Ethnicities in Pakistan

You will cry and whine about people dumping on Punjabis, but you will not bother to find out why. And that will be the legacy of Pakistan. A country with so much to offer and so many hard working people, but the people never learned from their own history. They never read the truth about the 1971 war and becuase of this they were doomed to repeat their history and Pakistan will remain just a distant memory and a dream for those who lived in it.

My family migrated from India, and my mother almost didn't make it, as the Sikhs bombed one of the last trains. We came for Pakistan and equality for all in this new country, what we got was military rule and sifarish style.

During one unit, my grandfather worked in government had to move to Lahore from Karachi, only to find his previous job had been given to some locals for favour. One unit days were really the turning point for many of my grandfather's generation when they realized the blunder they had made with Pakistan. The Pakistan they wanted was reduced to nothing more but petty politics, back stabbing, and corruption. Some of the stories he told, are unbelieveable.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by StrayCatsStrut: *
Moona, what part of Pukhtuntura's explaination do you not understand? The Southern dwellers of Indian Sub Continent owe their fair complexions, if at all to Pakhtuns. The original inhabitants or dravadians were/ are black. Srilankans and Tamil are closest to Dravadians.
Punjabis and other ethnic groups with 'fair complexions' like you say probably owe their colors to Pakhtuns too because their ancestors were paid a visit by invading armies a number of times.

Rajput fury, You would be surprised to read about the similarities of Pakhtun and kashmiri people. Its a historical fact that The Afghan Kingdon of Kabul streched all the way to Kashmir and even down to Multan until aboout 175 years ago. That explains the resemblance of a lot of Kashmiri practices, traditions, their looks and other common heritage to Afghans (pakhtuns).
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I have tracked most of my families history down, I have no Pushtun blood in me, but I am fairer than many Pushtuns. Point is you can't generalize on who has Pusthun blood in them just because of their skin colour.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Imdad Ali: *
You will cry and whine about people dumping on Punjabis, but you will not bother to find out why. And that will be the legacy of Pakistan. A country with so much to offer and so many hard working people, but the people never learned from their own history. They never read the truth about the 1971 war and becuase of this they were doomed to repeat their history and Pakistan will remain just a distant memory and a dream for those who lived in it.

My family migrated from India, and my mother almost didn't make it, as the Sikhs bombed one of the last trains. We came for Pakistan and equality for all in this new country, what we got was military rule and sifarish style.

During one unit, my grandfather worked in government had to move to Lahore from Karachi, only to find his previous job had been given to some locals for favour. One unit days were really the turning point for many of my grandfather's generation when they realized the blunder they had made with Pakistan. The Pakistan they wanted was reduced to nothing more but petty politics, back stabbing, and corruption. Some of the stories he told, are unbelieveable.
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Yaar never meant to offend you. What me and Rajput fury want to drive home is that you can't pin-point one particular group of people or an ethnic community for everything. All the politicians are to be blamed for ppl's miseries cuz they don't want ppl to live amicably and peacefully. If they do, these parasites would have to close their shop of hatred. Can you name a single premier who was good for Pak ?? Not even likes of bhuttos, Mohd. Khan Junejo - they weren't punjabis !!! Poverty is everywhere in the subcontinent - India, Pak and Bangladesh. Even some punjabis are so poor that they find hard time saving themselves in harsh winter of punjab and they have nothing to do with the ethnic differences !!

Oh my God - give it up guys...can we revert back to the topic at hand which is sharing information about the various cultures found in Pakistan?

Seriously Mulz and Imdad Ali: hum bhi mauj kartey hain, tum log bhi mauj karo.

You will cry and whine about people dumping on Punjabis, but you will not bother to find out why. And that will be the legacy of Pakistan. A country with so much to offer and so many hard working people, but the people never learned from their own history. They never read the truth about the 1971 war and becuase of this they were doomed to repeat their history and Pakistan will remain just a distant memory and a dream for those who lived in it.

No ones crying or whining. Like I said before, you don't like us, then either kick us out leave..I frankly don't care. I mean theres no point in arguing with people who are racists. I still have much faith most Pakistanis to see the light and rise above this dirty game of ethnic politics. Why don't YOU read about 1971 war.. who were the leaders? Was it only Punjabis causing the mess or all Pakistanis? See unlike you I am ready to take the blame for our mistakes but the rest of you come off as high and holy.

My family migrated from India, and my mother almost didn't make it, as the Sikhs bombed one of the last trains. We came for Pakistan and equality for all in this new country, what we got was military rule and sifarish style.

I am sorry to hear the story. Sure I agree that the patronage and military government is not something that people came to Pakistan for, but unfortunately we've had bumps on the road, I still believe that we can work together in making Pakistan realize its true potential as a nation.

During one unit, my grandfather worked in government had to move to Lahore from Karachi, only to find his previous job had been given to some locals for favour. One unit days were really the turning point for many of my grandfather's generation when they realized the blunder they had made with Pakistan. The Pakistan they wanted was reduced to nothing more but petty politics, back stabbing, and corruption. Some of the stories he told, are unbelieveable.

Again I'm sorry to hear about your grandfathers experience but does that singular experience mean Punjabis = evil? I think its too simple of an explanation. Don't forget that when Pakistan was created, people from Punjab and other provinces were more backward and the migrants from India virtually ran Pakistan for the first 15 years, however as the time passed more people from the provinces became more qualified and the job ratio shifted. I'm not saying this was the case for your family but it is a historical explanation. You seem jaded and bitter, so I ask you to look at matters with a clear head not with the racism in your heart.

Mulz, who is pinpointing Punjabis only for the destruction of Pakistan? It is clear that there is a lot of blame to go around equally, but it is also clear that Punjabis dominate Pakistan, not only because they are majority of population, but also because they control the army and federal bureaucracy to a large degree.

While, many non-Punjabis have slowly realized the problem at hand and what the solution can be, in the end the Punjabis are controlling Pakistan’s fate and simply do not want to change the system and establishment. That is why the army and ISI routinely targets nationalist and progressive parties in the provinces who are working for a change and a better future. When the lotas of the army did not work, the mullahs were released on the people and now we know what the consequence of that was. What is disappointing and sad is that so many Punjabis are not speaking against the illegal rule of army, but in fact supporting it.

That is why there is a huge disparity in how smaller provinces feel about army rule, and how Punjab feels about it. I cannot expect you to understand how non-Punjabis feel about the government, just like I do not expect Americans to understand how many Muslims feel about them.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by RajputFury: *
No ones crying or whining. Like I said before, you don't like us, then either kick us out leave..I frankly don't care. I mean theres no point in arguing with people who are racists. I still have much faith most Pakistanis to see the light and rise above this dirty game of ethnic politics. Why don't YOU read about 1971 war.. who were the leaders? Was it only Punjabis causing the mess or all Pakistanis? See unlike you I am ready to take the blame for our mistakes but the rest of you come off as high and holy.
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Well we did try kicking out army in the 80's and 90's in Karachi. Ok, that is a bad example and many wrongs were committed by BOTH sides.

And I have read about 1971. The West Pakistani dictatorship was largely responsible for what happened. And guess what, many of the people of West Pakistan, especially certain province were the biggest supporters and defenders of the govnt that broke Pakistan. No, it was not only Punjabis who were in the wrong then, and it is not only Punjabis who are wrong now. There are a lot of dirty characters everywhere.

And as for having faith in Pakistan, my faith is going away day by day, but who knows what the future holds. But there are two sides to this problem, the larger issue is the government and how it treats provinces. This is the cause, the effect is when people became anti-Punjabi. In 1971, the Bengalis feeling towards West Punjab were not the cause of the civil war, but the effect from what West Pakistan was doing.

[quote]
I am sorry to hear the story. Sure I agree that the patronage and military government is not something that people came to Pakistan for, but unfortunately we've had bumps on the road, I still believe that we can work together in making Pakistan realize its true potential as a nation.
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I pray you are right, but as long military chooses not top give up power, I can't place any bets.

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Again I'm sorry to hear about your grandfathers experience but does that singular experience mean Punjabis = evil? I think its too simple of an explanation. Don't forget that when Pakistan was created, people from Punjab and other provinces were more backward and the migrants from India virtually ran Pakistan for the first 15 years, however as the time passed more people from the provinces became more qualified and the job ratio shifted. I'm not saying this was the case for your family but it is a historical explanation. You seem jaded and bitter, so I ask you to look at matters with a clear head not with the racism in your heart.
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No, of course not. Who said Punjabis are evil? Right now, I probably have more Punjabi friends then any other. All good decent people just like any other Punjabi I'm sure. But the problem is that these good decent people remain quiet over the injustice towards other ethnicities in Pakistan. Just like many mohajirs stayed quiet when Bengalis were being trampled on by the army or Sindhis stayed quiet when Balochis were being trampled on. Sooner or later it all comes back to haunt us.

As for me, being jaded, perhaps this is true, but I admit I do not have the patience of greater men than me. My grandfather came to Pakistan with his younger brother, leaving his mother and other brothers and sister behind because they did not want to leave and they could not persuade him not to leave. His family had land and had served in lucrative positions with the British govnt, and in the puppet Moghul court before. Obviously, his family did not want to ruin a good thing. But he became involved in Pakistan movement and eventually ended up in Karachi with his brother where they met up with some of their other relatives and found a house and started working for the new government of Pakistan.

Ok, I won't bore you with the whole story, but my grandfather could never even attend the funeral of his mother and brother, because he never wanted to set foot in India again. Before his death he had become disillusioned with Pakistan because of some of his experiences in govnt, but he still remained staunchly pro-Pakistan till his last. If that was because he still had hope or because of his stubbornness, I don't know.

And there is a point to this story. From perhaps being the most pro-Pakistani folks on the face of this earth, most in our family today are bitterly opposed to the army, govn't, and in some cases the concept of Pakistan itself. In fact I am perhaps the most the pro-Pakistani person in my family right now. Surely, something went wrong somewhere here, as my family's history is not unique among mohajirs or other ethnicities.

My lil' cousin was beaten brutaly by MQM goons in north Nizamabad in karachi . The poor boy had no idea why was he beaten up so badly. He had no f**** idea of whats a punjabi and whats a mohajir !! Does that mean that our family shud have started hating mohajirs ?? Imdad bhai, we can't go on cultivating and accumulating hatred like this... this time u r right though - BOTH the sides were wrong and as always, one side is NOT bad - its always both.. but u can't go on hating the world based on some isolated incidents.. see ur family didn't like India, migrated from there to Pakistan.. u don't like Pakistan and (supposedly) migrate to the US.. One or two incidents of racial discrimination by whites and u start hating whites - this can't go like this.. That damn Liaqat Ali Khan started the whole mohajir thing to secure his vote bank, we were too uneducated in '47 to start something like that.. We Punjabis have always been a peace loving community.. I am not sayin' we don't commit errors OR even blunders - we are just normal humans like u.. But we are large hearted ppl.. we don't start fight but never run away from one like cowards.. Anyways, take a chill pill now and forget everything.. May allah bless PAkistan and its ppl..

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Imdad Ali: *

Well we did try kicking out army in the 80's and 90's in Karachi. Ok, that is a bad example and many wrongs were committed by BOTH sides.

And I have read about 1971. The West Pakistani dictatorship was largely responsible for what happened. And guess what, many of the people of West Pakistan, especially certain province were the biggest supporters and defenders of the govnt that broke Pakistan. No, it was not only Punjabis who were in the wrong then, and it is not only Punjabis who are wrong now. There are a lot of dirty characters everywhere.

And as for having faith in Pakistan, my faith is going away day by day, but who knows what the future holds. But there are two sides to this problem, the larger issue is the government and how it treats provinces. This is the cause, the effect is when people became anti-Punjabi. In 1971, the Bengalis feeling towards West Punjab were not the cause of the civil war, but the effect from what West Pakistan was doing.

I pray you are right, but as long military chooses not top give up power, I can't place any bets.

No, of course not. Who said Punjabis are evil? Right now, I probably have more Punjabi friends then any other. All good decent people just like any other Punjabi I'm sure. But the problem is that these good decent people remain quiet over the injustice towards other ethnicities in Pakistan. Just like many mohajirs stayed quiet when Bengalis were being trampled on by the army or Sindhis stayed quiet when Balochis were being trampled on. Sooner or later it all comes back to haunt us.

As for me, being jaded, perhaps this is true, but I admit I do not have the patience of greater men than me. My grandfather came to Pakistan with his younger brother, leaving his mother and other brothers and sister behind because they did not want to leave and they could not persuade him not to leave. His family had land and had served in lucrative positions with the British govnt, and in the puppet Moghul court before. Obviously, his family did not want to ruin a good thing. But he became involved in Pakistan movement and eventually ended up in Karachi with his brother where they met up with some of their other relatives and found a house and started working for the new government of Pakistan.

Ok, I won't bore you with the whole story, but my grandfather could never even attend the funeral of his mother and brother, because he never wanted to set foot in India again. Before his death he had become disillusioned with Pakistan because of some of his experiences in govnt, but he still remained staunchly pro-Pakistan till his last. If that was because he still had hope or because of his stubbornness, I don't know.

And there is a point to this story. From perhaps being the most pro-Pakistani folks on the face of this earth, most in our family today are bitterly opposed to the army, govn't, and in some cases the concept of Pakistan itself. In fact I am perhaps the most the pro-Pakistani person in my family right now. Surely, something went wrong somewhere here, as my family's history is not unique among mohajirs or other ethnicities.
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[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by PyariCgudia: *
Oh my God - give it up guys...can we revert back to the topic at hand which is sharing information about the various cultures found in Pakistan?

Seriously Mulz and Imdad Ali: hum bhi mauj kartey hain, tum log bhi mauj karo.
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I never started it !!! Aap nahin jaanti ki mujhey kitni taqleef hoti hai jab hum tamaam Pakistani Jaaheelon ki tarah ladtey hain !! Aap hi faisla karo ki punjabis are so bad that every other community in Pak shud hate them freely and furiously.. meaning even my poor dadajaan is also bad cuz he was born a punjabi !?? Had I known "punjabi" is the most hated word I would have never opted to be one !! Believe me, After I came to the US, I forgot my ol' violent days and decide I will never hurt any1 anymore. I have had enough pain in life.. I crack jokes to make others happy.. I want to give happiness to others.. I have of lot pain in my heart but ppl. just compund it always instead of giving a healing touch.. Imdad praa tells his friends are punjabis.. does he talk to em like this ?? As a simple LAhori, am i responsible for what Army/govt. does ??? I guess even Pakistanis have become stone-hearted...

Guys aap loag larna shuru ho gayay ho :frowning:

I’m a Punjabi who grew up mostly in Karachi. i have seen arguments like this many times, please relax and try to overcome the hatred in your hearts. Think, we should have love for all Muslims in our hearts. Hatred is never good.

Sub se pehle we are MUSALMAN then PAKISTANI aur maheena bhee Ramzan ka hae. Maybe Allah wanted you (Imdad and mulz) to talk to each other so that once and for all you could see each others points of views and become friends :k:

Now please, dono bhai dilon se nafratein mitayein, haath milayein aur galay milen :k: remember the example of muhajreen and ansar in Hazoor(SAW)'s time…we are all Muslims and one ummah :k:

  • fakat, dadi amma :slight_smile:

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
My lil' cousin was beaten brutaly by MQM goons in north Nizamabad in karachi . The poor boy had no idea why was he beaten up so badly. He had no f
*** idea of whats a punjabi and whats a mohajir !! Does that mean that our family shud have started hating mohajirs ?? Imdad bhai, we can't go on cultivating and accumulating hatred like this... this time u r right though - BOTH the sides were wrong and as always, one side is NOT bad - its always both.. but u can't go on hating the world based on some isolated incidents.. see ur family didn't like India, migrated from there to Pakistan.. u don't like Pakistan and (supposedly) migrate to the US.. One or two incidents of racial discrimination by whites and u start hating whites - this can't go like this.. That damn Liaqat Ali Khan started the whole mohajir thing to secure his vote bank, we were too uneducated in '47 to start something like that.. We Punjabis have always been a peace loving community.. I am not sayin' we don't commit errors OR even blunders - we are just normal humans like u.. But we are large hearted ppl.. we don't start fight but never run away from one like cowards.. Anyways, take a chill pill now and forget everything.. May allah bless PAkistan and its ppl..

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Yes, I can also tell you stories of what Rangers and Army did to young men who looked mohajir.

But enough of that. Everyone makes blunders, can't deny that, but some people choose to repeat the same mistake. May Allah bless Pakistan and its people.

I have this impression that urdudans don't like punjabis.

*And I have read about 1971. The West Pakistani dictatorship was largely responsible for what happened. And guess what, many of the people of West Pakistan, especially certain province were the biggest supporters and defenders of the govnt that broke Pakistan. No, it was not only Punjabis who were in the wrong then, and it is not only Punjabis who are wrong now. There are a lot of dirty characters everywhere. *

Yes Punjabis were the supporters of the government, but lets put it perspective, Punjab has supported just about every government in power. The last time Punjab province rebelled was against Yahya Khan, after the 1971 war when pretty much all of Pakistan was in disarray. Since then Punjabis have supported every government in power from ZAB to the present. I don't want to get petty in this racial politics but after the Bangladesh debacle, we were about to lose Baluchistan in rebellion as well because ZAB used extreme military force with cooperation with Iran, it was Zia-ul-Haq who cooled the things down by freeing the leaders, offering general amnesty etc., Don't get me wrong, I hate many of Zia's policies but this one I fully support. As for your latter statements, I agree that bad people are everywhere and I'm glad to see you acknowledge this fact.

And as for having faith in Pakistan, my faith is going away day by day, but who knows what the future holds. But there are two sides to this problem, the larger issue is the government and how it treats provinces. This is the cause, the effect is when people became anti-Punjabi. In 1971, the Bengalis feeling towards West Punjab were not the cause of the civil war, but the effect from what West Pakistan was doing.

No I think you right, we should make changes for the distribution of resources and revenues from the federal level. There can be things done to make sure Sindh and Baluchistan are being developed than Punjab. I think that you should hold on to your faith in Pakistan, work with us to make things better. I don't know about other Punjabis, but there are 2 Punjabis (mulz and I) right here hoping to discuss the issues you and to solve any misgivings. Let's not play the blame game, E.Pakistanis blamed West Pakistans, theyre gone..Now the remaining West Pakistanis blame Punjab..whose next?

No, of course not. Who said Punjabis are evil? Right now, I probably have more Punjabi friends then any other. All good decent people just like any other Punjabi I'm sure. But the problem is that these good decent people remain quiet over the injustice towards other ethnicities in Pakistan. Just like many mohajirs stayed quiet when Bengalis were being trampled on by the army or Sindhis stayed quiet when Balochis were being trampled on. Sooner or later it all comes back to haunt us.

Hey I agree! I don't want ANY Pakistani to feel bad about his/her country or to think that unfair treatment is justified. Look, Punjabis are a slim majority in Pakistan so I'm sure there may be p;lenty of examples where unfair treatment may have been given, but I am talking about the AVERAGE Punjabi, he or she doesn't have anything to do with all of that mess..you should visit Punjab and TALK to simple folk there, I can assure you that your views will change.

As for me, being jaded, perhaps this is true, but I admit I do not have the patience of greater men than me. My grandfather came to Pakistan with his younger brother, leaving his mother and other brothers and sister behind because they did not want to leave and they could not persuade him not to leave. His family had land and had served in lucrative positions with the British govnt, and in the puppet Moghul court before. Obviously, his family did not want to ruin a good thing. But he became involved in Pakistan movement and eventually ended up in Karachi with his brother where they met up with some of their other relatives and found a house and started working for the new government of Pakistan.

Again, I cannot comment on your family situation as their experiences might actually justify their views. What I can say for YOU is that, you still have plenty of time in your life to see a better Pakistan, why not work to better it?

And there is a point to this story. From perhaps being the most pro-Pakistani folks on the face of this earth, most in our family today are bitterly opposed to the army, govn't, and in some cases the concept of Pakistan itself. In fact I am perhaps the most the pro-Pakistani person in my family right now. Surely, something went wrong somewhere here, as my family's history is not unique among mohajirs or other ethnicities.

I do believe that something did go wrong. No offense but it entirely sad to say that your the most pro-Pakistani person in your family. I can tell you from my experiences and insights in Punjab, the Army and culture that we don't hate urdu-speakers, in fact most of us respect them for their part in the Pakistan movement and the early years. Don't forget that we were the only province to take on Urdu without protest (Unlike Sindh, E.Pakistan). I really do hope that you can discuss your concerns because as a very, very, very patriotic Pakistani, I don't want you to continue to harbor any negative feelings.

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Imdad Ali: *
Yes, I can also tell you stories of what Rangers and Army did to young men who looked mohajir.

But enough of that. Everyone makes blunders, can't deny that, but some people choose to repeat the same mistake. May Allah bless Pakistan and its people.
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Did Army and Rangers represent whole of Punjab or even a typical/average punjabi ?? The point is any1 who is in power tries to misuse it.. ppl who cam from India as migrants (mohajir) were the most educated, most liberal of the ethnic communities that shaped Pak in the initial years. Without offending you, ( I really don't know u will admit it or not) I can tell you that there were instances in '47-48 where the officers in Sindh (almost surely a mohajir), who used to allot land to the fellow migrants in exchange of what they lost in India as due to riots/migration used to allot them bungalows or huge amount of land knowing the person was actually lying about his erstwhile assets in pre-partition India just cuz locals were too innocent to take note of any fishy deals like that !!! Didn't they misuse power then ?? In no terms am I justfying brutals acts of rangers/army - they are deplorable in strongest terms !!! What me and Rajputfury are tryin' to say is forget differences and let us pray better ppl rule and take forware our PAkistan !! I am feel sad about every1 who was victim of injustice and/or prejudice... But let us pray to god incidents like that don't repeat in future...

Yaar RF, no need wasting ur time and energies some futile exercise of convincing a tuf individual !!! Shayad Imdad bhai ko yeh pataa nahin ki har mulk, mazhab, aur qaum mein achhey-burey log hotey hain. If some incidents of prejudice or unruly behavior can change somebody, then unka to allah hi maalik hai !!

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
Yaar never meant to offend you. What me and Rajput fury want to drive home is that **you can't pin-point one particular group of people or an ethnic community for everything. *

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Why not?

If you can pin-point one particular group of people or an ethnic community for:

[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
**we punjabis
* don't like mistrust and double-speak.. thats why we are mistaken and times.. In Karachi we have proved we can excel and perform...
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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
I was there in Bahadurabad, Karachi for a long time.. and I was a sher there.. even mohajir girls were mad at my gora looks putter.. **u see, punjabis rulz
*.
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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
**I am punjabi sher.. and let any1 say dare bout punjabi and I will show him/her what a punjabi means !! I AM SO PROUD OF PUNJABI AND PUNJABIYAT THAT I AM IN LOVE WITH IT !!!
* ppl in America ask me how ask me how come I am so good-looking and I tell 'em all punjabis are that way !!!
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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
**I am a punjabi and I am proud of the fact !!! *

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[QUOTE]
Originally posted by mulz: *
Esp. **we punjabis join the army
* to fight and are ready to sacrifice our life for the nation. We are the hardest working farmers of Pakistan - ** Punjab is the bread basket for whole Pakistan.** This way, we save lives and feed all fellow pakistanis. We punjabis are large-hearted and don't take these mindless thrashings just like that..

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When every Punjabi wants to take credit for everything good that any other Punjabi does, why can't every Punjabi then take credit for everything bad that any other Punjabi does?

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *

Why not?
If you can pin-point one particular group of people or an ethnic community for:
When every Punjabi wants to take credit for everything good that any other Punjabi does, why can't every Punjabi then take credit for everything bad that any other Punjabi does?
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Well, every group does it !!! Check out ur knowledge on non-punjabis. It is just ones identity and background that one feels proud about and I don't think there is anything wrong with it. I remember in my school days, my mohajir friends used to tell us to become a cricketer like Miandad and Rashid Latif. Why not Imran Khan or Wasim Akram ?? Mohajirs cheered when Mushy boy - a mohajir became so called CEO of Pakistan. I guess progressed most under Ayub Khan and Zia, if you take note our economic growth in past years. It is just that, if we punjabis commit a small mistake, there is lot of hullah and when a mohajir does it, it is for his/her defence !!! Well, even lot of Punjabis came from Indian Punjab at least we don't keep going to meet our relatives.. now u know whoz better.. As the majority community, don't test our patience !!

[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by Different: *
When every Punjabi wants to take credit for everything good that any other Punjabi does, why can't every Punjabi then take credit for everything bad that any other Punjabi does?
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First of all ALL peope in every ethnic group like to be proud of what their brethern did. Likewise, I and many others have a lot of PRIDE in who we are, now that doesn't mean that we think we're the best group out of Pakistan or better than group X. Scondly, the negative things that Punjabis do, are individual choice and of course we're not proud of them.

I think many Pakistanis like to blame Punjanb for many of their own failures and this constant blame will eventually wear thin on most people. It's obvious that when people have nothing constructive to add, they resort playing the blame game. I know you have commented in past where Punjab only=Pakistan, well you and your racist cohorts are slowly making it a reality.

Punjabi kuri=moona :blush:
and dang proud of it!

:k:

and punjabi munda=mulz.. kya ittefaq hai !!