Dr. Allamah Muhammad Iqbal said:Let these madrassahs be in this very condition; let the children of poor Muslims read in these madressahs. Should these mullas and Dervishes be not there, do you know what will happen? Whatever will happen I have come after seeing with mine own eyes. If the Muslims of India are deprived of the influence of these madressahs, it will happen exactly like it happened in Andalusia (Spain) after eight hundred years of Muslim rule there. Today, except the relics of the ruins of Grenada and Cordoba and Al-Hamra, no trace is found there of the followers of Islam, and the Islamic civilisation. In India, too, save the Taj Mahal and the Red Fort of Delhi, no trace of the Muslims’ 800-year rule and their civilisation will be available.1984/1405 edition of a South African Muslim journal called “Awake to the Call of Islam!”
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Madrassa is a four letter word for todays "mod" muslims. They will be here soon to let you know how wrong you are and how we should destroy all of them.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Nothing wrong with living in a world of dreams.:D
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
I wonder whtether he worte that before or after being branded Kafir by Mullahs.
Here is an article by Iqbal’s son on Iqbal’s thoughts about Islamic Fiqh:
"Another important issue for Iqbal was the reconstruction of Islamic Law (fiqh). This, he argued, was only possible through ijtihad (juridical conclusion). But because of the traditional conservatism of the Muslim world, and particularly that of the Indian ulema, this had become a fraught and sensitive issue. Iqbal had already been dubbed a blasphemer (kafir) by some people for airing his views on the subject. However, he wanted to continue his investigation and research for a new methodology of ijtihad which was in accordance with the demands and requirements of the changed times.
In his lectures, Iqbal argued for the study for theology in the light of modern scienti-fic thought, so as to strengthen the faith of believers. Mullahs may term such Muslims “westernised” but Iqbal was clearly unimpressed by the conservative rhetoric.
Furthermore, Iqbal desired to reconstruct Islamic law or Shariah according to the needs and requirements of modern times. Only religious obligations or ibaadat, he argued, were beyond the law of change since they constituted the rights of God. But mundane or worldly matters (muamalaat) relate to the rights of the people and are subject to change and modification. Indeed, it was ne-cessary to modify these rights through a continuous process of ijtihad so as to meet the requirements of changing times. His advice was unequivocal: Muslims should not let themselves be exploited by the semi-literate Mullah. Iqbal encouraged Muslims to engage with serious writings rather than waste time on outmoded political and cultural matters and sensational press releases. "
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
You're quoting something that was written some time ago. Do you think it applies to today's madrassas?
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Words of Javed Iqbal holds no value, the guy who declared alcohol to be halal, and said that no where in the Quran is says that alcohol is haram. This is laughable, who would take a person like him seriously.
And can you tell me who branded Iqbal to a kafir? As I have already mentioned that Iqbal was very close to the Mullah you people hate.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
You're quoting something that was written some time ago. Do you think it applies to today's madrassas?
How long has it passed? 50, 60, 70 years. There is not a big difference between the Madrassas of today from his time.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
How long has it passed? 50, 60, 70 years. There is not a big difference between the Madrassas of today from his time.
There is a huge difference with pre afghan war madrassahs and post afgan war madrassahs. Huge difference.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
There is a huge difference with pre afghan war madrassahs and post afgan war madrassahs. Huge difference.
Same Madrassahs.
Same books.
Same way of teaching.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Same Madrassahs. Same books. Same way of teaching.
No, around 1999 these wahabis started coming to Pakistan and they had a great impact on the madrassas. You might have the same books (which I kind of doubt) but the style of teaching isn't the same anymore. They now have gone more into fanaticism and stuff...
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Where did you read this fairy tale? :halo:
What Wahabbis, can you please name them?
What does Wahabbi mean?
So what did they do after 1999?
And you are talking of experience? Did you visit these madrassas before 1999 and after 1999. Or was it just 9/11 that made you say this?
Peopleinvloved in 9/11, did they have anything to do with these madrassas? How many of those attended these madrassas?
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Words of Javed Iqbal holds no value, the guy who declared alcohol to be halal, and said that no where in the Quran is says that alcohol is haram. This is laughable, who would take a person like him seriously.
And can you tell me who branded Iqbal to a kafir? As I have already mentioned that Iqbal was very close to the Mullah you people hate.
I have read in many books that contemporary Mullahs were not happy when Iqbal wrote Shikwa. The article I sighted is from his own son who is well known and respected. I beleive it what he wrote as it also matches with other books. You seem to brand people unbelievers and liars based on their real or imaginary beliefs about irrelvant matters. I don't know exactly which Mullah or which Madarasa issued a fatwa against Iqbal. It is a favourite hobby of Mullahs to brand all and sundry Kafirs, Mulhids, etc. No surprises there.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
Wahabi = Salafi, and it was before 1999. 80’s, late 70’s is when they started gaining power due to Saudi and CIA funds and arms. And their harkats are well documented by newspapers and people who lived through the afghan jihadi era. This is not some hidden mystery, everybody who lived in Pakistan during that time knows it. Where do you think these Taliban came from all of a sudden? Had they been sitting in Ludhianvi’s lap all this time?
And from my personal experience, I have talked to these mullahs, and their students and all of them are brainwashed and full of hate for anyone who disagrees with them (i.e. anyone not of salafi/deobandi leanings). One of them told me completely serious that the Taliban have killed 20,000 American soldiers and will soon take over all of Afghanistan and Iran. This was 2002. I could not reason with him, so I left him in his ignorance.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
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I have read in many books that contemporary Mullahs were not happy when Iqbal wrote Shikwa.
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Since you have read it in many books, can you name those books. The Mullahs you are referring to, they have nothing but praise for Dr. Muhammed Iqbal and vice versa. Iqbal is highly respected figure in religious circles. So let see who those books were written by, most likely modernists and Mullah bashers?
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The article I sighted is from his own son who is well known and respected.
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His son is notorious and if Iqbal was alive today, he would have probably dis-owned his son. Read books by people like Ijaz ul Haq, he is very famous biographer of Dr. Iqbal. He talks about relation of Iqbal with Ulemas. The name of the book is "Iqbal and Ulame Pak-o-Hind". There is another book written by Dr. Ghulam Hussain Zulfiqar called, "Iqbal ka Zahni Iftiqa" and it also talks about what was Iqbals views/relations with Ulema.
Also refer to "Iqbal Naama", and that book if full with Iqbals praise for the past and scholars of his time.
Should be enough for now.
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You seem to brand people unbelievers and liars based on their real or imaginary beliefs about irrelvant matters.
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I dont. If anyone denies the ayats of the Quran and Mutawatir hadees, then according to Ijma of Ummat, he is outside the fold of Islam.
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I don't know exactly which Mullah or which Madarasa issued a fatwa against Iqbal. It is a favourite hobby of Mullahs to brand all and sundry Kafirs, Mulhids, etc. No surprises there.
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Until now you have not been able to provide any real proofs, but just hear-say.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
I dont. If anyone denies the ayats of the Quran and Mutawatir hadees, then according to Ijma of Ummat, he is outside the fold of Islam.
What should one think of someone who considers Quran inferior to any other text? What fold of Islam does that person belong to?
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
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Wahabi = Salafi, and it was before 1999. 80's, late 70's is when they started gaining power due to Saudi and CIA funds and arms.
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First of all majority of Pakistanis are Hanafis and not Salafis. And as far as Wahabbis, they are Hanbali in fiqh. People fighting in Afghanistan, most were Pakistani and Afghan and their Muslim brothers from all over the world helped them. And what is wrong with getting arms from CIA? You can alliance with a non-Muslim to fight another non-Muslim enemy, as even you can find it in the life of Prophet s.a.w.
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And their harkats are well documented by newspapers and people who lived through the afghan jihadi era.
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What harkats? You are not talking about who was responsible for breaking Pakistan? Was it Mullahs or people graduated from Secular Institutuions.Who looted Pakistan? Are Benazir Bhutto, Nawaz Sharrif, etc are Mullahs?
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This is not some hidden mystery, everybody who lived in Pakistan during that time knows it. Where do you think these Taliban came from all of a sudden? Had they been sitting in Ludhianvi's lap all this time
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Taliban were people of Afghanistan, and most of them took part in Afghan-Soviet Jihad, but when they saw that things are getting out of control they decided to take over and fix the things.
How did Taliban start?
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]Taliban legend has it that in the spring of 1994, upon hearing of the abduction and rape of two girls at a Mujahidin checkpoint in the village of Sang Hesar near Kandahar, local Mullah Omar, a veteran of the Harakat-i Inqilab-i Islami faction of the Mujahidin, gathered thirty other Taliban into a fighting force, rescued the girls and hanged the commander of the Mujahideen. After this incident, Taliban legend goes, the services of these pious religious fighters were in much demand from villagers plagued by unruly Mujahidin, and thus the Taliban were born
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Anyways stick to the topic.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
What should one think of someone who considers Quran inferior to any other text? What fold of Islam does that person belong to?
What can I say about a person who cant understand something as simple as that. About a person who is implying that Prophet s.a.w, Sahabas and scholars of the past were all wrong and you are right.
Maybe you sould go back and read that thread atleast 10 times since you wont be able to comprehend it just by reading it once.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
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And from my personal experience, I have talked to these mullahs, and their students and all of them are brainwashed and full of hate for anyone who disagrees with them
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And I can see you are brainwashed by CNN, Fox News, Secular Ideas, Mullah-bashers and full of hate for anyone wit different views.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
You missed the point of my post. The madrassahs of today that produced Taliban are not the same as the madrassahs of Iqbal's time.
We can discus the details some other time, but the Taliban, as the name suggests were students of madrassahs. Tell me why they came out after the soviet invasion and subsequent events in Afghanistan and not before? Where were they during the independence struggle of Pakistan? Or even during 1971 war, or the rule of Najib in Afghanistan?
The received training, funding from CIA/ISI and moral and religious support and influence from Saudi Salafis. That has changed the face of the madrassah in Pakistan forever.
Re: Dr. Iqbal on Madrassas
And I can see you are brainwashed by CNN, Fox News, Secular Ideas, Mullah-bashers and full of hate for anyone wit different views.
No substance in your arguments once again. By your jihadi friends fantasy world, American should be ruled by Taliban by now. Maybe this is true and the kafir media is hiding it from us? After all there is no Taliban news service based in America.