you know it.
If you don't know how many taliban soldiers are out there.
How can you make such an idiotic statement?
And second they fought Russia for 10 years and broke their back.
Don't worry, they can find places to hide and fight.
Just start worrying if US troops come into Afghanistan.
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
Really? Read here:-
Northern Alliance breaking apart, as Taliban begins counterattacks
[quote]
Originally posted by Ex-Army:
**
What is the hurry? We have him hiding like a animal in a cave. We plan on being there until he comes out just like we said when we went in.
**
[/quote]
Because in the meanwhile the Sears tower may come down.
Ours is not to reason why;
Ours is but to do and die
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by CM:
** That is a load of BS and you know it.
If you don't know how many taliban soldiers are out there.
How can you make such an idiotic statement?
And second they fought Russia for 10 years and broke their back.
Don't worry, they can find places to hide and fight.
Just start worrying if US troops come into Afghanistan.
We have troops there and more dropping in everyday. Remember when they fought the Russians they had money coming from us. No money no bullets, no bullets no war. They lose and they know it. We are setting up a new place on Guam for them to live I hear.
[quote]
Originally posted by Ex-Army:
**
What is the hurry? We have him hiding like a animal in a cave. We plan on being there until he comes out just like we said when we went in.
**
[/quote]
Really? Which cave? Where is that cave? When do you exactly think he will "come" out? It's been 50 days - will it be 50 more days, 6 months, a year or more?
[QUOTE]
Originally posted by Malik73:
** Really? Which cave? Where is that cave? When do you exactly think he will "come" out? It's been 50 days - will it be 50 more days, 6 months, a year or more?
The point is he has been cut off and like what is left of the Taliban is usless. We have all the time in the world to wait him out.