Drone Strike threads - Merged!

Re: Drones killed 67 civilians in five years: Claims the Government

Br. PD...this thread is about the numbers and it's effect. if you discount this then there is nothing to talk about...these numbers are provided by Ministry of Defense and who holds this ministry? N$ does and he went to the states on this premise that drone strikes kill civilians and hence are counter productive.

to be honest, Nawaz Shareef himself ruined the case against drones strikes which is an attack on Pak's sovereignty. the fact is that the govt is in it with states...they have secret deals which they do not accept although it's so obvious.

if the PM betrays his countrymen, who is gonna protect their interests?

Re: Drones killed 67 civilians in five years: Claims the Government

thanx for the info, bro.

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

Wait so the occur in the rest of the world with the approval of these countries? Its amazing how many of you believe the US government after it continually lies about its activities.

I bet you all believed Davis is innocent to this day. Or that the US doesn't spy world leaders. Talk about an inferiority complex.

So if they could end tomorrow, why doesn't the US end them eh? Every political party has said we want them ended in the press, interviews and in rallies. So why hasn't the US ended them?

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

it is like thief is saying i will not steal some thing if you close the door. it is easier to close door then expect habitual thief to stop stealing things.

We all know how these politicians have double faces, some thing they say about policy in public and the opposite they actualy do. lets get our house in order then we can stop these so called drone savages from killing people on our soil.

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

Here is the question. Why do you all believe the US politicians more than the Pakistani ones? After all both have lied openly about the Drone programme. More so the US has lied consistently about activities in Pakistan and used its own media to push these lies as facts.

If the US used the NYT and WP to lie about Davis what makes you think they are being honest now?

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

haathi ke daant dikhaanay ke aur khaanay ke aur

Politicians (rulers) are known to give a statement for public consumption but write a different agreement with other stakeholders.

Re: Drone strikes

[NOTE]Drone threads merged[/NOTE]

Re: Drone strikes

Pakistani family of drone strike victim gives harrowing testimony to Congress | World news | theguardian.com

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

And that doesn't apply to the US? Talk about double standards.

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

It is fact that drone strike can stop tomorrow if Pakistan government wants to. Anyhow, this stoppage won’t happen just by telling Americans to stop drone strikes.

The way Pakistan government can make drone strikes stop is by giving assurance to Americans that no insurgents can use Pakistani lands as refuge, from where they can cross border to hit Americans (and Afghans) in Afghanistan and return.

That means, to stop drone strikes, Pakistan will have to offer an alternative and that would be Pakistan armed forces entering tribal areas against Afghan insurgents (and Pakistani terrorists) with full force, kill or arrest them, and take control of the border crossing, making sure that no unwanted elements cross border (something Americans would like too, better than drone strikes).

Unfortunately, giving that assurance to Americans and acting on that assurance, would stop drone strikes but Pakistan army entering tribal areas to kill or arrest afghan insurgents (and Pakistani terrorists) would cause lot of casualties to Pakistan army as well as innocent civilians living in the area. Such action with low technology Pakistan possesses means, to do the job effectively constraining own body counts, Pakistani forces would use indiscriminate bombings of the area both with heavy guns and air-force bombers.

Since Pakistani politicians as well as army thinks that effective action of Pakistan in tribal areas would be more problematic and costly in life of armed forces as well as civilians of the area, than letting drone strikes to continue, government as well as army considers American drone strikes as better option.

If anyone thinks that drone strikes should stop and Pakistan army try to take control of the area with full military force, regardless of number of civilians and military casualties (that would be huge if Pakistan army would act forcefully), then it is fine, else drone strike is better option.

Anyhow, one thing cannot happen (very unlikely), that is, drone strikes stop and Pakistan army do not act in tribal area with full force, letting Pakistani land getting used as refuge by people fighting war in Afghanistan.

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

Whats the big deal.

Pakistan was run by karifoon.
Now pakistan is taken over by munafiqoon.

All those block heads who were like "let the new elected govt a chance"
Chance my #$## , same F-n janga same lies.....

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

**This is acceptance of effectiveness of drone strikes against “maut ke saudagar”. Ministry of Defence should also publish the number of innocent people were killed by these monsters, I am sure that will be multiple of 67 integer.
**

2,160 terrorists,67 civilians killed by drones - DAWN.COM

ISLAMABAD, Oct 30: The Ministry of Defence claimed on Wednesday that US drone attacks over the past five years had resulted in 67 non-combatant deaths, while 2,160 terrorists were killed by the much-criticised America’s weapon of choice against terrorism.

Importantly, the defence ministry said in a written statement in Senate that the collateral damage caused by the drone strikes had reduced to nil since 2012.

It is the first time that the so far jealously guarded date has been officially released by the government. The statement by the defence ministry came in response to a question submitted by PML-N lawmaker Senator Nisar Mohammad in February this year.

The release of the data follows intense criticism of the US drone war by human rights activists.

The Amnesty International had in its report said the strikes amounted to war crimes because some of them killed people who posed no threat to the US national security interests.

UN Special Rapporteur Ben Emmerson in his annual report submitted to the General Assembly in September had raised the issue of civilian casualties caused by America’s lethal extra-territorial counter-terrorism operation and had asked Washington to make public the information on collateral damage.

The critics of drone attacks had relied on the narrative that it killed thousands of civilians and consequently fomented extremism in the country.

Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, who last week met President Obama, made the drone attacks a central point of his meeting agenda.

Secret CIA and diplomatic memos leaked to media after the criticism of drone programme suggested that the Pakistan government had been on board with regard to drone attacks at least over the four-year period from 2007-11.

The figures presented in Senate contradicted the numbers shared by the government with UN Rapporteur Emmerson, who had been told by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs in March this year that of the 2,200 people killed by drones the government could confirm that at least 400 were civilians, and another 200 were likely non-combatants.

The figure of hundreds of civilians having been killed by drones, Emmerson was then told, was an “underestimate”.

The defence ministry’s statement corroborates US stance that drones are the most effective way of targeting terrorists with minimal collateral damage.

President Obama had in his policy speech on counter-terrorism in May had said that he was making the drone campaign more transparent and accountable and that the frequency of strikes would decrease with 2014 drawing closer.

The figures provided by the defence ministry confirmed that the strikes by drones were down to 14 this year against peak of 115 in 2010. The US carried out 34 strikes in 2008, 47 in 2009, 115 in 2010, 62 in 2011, 45 in 2012 and 14 in 2013.

Of the 2,160 terrorists killed so far by drones, 283 were eliminated in 2008, 451 in 2009, 751 in 2010, 356 in 2011, 235 in 2012 and 84 in 2013.

Drones are known to have got rid of some top high-profile targets including Mullah Sangeen Zadran, deputy operational commander of the Haqqani Network; Waliur Rehman, the deputy emir of TTP; Mullah Nazir, who led the TTP in South Waziristan; Hassan Gul, the one-time Osama bin Laden emissary to Abu Musab al Zarqawi; Abu Yahya al Libi, who served as Al Qaeda’s chief of staff; Abu Usman Adil, leader of the Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan; Badr Mansoor, Al Qaeda leader in Pakistan; Senior Al Qaeda leaders Abu Miqdad al Masri, Abd al Rahman al Yemeni, Atiyah Abd al Rahman, Ilyas Kashmiri, Baitullah Mehsud, during this period, just to name a few.

Non-combatant casualties occurred in 2008 (21), 2009 (09), 2010 (02), and 2011(35). Since then, the defence ministry said no civilian has been killed in drone attacks hinting to an increase in precision of the pilotless aircraft.

But, there are doubts that this disclosure would result in immediate shift in policy that for long time promoted anti-drone sentiments due to domestic political compulsions.

Information Minister Pervaiz Rashid told reporters that the government had not changed its tack on drones and continues to be hopeful of getting them stopped.

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

justifying drone kills by bringing up kills by xyz (to this day we have no clue)... typical cowardice mentality. maut kay saudegar... lol what is it with people around this corner, some have fascination with the word kharjees and some...

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

These 'maut ke saudagar' are supported by India and Afghanistan to unleash hell on Pakistan. Why do you want to support these monsters?

Re: “Strong evidence” Pakistan military approved US drone strikes: UN report

When did I say it doesn't apply to US... chor ki darhi mai tinka?

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

**Second drone attack after PM’s ‘successful’ visit to US
**
PESHAWAR: A US drone fired missiles at a residential compound in Pakistan’s northwestern tribal region near Afghan border, ,killing at least four people, sources said on Friday.

The sources said that the attack took place in Danday Darpa Khel near Miranshah, main town of North Waziristan Agency.

They said that locals were trying to retrieve dead and injured from the debris of the house. Identities of the dead and injured were yet to be known.

It was the second drone attack since Prime Minster Nawaz Sharif paid a visit to the United States, where he demanded US President Barack Obama to stop the attacks.

Pakistan has long been opposing CIA-operated drone attacks in the tribal region dubbing them as violation if its territorial integrity.

Source

Looks like Sharif told Obama to stop drones in Urdu which the latter didn’t understand. Friday’s raid was second in less than a week of Sharif’s much-hyped White House yatra.

We certainly need to redefine what ‘highly successful’ means.

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

looks like the language mix up, Amal.

N$ said, "soon you will see the results of my talk with Obamma!"

sure, we are seeing the effects!...2 strikes in 2 days! great job Ganjoo PaTel!

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

some big wig seems to be killed in today's drone strike.

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

http://i1.tribune.com.pk/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/625224-cartoonsabirstnovemer-1383236193-300-640x480.JPG

Re: Drone Strike threads - Merged!

Silent, fearful support for US drones in tribal Pakistan | PAKISTAN - geo.tv

PESHAWAR: While the Pakistani government routinely denounces US drone strikes, locals say that a sizeable number of people in the country’s tribal areas support them – but the threat of Taliban reprisals makes them too terrified to speak out.

Pakistan’s lawless tribal areas along the Afghan border have borne the brunt of the US drone campaign since 2004, with hundreds of missile strikes targeting suspected Al-Qaeda and Taliban militants.

Islamabad condemns them as a violation of sovereignty and counterproductive to efforts to combat militancy, while rights campaigners – and the Pakistani public – rail against them for killing civilians.

Anyone who does speak out in favour of the drones in the tribal areas runs the risk of being kidnapped, tortured and murdered by militants – their agonising last moments captured on camera. “Anybody who supports drone strikes, they will try to kill him. They will say that person is pro-American, a friend of the Jews,” Gul Wali Wazir – not his real name – from South Waziristan tribal area told AFP.

"They will cut his throat or shoot him, they will film his false confession, kill him and leave the body on the road with a DVD and a note saying that anybody who supports America and drones will face the same fate.

“I have seen a dozen such dead bodies.” “US spies” are targeted by a special militant unit, the Ittehad-e-Mujahideen Khorasan, and grisly DVDs of their last moments distributed. In one seen by AFP, a young man to admits planting a bugging chip in a car in return for $200.

After a decade of the CIA-run programme, no region in the world has been hit by more strikes than Pakistan’s tribal areas – a rugged, dirt-poor region roughly the size of Belgium.

Ten days ago, one of the remote-controlled missiles eliminated the feared Hakimullah Mehsud, leader of the Pakistani Taliban.

The area is off-limits to foreign journalists and aid groups, so the precise number and identity of those killed by drones is difficult to establish with certainty.

The London-based Bureau of Investigative Journalism estimates that between

2,528 and 3,644 people have been killed in 378 drone strikes in Pakistan, including 416-948 civilians.

A survey by the New America Foundation in 2010 found that a sizeable proportion of people – more than one in five – in the tribal areas backed drone strikes, and a number of experts interviewed by AFP spoke of an increasing trend to support them.

The Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) became a stronghold for hundreds of Taliban and Al-Qaeda-linked extremists who fled Afghanistan to regroup and launch cross-border attacks after the US-led invasion in 2001.

Tribal chiefs initially welcomed them, but since 2009 they have grown weary of the “taxes” the militants impose and the insecurity they bring, and angry at them for killing elders who opposed their presence.

Safdar Hayat Khan Dawar, former head of the Tribal Union of Journalists, from North Waziristan, the area most affected by drone strikes, said the missiles were the preferred solution to the problem of militancy.

“There are two options in FATA: a military operation or the drone strikes,” he said in an interview in Peshawar. “The military option, people hate it because the army don’t kill militants but civilians. So if you ask people to choose, they will choose drone attacks.”

In 2009 the army carried out a major ground operation to retake control of South Waziristan from the militants, with more than 30,000 troops pouring in for an offensive.

The UN said more than 200,000 people were forced from their homes by the fighting.

“Those people who became IDPs (internally displaced) due to the military operation, those people who are victimised by the Taliban and the militants, all the families whose family members are beheaded because they were accused of spying for America – why would they oppose drone attacks?” said Nizam Dawar, director of the Tribal Development Network.

Dawar’s own family in North Waziristan recently had a visit from militants after he spoke of his support for drones.

For drone supporters, tribal leaders sheltering militants only have themselves to blame if their families are killed by the American strikes. “We think this is due to their own negligence. The responsibility lies with the people who offer these terrorists a shelter,” said Arbab Mujeed ur-Rehman of the Pakhtunkhwa Milli Awami Party. “A person who is not involved in terrorist activity does not feel threatened by the drones.”

In the markets of the tribal areas, militants hand out leaflets urging people to denounce “traitors” in their families, heightening the climate of suspicion in a region already awash with conspiracy theories.