Drone Strike threads - Merged!

Very interesting news.

Drones over Pakistan: Drop the pilot | The Economist

NATIONAL surveys find that Pakistanis are overwhelmingly opposed to CIA drone strikes against suspected militants in the tribal badlands close to the Afghan border. The strikes are seen by many as an abuse of sovereignty, a symbol of American arrogance and the cause of civilian deaths. So when Sofia Khan, a school administrator from Islamabad, travelled with hundreds of anti-drone campaigners to a ramshackle town bordering the restive Federally Administered Tribal Areas (FATA) last October she was stunned by what some tribesmen there had to say.

One man from South Waziristan heatedly told her that he and his family approved of the remote-controlled aircraft and wanted more of them patrolling the skies above his home. Access to the tribal regions is very difficult for foreign journalists; but several specialists and researchers on the region, who did not want to be identified, say there is at least a sizeable minority in FATA who share that view.

Surveys are also notoriously difficult to carry out in FATA. A 2009 poll in three of the tribal agencies found 52% of respondents believed drone strikes were accurate and 60% said they weakened militant groups. Other surveys have found much lower percentages in favour. But interviews by The Economist with twenty residents of the tribal areas confirmed that many see individual drone strikes as preferable to the artillery barrages of the Pakistani military. They also insisted that the drones do not kill many civilians—a view starkly at odds with mainstream Pakistani opinion. “No one dares tell the real picture,” says an elder from North Waziristan. “Drone attacks are killing the militants who are killing innocent people.”

American claims about the accuracy of its drone attacks are hard to verify. The best estimate is provided by monitoring organisations that track drone attacks through media reports, an inexact method in a region where militants block access to strike sites. However, the most thorough survey, by the Bureau of Investigative Journalism, suggests a fall in civilian casualties, with most news sources claiming no civilians killed this year despite 22 known strikes.

Though there is ample evidence that the Pakistani government has given its secret blessing to the CIA programme, it still allows anti-drone sentiment to blossom. Domestic anger over drones can be a useful negotiating chip on other issues, says one former American official. The government also fears reprisals from militants.

Supporters of the drones in Pakistan’s media are even more reluctant to speak frankly. Many commentators admit to approving of drones in the absence of government moves to clear terrorist sanctuaries. But they dare not say so in print.

In 2010 a group of politicians and NGOs published a “Peshawar Declaration” in support of drones. Life soon became difficult for the signatories. “If anyone speaks out they will be eliminated,” says Said Alam Mehsud, one of the organisers, who was forced to leave Pakistan for a time.

As for Ms Khan, she has had a partial rethink. “I still want the drones to end,” she says. “But if my government wants to do something they should do it themselves, without foreign help.”

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

The local people call drones ababeels.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

^^^ It seems like national narratives are being driven by right wing politicians and the media....locals pref ababeels over tank shells flattening their villages.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Take it with a truck load of salt :hehe:

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Read with this. Drones are better that gunship helicopters (if they are conducted by Pakistan itself) but no one has marketed it properly.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Yes 20 residents are the vast majority. :rolleyes:

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

:rotfl: sampling error

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Drones a night mare for rates they think months to move from one hole to another.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

How do you know only 20 residents replied? Is this mentioned into the article?
ask any khariji Taliban, he will tell that he is not afraid of Pak govt, military, judiciary, or Imran khan. He only fears drone strikes.
By stopping the most effective tool to eliminate enemies of Pakistan, people play right in the hands of Pakistan’s enemies. This is a point to ponder for those who care for Pakistan. Otherwise no argument can convince a disguised Taliban lover.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

surprising number of Pakistanis whose homes are saved for the time being :chai:

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

My village is close to waziristan and large number of wazirs have settled in my area so i have lot of interaction them. Its not that they cheer for drone strikes but they prefer them over F-16 bombardments and artillery shelling on their villages which always cause large collateral damages. Drones are very precise and are not that destructive to annihilate the village. It usually destroys a room or two or a vehicle. The Info of the location of militants is itself provided by local spies who attach the chip to house or vehicle of the militant. Drone then responds to that chip.

Pakistani air strikes , artillery shelling, mortars and gunship helicopters are messy and always cause huge collateral damages. If check post of pak army is attacked by taliban and some of them are killed, then after attack they start firing mortars on the civilian population in revenge. many unfortunate incidents take place in FATA on daily basis which are not reported due to lack of access of media to the region.

South waziristan is peaceful as its waziri portion is under pro-government taliban and mehsud portion is depopulated since 2009. Its North waziristan which is paralyzed by continuous curfews, continuous attacks on military conveys and check posts and by retaliatory shelling of pak army on villages. locals hold pak army for frequency of drone strikes as mostly ISI-sponsored haqqani netwrok militants are targated in miranshah , mir ali and other areas by drones. The funny thing is that headquarters of haqqani network is just infront of FC fort (where pak army is stationed) in miranshah bazaar.
TTP is also based in north waziristan and its here where most of the pak army soldiers are attacked. It has become the most dangerous area in pakistan as other than TTP, there are dozen other groups. Milkitary operation should have been carried out in north waziristan, but pak army has always refused to do so due to haqqani network. Interestingly haqqani netwok has more foreign militants under its wings and like TTP they also have suicide bombers.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Also read this:

"Surveys are also notoriously difficult to carry out in FATA. "

Why would Taliban allow any survey in the areas totally under their control?
their job is already being done effectively by taliban apologists in Pakistan.

if the writer wants to tell a lie then he would not have quoted the number 20 at all.


those who oppose drone strikes due to pashtun nastionlism are bigger enemies of Pashtuns.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

There are many surveys telling different picture. 20 is not be taken as surprising number statistically. :)

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Actually, it makes no sense why people would be against drones unless they are Kharjee terrorists, sympathiser of these Kharjee terrorists or gullible under the influence of Kharjee sympathisers in media and politics fooling them.

Just imagine … all sorts of propaganda from Kharjee sympathisers in media and politics is hitting Pakistanis… who are undermining the realities and lie about the facts. For instance:

Propaganda: Drones over Pakistani territory and drone attacks are violating and undermining Pakistani sovereignty.
Fact: Drones over Pakistani territory and drone attacks are neither violating nor undermining Pakistani sovereignty … as violation or undermining a country’s sovereignty happens if something happen without consent of that country’s government. Drone flying over Pakistani territory and drone attacks are happening with consent of Pakistan government and Pakistan army, so no violation.

Propaganda: Pakistan is fighting war of America.
Fact: A country (and its army) cannot fight a war of any other country within its own border against armed opponents.

[Actually, Pakistan army is fighting terrorists violating and undermining Pakistani sovereignty, waging war against Pakistan, killing Pakistani innocent as well as eminent civilians, government functionaries, army personals, politicians who oppose them and their terrorism, etc. These terrorists are also blowing schools, mosques, madrassas, religious and political gatherings, army buildings, bases of all 3 Pakistan armed forces, etc. … Hence Pakistan army is not fighting war for any other country but fighting war to save Pakistan from these Kharjees].

Propaganda: Taliban and outfits partnering Taliban are Muslim warriors who are doing Jihad.
Fact: Taliban and outfits partnering Taliban are Kharjees (dogs of hell) who are creating Fitna and doing Fasad, in Pakistan and other Muslim world, and it is duty of Muslims to fight and send them to hell.

Propaganda: Pakistan army war with Kharjee terrorists is not our (Pakistani) war.
Fact: Pakistan is fighting a war of survival with Kharjees, and if (khuda-na-Khasta) Pakistan army loses then Pakistan would get occupied by Kharjee terrorists, and that would not be American loss but loss of Pakistan and Pakistanis who are not Kharjee, Kharjee sympathiser, or Kharjee supporter, and thus this war for Pakistan against Kharjee terrorists is essential for Pakistani survival and is nothing to do with Americans, from day one.

Actually American involvement in Afghanistan helped Pakistan, because due to American involvement Pakistan got into this ‘war of survival against Kharjees’ earlier, but regardless, this war against Kharjees was always there and may have happened when Kharjees would have got stronger.

Same way … propaganda is that most Pakistanis are against drones ... but fact is that, Pakistanis who are not Kharjees, Kharjee supporters or under the influence of Kharjee propaganda, support drones.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

It is very logical muqawwee uncle. While in an ideal world, no bombing would be ideal, but we are in reality and I know that I would prefer the low level drone firings compared to mortar or be at the mercy of artillery fire. There is a reason armies use artilleries or why soviets bombarded berlin with it in 1945. Btw, don't we have any other options as this haqqani network is causing a lot of grief to Pakistan either directly by drones or by aiding or allowing other TTP factions to sit there indirectly. I am now starting to wish that we flush them out and just mine the whole f(@kin area. If afghans protest then shell them to oblivion. Afghanistan would never amount to much anyway for any central Asian trade as tribalism reigns supreme there, so we can make more money by simply linking up with china and limited trade with india.

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

I just don't want to indulge in this good for nothing debate again. I was just concerned about calling 20 persons a surprising number of Pakistanis. Have a good day and enjoy debating :)

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Interesting that 90% Greeks are kharjee terrorists, 3 in 4 of Japanese are Taliban sympathizers and so are half the Brits.

(U.S. Use of Drones, Under New Scrutiny, Has Been Widely Opposed Abroad | Pew Research Center)

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Drones banzai

Re: A surprising number of Pakistanis are in favour of drone strikes

Unfortunately i belong to N.waziristan, majority of people are against drone strikes , however, they do prefer drones if opted with drones strikes and Pakistan Military operations, as the second is really devastating, have seen personally.

This survey : have very coarse ground as their evidence for some point, media and other operatives have very very weak access in Waziristan to public, strongly monitored by local authorities/intelligence agencies.

Quoting one eye witnessed evidence regarding drone strikes may help in understanding the scenario, I was in my hometown previous year during Eid ul Azha, when a drone strike was made killing an Old lady with her two 7 to 8 years grand kids including a cow in their grass field.
This news was covered as Three militants, three cows killed in US drone strike in N Waziristan – The Express Tribune
Why should i lie? , but, it is truth that they were an Old lady with her two grandchildren, i personally knew them.

What else can i say about this news, news like this and the people who promote such kind of things or become part of spreading false news and supporting those who are killing innocent people.

Drone Strike threads - Merged!

You know its pretty interesting that there is this misconception that drone strikes are good. The general Pakistani populace hates them. The government doesn't like them. Hell even Malala thinks they are bad and they fuel terrorism.

I am just wondering why the ever so small minority thinks that for some random reason they are a good and that Pakistanis don't hate the very notion of them. Nobody in Pakistan including Malala think they are a good idea. So why do you? (That is if you do)